Protecting one's bonce
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Protecting one's bonce
I've been looking into finding a headset for a high-noise environment. Spending a bit of time on the search function revealed that a good number of pilots speak well of the Clarity Aloft. I did see a post though that claimed it doesn't protect your hearing because it doesn't shield the bones around the ear. I have no clue whether that would be the case but an alternative solution would be a helmet of some sort to clamp a standard headset tighter on my head. The Clarity Aloft claims to be better than an ANR headset, but would it be better than a PNR or ANR headset in a helmet? Anybody use a PNR headset with a leather or proper helmet? Or does everyone use ANR in their helmets?
When it comes to helmets for the sake of protecting your bonce, is it really worth it? The helicopter style helmets I see people using don't look like they are going to provide much protection. If you are able to smack your head on the instrument panel for example, those helmets don't look like they will help you much. Am I missing something? Some of the helmets I've seen are ridiculously expensive. Anyone know where I might find cheapish ones? Is there a place to buy surplus or ex-RAF stuff? (since they are getting cut-back presumably they have to off-load their gear somewhere?)
Thanks.
When it comes to helmets for the sake of protecting your bonce, is it really worth it? The helicopter style helmets I see people using don't look like they are going to provide much protection. If you are able to smack your head on the instrument panel for example, those helmets don't look like they will help you much. Am I missing something? Some of the helmets I've seen are ridiculously expensive. Anyone know where I might find cheapish ones? Is there a place to buy surplus or ex-RAF stuff? (since they are getting cut-back presumably they have to off-load their gear somewhere?)
Thanks.
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love my Clarity Aloft but they are v fragile (oh - they have broken again!). Currentky flying with a Mk 10 RAF Aircrew helmet (Alpha aviation) - works well but dont have the clarity of my Clarity's.
Rarely use the visors but then I don't wear sunglasses too often.
HTH
Stik
Rarely use the visors but then I don't wear sunglasses too often.
HTH
Stik
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Communications & Ear Protection, Inc.
For those who prefer clarity when aloft but who prefer a lid to hopefully keep the bits that belong in the bonce where they belong, and bits that don't belong there out of it, should you be required to slam your noggin violently around the cockpit.
Far more effective than ANR in truly high-noise environments, and for a laughably small amount of dosh.
I must confess to being without my CEP earpieces at the moment, having lent them to a mate who lost the previous pair I lent him, when the CEP-equipped Russian helmet he was wearing fell over the side of his rice-burning Yak-imitation when he decided to stick his head out on landing without checking the chin-strap was done up. Naming no names....Bob.
For those who prefer clarity when aloft but who prefer a lid to hopefully keep the bits that belong in the bonce where they belong, and bits that don't belong there out of it, should you be required to slam your noggin violently around the cockpit.
Far more effective than ANR in truly high-noise environments, and for a laughably small amount of dosh.
I must confess to being without my CEP earpieces at the moment, having lent them to a mate who lost the previous pair I lent him, when the CEP-equipped Russian helmet he was wearing fell over the side of his rice-burning Yak-imitation when he decided to stick his head out on landing without checking the chin-strap was done up. Naming no names....Bob.
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Be very careful with helmets. Speaking from a motorsport perspective, you need the entire safety package to be compatible before a safety measure is really safe - this includes cabin layout, belts, seats, etc
Even then, and accident is so chaotic that it's difficult to be sure any isolated safety measure will make things better or worse. For instance, the mass of a helmet could kill you through neck injuries or simply because it causes you to hit the panel when you might not have otherwise.
Of course a helmet could also save your life, 100%, but just don't be sure it's a completely clean cut decision.
Generally, a well fitting, extremely light, full-face helmet will be better in most situations (especially if you don't have a full harness). But very few of us are going to fly around looking like the stig! (apologies to the non-Brits who may need to google "the stig"!)
