How high do you fly
Join Date: Jan 2003
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Kengineer-130,
As above.
Take Summer for example, and you're navigating VFR. Assuming no or little cloud cover below you, the higher you are, the closer the ground resembles the map in your hand. Just have to be careful you don't call 'overhead' somewhere just because it's disappeared below the nose or the wing, because it could still be 5 miles away!
As you descend towards circa 1,000', the countryside starts coming up to meet you to the point of starting to distort what you see relative to your map. Contours are more noticeable.
And down towards 500', mid-summer, it can just become one big blur of green, yellow, brown and bumble bees flying through the air vents
p.s. This may not apply in Wales, Scotland or the Peak/Lake districts!!!
As above.
Take Summer for example, and you're navigating VFR. Assuming no or little cloud cover below you, the higher you are, the closer the ground resembles the map in your hand. Just have to be careful you don't call 'overhead' somewhere just because it's disappeared below the nose or the wing, because it could still be 5 miles away!
As you descend towards circa 1,000', the countryside starts coming up to meet you to the point of starting to distort what you see relative to your map. Contours are more noticeable.
And down towards 500', mid-summer, it can just become one big blur of green, yellow, brown and bumble bees flying through the air vents
p.s. This may not apply in Wales, Scotland or the Peak/Lake districts!!!
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Under the Schiphol TMA, 1000'-1200' MSL (which is actually a few feet more AGL). En-route cruise outside that, typically 3000-3500' or so. Over water, as high as possible - which is FL45-FL65 or thereabouts over the Channel/North Sea. Aerobatics, typically a block between 3000' and FL55, lower when practicing for a competition.
LVNL (the Dutch NATS) advises us not to do that consistently. Around here they vector traffic for final approach at 2000' (Schiphol TMA starts at 1500') and wake turbulence is known to descend up to 700'. So their advice is to stay 200-300' under the base of CAS. Makes sense, also from the CAS bust point of view.
if C starts at 2500 i am at 2499.
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As a low hour PPL, with the majority of flights being local flights in the south east UK, most of my flights have been between 1000' and 3000'. If on a cross country then I try to get as high as possible. But I'm yet to go above FL50.
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My passenger was a 17 year old lad from St. Pete to the Florida Panhandle; he had helped me move a boat and I had promised him a flight home. He was, already, a heavy smoker.....
Approaching a military air station, the enroute controller asked if we could please climb to 11,000. I replied no problem. Informed my lad that the military controller had asked us to climb up rather high, and that I would be OK, but that as he was a smoker, he might have a bit of a problem, and to let me know if his fingernails began to turn blue.
He spent the rest of the flight nervously examining his nails......
Approaching a military air station, the enroute controller asked if we could please climb to 11,000. I replied no problem. Informed my lad that the military controller had asked us to climb up rather high, and that I would be OK, but that as he was a smoker, he might have a bit of a problem, and to let me know if his fingernails began to turn blue.
He spent the rest of the flight nervously examining his nails......
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Completely the opposite. The higher you are, the easier it is to navigate
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I fly as high as is necessary. Which is a cop out somewhat. But... if the temperature means not flying to cloud then cloud base is a high as I can go. If its a clear day then CAS may be preventative. If a straight 100nm leg could be flown at 1500ft but would involve dodging airspace, gliding sites, numerous frequency changes and whatever, but FL40 misses everything then that's more conducive to the overall flow and comfort of the trip.
That said, if on a local muck about, aircraft service ceiling is the aim if possible (but never needed to get there yet), and likewise a safe 500ft MSD scud running jaunt is never out of the question.
I think its good to explore many altitudes including the very high and the very low as it adds something to confidence and expands the comfort zone, because one day it may be called for by the traffic situation, pilot concerns, or ATC.
That said, if on a local muck about, aircraft service ceiling is the aim if possible (but never needed to get there yet), and likewise a safe 500ft MSD scud running jaunt is never out of the question.
I think its good to explore many altitudes including the very high and the very low as it adds something to confidence and expands the comfort zone, because one day it may be called for by the traffic situation, pilot concerns, or ATC.
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FL100-FL120 preferred, this is a very efficient altitude for our plane. We do have (portable) oxygen to go higher, but rarely need to.
Strong winds, clouds, CAS and routing restrictions might interfere.
Someday (after getting oxygen masks instead of cannulas) we're going to try getting up to the plane's ceiling, just for the fun of having checked that she can really get there, which is pretty high for a non-turbo.
Last summer, I did a flight at low altitude (between 600-750') in marginal weather (between 2-4 miles vis and rain) over unfamiliar ground.... this would have been extremely uncomfortable at our usual economic cruise speed, let alone at 75%... so instead of pretending to be a fighter on a strafing run I throttled way back and lowered the wheels and pretended to be a microlight, not comfortable either but a lot safer. The slower you are the lower you can still navigate safely in less than ideal weather circumstances.
Strong winds, clouds, CAS and routing restrictions might interfere.
