Navigation Exam
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Bearing in mind that the exams are only valid for 18months, why do them early when they are just a theoretical load of unintelligable nonsense that you will forget when it is time to NEED it? (after you have the PPL & you are lost somewhere).
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Actually, the exams are valid for licence issue for 2 years, you have to pass them all within an 18 month window (approximately).
An applicant shall be deemed to have successfully completed the
theoretical examinations for the JAR-FCL PPL(A) when awarded a pass in all of the ... examinations within a period of 18 months counted from the end of the calendar month when the applicant first attempted the examination. A pass will be accepted for the grant of a JAR-FCL PPL(A) during the 24 months from the date of successfully completing all of the theoretical knowledge examinations.
theoretical examinations for the JAR-FCL PPL(A) when awarded a pass in all of the ... examinations within a period of 18 months counted from the end of the calendar month when the applicant first attempted the examination. A pass will be accepted for the grant of a JAR-FCL PPL(A) during the 24 months from the date of successfully completing all of the theoretical knowledge examinations.
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Actually, the exams are valid for licence issue for 2 years, you have to pass them all within an 18 month window (approximately).
Quote:
An applicant shall be deemed to have successfully completed the
theoretical examinations for the JAR-FCL PPL(A) when awarded a pass in all of the ... examinations within a period of 18 months counted from the end of the calendar month when the applicant first attempted the examination. A pass will be accepted for the grant of a JAR-FCL PPL(A) during the 24 months from the date of successfully completing all of the theoretical knowledge examinations.
Quote:
An applicant shall be deemed to have successfully completed the
theoretical examinations for the JAR-FCL PPL(A) when awarded a pass in all of the ... examinations within a period of 18 months counted from the end of the calendar month when the applicant first attempted the examination. A pass will be accepted for the grant of a JAR-FCL PPL(A) during the 24 months from the date of successfully completing all of the theoretical knowledge examinations.
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Hey all.
Just back from the airport. I did my comms exam and passed with 100%.
And after taking your advice got a ground school on the Nav exam. When someone teaches you it isnt so bad after all is it.
So i'll get plenty of practice in tonight and then sit it on Friday.
One piece of advice if i could ask though.
After I sit Nav Friday i will have completed all 7 ground school exams. As i have said previous my inital plan is to then go the states next summer and finish my flight training there and take advantage of their weather.
However i was thinking of getting my RT licence this summer but my CFI reckons i'd be best wait until i come back from US as i will have picked up bad habits and he'll knock them out of me.
What do you guys think i should do?
Just back from the airport. I did my comms exam and passed with 100%.
And after taking your advice got a ground school on the Nav exam. When someone teaches you it isnt so bad after all is it.
So i'll get plenty of practice in tonight and then sit it on Friday.
One piece of advice if i could ask though.
After I sit Nav Friday i will have completed all 7 ground school exams. As i have said previous my inital plan is to then go the states next summer and finish my flight training there and take advantage of their weather.
However i was thinking of getting my RT licence this summer but my CFI reckons i'd be best wait until i come back from US as i will have picked up bad habits and he'll knock them out of me.
What do you guys think i should do?
Incidentally, by "Don't waste your time being taught bad habits in the USandA!", I meant don't go to some wretched JAA PPL puppy farm. If you do go to the US, find a good FAA flight training school and take your training there.
SoCal App, unfortunately the pace of many US-based JAA PPL puppy farms is such that they don't include any ground instruction for the exams, or even allocate any time to sit them. Cheating in the exams has been known; even then, the exams are often marked by unqualified personnel....
But such practices will at least die out under EASA part-ATO.
SoCal App, unfortunately the pace of many US-based JAA PPL puppy farms is such that they don't include any ground instruction for the exams, or even allocate any time to sit them. Cheating in the exams has been known; even then, the exams are often marked by unqualified personnel....
But such practices will at least die out under EASA part-ATO.
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I have trained in the UK and in the USA.
Both can be variable, though my experience is that the UK is far more variable than the USA where the standards were very high indeed. A lot of stuff I saw here was absolutely atrocious.
But I know other pilots who reported lower standards in the USA.
You can, no doubt, find both examples, in both places.
As you can find across Europe; a big variation within the gold plated JAA-land...