Even then, and accident is so chaotic that it's difficult to be sure any isolated safety measure will make things better or worse. For instance, the mass of a helmet could kill you through neck injuries or simply because it causes you to hit the panel when you might not have otherwise.
Of course a helmet could also save your life, 100%, but just don't be sure it's a completely clean cut decision.
Generally, a well fitting, extremely light, full-face helmet will be better in most situations (especially if you don't have a full harness). But very few of us are going to fly around looking like the stig! (apologies to the non-Brits who may need to google "the stig"!)
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I did see a post though that claimed it doesn't protect your hearing because it doesn't shield the bones around the ear.
I fly mainly aerobatic and open cockpit aeroplanes where the ANR headsets according to quite a few posts seem unable to cope. I have been riding motorcycles for twenty years and always found that good earplugs are a must and work very well. A helmet would work but I don't like the extra weight during aerobatics.
So, would the combination of a Clarity Aloft and a cloth helmet with a disconnected headset or even earmuffs from the DIY store work and offer the best protection for this sort of flying? Has anyone tried this setup? Is there a reason this would not work?
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I have a US Gentex helmet, with the optional earplugs. It is very light and the earplugs give excellent audio quality - they use the same ear buds as the Clarity Aloft system. Very little external noise gets through.
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Well it sounds like the best possible protection is the CEP system in a helmet. That way you get a lid plus sealed ear cups plus in-ear plugs. Looking at the CEP link though it looks like the CEP plugs in on the outside of the lid and then presumably the cable goes to the plug in your ear. Doesn't this then mean that the cable goes between the ear cup seal in the lid and your head? Is that not a bit of an issue?
We're probably not going to find a specialist to answer this on pprune but I wonder if a letter to a well known flying mag or two might get them to research an article on it? As stik has pointed out though that his set keeps breaking, that puts me off somewhat!
Where did you get it? The really long helmet thread linked above has links to US suppliers but none in the UK that I can see. Headset Services in Shoreham is the only supplier that gets much mention and not in a positive way. Anyone know how much a PNR Alpha costs from them? There's no price on their website.
Has anyone found a more or less definitive answer to this question? I searched for "bone conduction" but found no clear cut answer to whether this is a problem in light aircraft. At the airfield the other day I heard someone else mention this as a problem with the Clarity's too.
I have a US Gentex helmet
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I find the best combination is the Clarity Aloft worn with a skydiving helmet that doesn't cover the ears.
It is cooler in hot weather and you can put the helmet on after the headset.
No idea about head protection but I have assumed that skydiving helmets should be quite good. In an accident I think you are most likely to be thrown forward so protecting the forehead is important.
Clarity Alofts are quite fragile as you have to remove the earpieces by pulling on the wires. Eventually they break. Fortunately CA are quite reasonable about warrantee claims and repairing them.
It is cooler in hot weather and you can put the helmet on after the headset.
No idea about head protection but I have assumed that skydiving helmets should be quite good. In an accident I think you are most likely to be thrown forward so protecting the forehead is important.
Clarity Alofts are quite fragile as you have to remove the earpieces by pulling on the wires. Eventually they break. Fortunately CA are quite reasonable about warrantee claims and repairing them.
) never had a problem with them
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with a skydiving helmet that doesn't cover the ears.
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In an accident I think you are most likely to be thrown forward so protecting the forehead is important.
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Problem is; If you protect your forehead with extra mass (eg. a helmet), your head will be thrown further forward in the same accident, and so will be more likely to impact the panel / sun visor, possibly on an unprotected area, like the face. Making the sun visor more padded would be a better solution in most cases.
Large HGU/55P (Kevlar) + Oregon Aero Innards + CEP = 1128g
Weight of the average human head ~4500g
By my math, the total increased mass of head plus headgear increases by about 8% (depending on the size of your noggin) for taking the added protection afforded by the Gentex. Factor in not just the protection against a simple forward impact (for example when you jump over the side, slamming your head against parts of the airframe and, in due course, the ground) then it becomes a....er...no-brainer.