Someday (after getting oxygen masks instead of cannulas) we're going to try getting up to the plane's ceiling, just for the fun of having checked that she can really get there, which is pretty high for a non-turbo.
Last summer, I did a flight at low altitude (between 600-750') in marginal weather (between 2-4 miles vis and rain) over unfamiliar ground.... this would have been extremely uncomfortable at our usual economic cruise speed, let alone at 75%... so instead of pretending to be a fighter on a strafing run I throttled way back and lowered the wheels and pretended to be a microlight, not comfortable either but a lot safer. The slower you are the lower you can still navigate safely in less than ideal weather circumstances.
Only possible answer is "it all depends". The only absolute rule is to fly higher than the terrain. (Though I admit the first time ATC asked me if I had "terrain in sight" I started anxiously checking all the railway tracks in view).
For local puttering about I generally fly around 2-4000 feet. For typical xc flying I like to be around 7-10000 - gives me plenty of room if the fan stops, and a bit more TAS.I'll go higher or lower because of winds. I've flown up at FL200 a couple of times on very long flights to take advantage of winds.
Of course it all depends on airspace, too. Flying around San Francisco, I generally stay below 1500 so I can avoid talking to Norcal. (Why I would I want to do that? - because SFO tower will often give you a transition when you ask them directly, even though Norcal is refusing them).
In the heli I normally fly 1000-1500 AGL. Altitude is not really on your side, and it keeps you out of the way of the fixed wing stuff. And the view is wonderful.
For local puttering about I generally fly around 2-4000 feet. For typical xc flying I like to be around 7-10000 - gives me plenty of room if the fan stops, and a bit more TAS.I'll go higher or lower because of winds. I've flown up at FL200 a couple of times on very long flights to take advantage of winds.
Of course it all depends on airspace, too. Flying around San Francisco, I generally stay below 1500 so I can avoid talking to Norcal. (Why I would I want to do that? - because SFO tower will often give you a transition when you ask them directly, even though Norcal is refusing them).
In the heli I normally fly 1000-1500 AGL. Altitude is not really on your side, and it keeps you out of the way of the fixed wing stuff. And the view is wonderful.
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Of course it all depends on airspace, too. Flying around San Francisco, I generally stay below 1500 so I can avoid talking to Norcal. (Why I would I want to do that? - because SFO tower will often give you a transition when you ask them directly, even though Norcal is refusing them).
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...Pace - Ref suspected icing at 9000' over Sth of France- No there was virtually no cloud - Weather very hot but cannot recall the outside temp. - but as implied any signs of icing evaporated as we commenced the descent . This was many years ago - flying days now over regretfully.
Mary - on the chute drop. - I can recall a conversation from a young ex parachute regt colleague in the days when they had just the one chute (no second chute) when discussing para regt training - in which he too confirmed that his worst odeal was the very first jump that had to be made from a cage atached to a tethered balloon at about 400-600 feet.
...
Mary - on the chute drop. - I can recall a conversation from a young ex parachute regt colleague in the days when they had just the one chute (no second chute) when discussing para regt training - in which he too confirmed that his worst odeal was the very first jump that had to be made from a cage atached to a tethered balloon at about 400-600 feet.
...
Generally wind the velocity is greater with altitude so when flying downwind flying higher will be quicker and potentially more economical. Going downwind lower is better if you can tolerate the turbulence! The wind forecasts give an idea, for each day, on the amount of shear.
I'm sure a more numerate person than me can work out how far one needs to be cruising downwind before the the cost of extra time (fuel) in the climb is outweighed by savings in the cruise given appropriate assumptions.
I'm sure a more numerate person than me can work out how far one needs to be cruising downwind before the the cost of extra time (fuel) in the climb is outweighed by savings in the cruise given appropriate assumptions.
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Sometimes airspace transits are easier at altitude. Coming back from North Wales a while back at about 9k, in nice smooth air and sunshine above the layer of broken cumulus, (with everyone else squashed down below) Cardiff asked how I wanted to route, so I asked for a Transit and was cleared straight across Cardiff, Bristol and the airways in between, without having to ask for each bit specifically which was nice.
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Yesterday I was determined to get to at least 6000' to cross the Wash from north Norfolk to Skegness, but the weather got in the way. I got above what turned out to be a unbroken layer of stratus lying right across my path. I knew it was clear the other side as I could see Mablethorpe in the sunshine, but I really could not convince my self that I was going to be "in sight of the surface" holding a heading above the cloud, even though it was very beautiful up there, with the wings kissing the tops of the clouds. As it was I had to descend through a hole and run across in grey flat light at 3000'. What I did not like was the stonking headwind which made the crossing seem to last for ever. Mind you, on the way back I shot across like a cork out of a bottle!!
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tggzz. were you alone in the K13 or was there an instructor in the back seat when you entered your spin from 1,200 feet? I presume you recovered, otherwise we are having a report from the other side......