BTW, while I have sympathy for the reasons for not sitting the exams in advance of flying, I don't think there is a clear cut case. A little while ago I "mentored" a very bright young lad. I went through the basics with him at our house, and we did some flights. He passed all his exams before even starting at a flying school, and I know he understood it just fine. But then he also had flying experience before he started training.
Both can be variable, though my experience is that the UK is far more variable than the USA where the standards were very high indeed. A lot of stuff I saw here was absolutely atrocious.
But I know other pilots who reported lower standards in the USA.
You can, no doubt, find both examples, in both places.
As you can find across Europe; a big variation within the gold plated JAA-land...
BTW, while I have sympathy for the reasons for not sitting the exams in advance of flying, I don't think there is a clear cut case. A little while ago I "mentored" a very bright young lad. I went through the basics with him at our house, and we did some flights. He passed all his exams before even starting at a flying school, and I know he understood it just fine. But then he also had flying experience before he started training.
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IO540,
Cheers for the input.
Well I have 20 hours behind me also, although all in the circuit. No Nav yet. So i felt at a good point to get the ground school exams out of the way this summer, if i had the cash i would have flew too but c'est la vie.
In the USA. Can you recommend a good JAA PPL School. I would also like to go for the FAA PPL too while i'm out there as i've seen many people recommend. Especially if its the case of an other check ride and exam.
Cheers for the input.
Well I have 20 hours behind me also, although all in the circuit. No Nav yet. So i felt at a good point to get the ground school exams out of the way this summer, if i had the cash i would have flew too but c'est la vie.
In the USA. Can you recommend a good JAA PPL School. I would also like to go for the FAA PPL too while i'm out there as i've seen many people recommend. Especially if its the case of an other check ride and exam.
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WILCO,
I think "hate" for the USA is a bit too strong, however if you do a bit of searching here, you will find many and varied opinions on learning to fly in the US. As IO says there are good, bad and mediocre, both in the US and Europe. A problem with any long-haul training is trying to find out which box your potential training provider fits into before committing to time-off work, flights, accommodation and possibly deposit or payment. Do plenty of research and talk to people who have been recently or are there at the moment.
I note in your last post you say you have 20 hours already, does this not make going to the States a less attractive proposition for you. The hourly rates are less, but this needs balanced against the costs of flights, accommodation, (car?) and living expenses. Over 45+ hours it will generally be cheaper, however if you're only going to be doing just over half of that, do the financials stack up for you? You should seriously consider staying local as you've already done so much, is there any solo in those 20, or all dual? As may have been said to you already, there is a definite benefit in training in the weather, airspace and systems in which you will subsequently fly as a PPL.
I think "hate" for the USA is a bit too strong, however if you do a bit of searching here, you will find many and varied opinions on learning to fly in the US. As IO says there are good, bad and mediocre, both in the US and Europe. A problem with any long-haul training is trying to find out which box your potential training provider fits into before committing to time-off work, flights, accommodation and possibly deposit or payment. Do plenty of research and talk to people who have been recently or are there at the moment.
I note in your last post you say you have 20 hours already, does this not make going to the States a less attractive proposition for you. The hourly rates are less, but this needs balanced against the costs of flights, accommodation, (car?) and living expenses. Over 45+ hours it will generally be cheaper, however if you're only going to be doing just over half of that, do the financials stack up for you? You should seriously consider staying local as you've already done so much, is there any solo in those 20, or all dual? As may have been said to you already, there is a definite benefit in training in the weather, airspace and systems in which you will subsequently fly as a PPL.
Agree entirely with SoCal App...
You sum up your attitude with...
It is not a question of just getting the exams "out of the way" - you clearly do not want to take to heart any previous comments, "so for that reason (you have Dragons' Den in Ireland), I am out."
2 s
Unbelievable. You really do not listen to folk do you? 
Do you honestly think that 1 single ground session with an Instructor is going to provide you with the level of knowledge required to pass, retain and execute that minimal experience in your future flying endeavours?
Do you honestly think that 1 single ground session with an Instructor is going to provide you with the level of knowledge required to pass, retain and execute that minimal experience in your future flying endeavours?
i felt at a good point to get the ground school exams out of the way this summer
2 s
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Hold on a minute. I have passed 6 exams with a 96% Average.