I know a chap who made a precautionary landing into a field in an Extra 300 a while back. His head (thankfully in a helmet) removed the throttle lever, amongst other things. By your logic, you would need to fill the cockpit entirely with foam rubber, rather than opt for the headgear.
But the decision is a personal one - but having some solid numbers to work on helps.
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eharding,
Absolutely, your logic stacks up, and as you say it's a personal decision. I just wanted to make sure people didn't think it was as simple as "put on a helmet and I'm safer".
Absolutely, your logic stacks up, and as you say it's a personal decision. I just wanted to make sure people didn't think it was as simple as "put on a helmet and I'm safer".
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Headset Services charge £1400 + VAT for the Alpha 900 without ANR, and the lead time is 10-12 weeks! The US supplier of Gentex do the HGU55/E with CEP for about £1000 but they don't ship internationally. Anyone know if I could order one shipped to the US and then export it to the UK? I saw something about export papers in that long thread. Would this still be the case for private shipping? Where would I find out about this?
I'd rather not spend quite that much, but I'm sure I would feel differently if I did have a serious accident.
I'd rather not spend quite that much, but I'm sure I would feel differently if I did have a serious accident.
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Regarding the Gentex, you could just phone FlightSuits in the US and ask them what the current export situation is. They did make and ship my custom-fit HGU55, but that was a few years ago now (and there was export hassle even back then).
I'd forgotten about the Peltor helmet solution suggested in the thread that motivated me to get out the kitchen scales:
http://www.pprune.org/private-flying...erobatics.html
Certainly worth giving Peltor a ring.
I'd forgotten about the Peltor helmet solution suggested in the thread that motivated me to get out the kitchen scales:
http://www.pprune.org/private-flying...erobatics.html
Certainly worth giving Peltor a ring.
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I bought my Gentex last year from here:-
Flight Helmets - Flight Suits - Aviation Helmets
AKA Government Sales Inc
Very good service, a good choice of colours and very helpful.
They made all the shipping arrangements - all I had to do was pay the VAT and duty. The cost was $1,080 including bag, two visors, CEP kit and shipping, but not including VAT and Duty - can't remember how much that was. The total was less than £1,000 though
The CEP wires are very thin and do not have any effect on the earcup seal.
Flight Helmets - Flight Suits - Aviation Helmets
AKA Government Sales Inc
Very good service, a good choice of colours and very helpful.
They made all the shipping arrangements - all I had to do was pay the VAT and duty. The cost was $1,080 including bag, two visors, CEP kit and shipping, but not including VAT and Duty - can't remember how much that was. The total was less than £1,000 though
The CEP wires are very thin and do not have any effect on the earcup seal.
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Thanks for the Mention JAFO, the Flight Caps are a popular choice for the non-aerobatic aviator and look like a normal Baseball cap, so you don't have to paint 'Maverick' on the side of your C152/PA28
They are particularly popular amongst the Rag 'n' Tube pilots as there tends to be a few protuding 'annoyances' to bang your bonce on both getting in and out of the aircraft as well as bouncing around on a turbulent day
Of course there are the Forrest Gump moments when I am glad of the protection, like closing the Canopy on the Rallye when I forget to duck...in fact one customer bought one purely for when he gets his Glider out of its trailor, so it is not just me!
They are particularly popular amongst the Rag 'n' Tube pilots as there tends to be a few protuding 'annoyances' to bang your bonce on both getting in and out of the aircraft as well as bouncing around on a turbulent day
Of course there are the Forrest Gump moments when I am glad of the protection, like closing the Canopy on the Rallye when I forget to duck...in fact one customer bought one purely for when he gets his Glider out of its trailor, so it is not just me!
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The CEP website also shows an in-ear conversion for the David Clark Headset. This might be a 'good enough' option if a helmet seems perhaps overkill. Has anyone got experience with this conversion?
What bits tend to break?
love my Clarity Aloft but they are v fragile (oh - they have broken again!)