Why do yous feel i am still incompetent? It doesn't mean i will not stop learning, it means i won't have the CAA on my back getting them finished in a 18 month loop or God knows what will happen when EASA comes in.
I will have 7 ground school exams passed, to a high percentage, and now i am ready for the cockpit. Again.
You learn to fly in a cockpit, not out of a book.
Why do yous feel i am still incompetent? It doesn't mean i will not stop learning, it means i won't have the CAA on my back getting them finished in a 18 month loop or God knows what will happen when EASA comes in.
I will have 7 ground school exams passed, to a high percentage, and now i am ready for the cockpit. Again.
You learn to fly in a cockpit, not out of a book.
Last edited by WILCO.XMG; 11th Aug 2011 at 12:39.
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I kind of agree with wilco on this one.
If you struggle with your exams it will definitely help to wait and get some practical flying experience first, but if you find studying theory easy I don't see any issue in getting the silly exams out of the way.
I dont' think I would be a worse pilot even if I hadn't done any of the exams. To be able to fly I need to know the rules of the air, navigation, communication and met. This knowledge will not be there just because you passed the exams.
What says that wilco is not going to learn how to navigate after he has passed his nav exam? I still read books and articles about navigation 2 years after passing my nav exam.
If you struggle with your exams it will definitely help to wait and get some practical flying experience first, but if you find studying theory easy I don't see any issue in getting the silly exams out of the way.
I dont' think I would be a worse pilot even if I hadn't done any of the exams. To be able to fly I need to know the rules of the air, navigation, communication and met. This knowledge will not be there just because you passed the exams.
What says that wilco is not going to learn how to navigate after he has passed his nav exam? I still read books and articles about navigation 2 years after passing my nav exam.
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Went out and sat this exam this morning.
Scored 92%, answered one question in meters instead of feet and got confused with R Airspace. I thought the R was for restricted.
Anyway.
On to that cockpit.
Scored 92%, answered one question in meters instead of feet and got confused with R Airspace. I thought the R was for restricted.
Anyway.
On to that cockpit.
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Congratulations Wilco 
Having done 6 or so nav flights, I finally got around to doing my Nav exam yesterday and passed, despite doing it to the sound of automatic gunfire and various aircraft screaming overhead at Headcorn's "Combined Ops" show.
I argee with the OP that most of the book (Air Pilot's manual) is absolute tosh, seeming to go to excessive lengths to prove how clever the author is. The one-in-60 rule can be explained in a couple of sentences yet the book does a chapter of confusing rubbish on it. I'd got about a third of the way through the book in study then ground to a halt as it's so demotivating despite being reasonably proficient and genuinely interested in the material.
But having done around 10 genuine & practice plogs, knowing how to convert units & multiply/divide use the wheel, and reading the radio nav tech section (which again though completely overdoes explanation of RBI, QDM etc) was all I really needed in the end.
Airquiz.com was useful, but as always the PPL Perfector (make sure it's at least issue 2) was a highly accurate practice for the real exam if you know what I'm saying
.
Having done 6 or so nav flights, I finally got around to doing my Nav exam yesterday and passed, despite doing it to the sound of automatic gunfire and various aircraft screaming overhead at Headcorn's "Combined Ops" show.
I argee with the OP that most of the book (Air Pilot's manual) is absolute tosh, seeming to go to excessive lengths to prove how clever the author is. The one-in-60 rule can be explained in a couple of sentences yet the book does a chapter of confusing rubbish on it. I'd got about a third of the way through the book in study then ground to a halt as it's so demotivating despite being reasonably proficient and genuinely interested in the material.
But having done around 10 genuine & practice plogs, knowing how to convert units & multiply/divide use the wheel, and reading the radio nav tech section (which again though completely overdoes explanation of RBI, QDM etc) was all I really needed in the end.
Airquiz.com was useful, but as always the PPL Perfector (make sure it's at least issue 2) was a highly accurate practice for the real exam if you know what I'm saying
.
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I must say that if I was setting up a PPL school I would throw all the traditional books (Trevor Thom, etc) in the bin.
They make a huge meal out of simple topics.
The problem is that you have to train with "something", and also I think the CAA exams are based on specific concepts presented in the TT books.
They make a huge meal out of simple topics.
The problem is that you have to train with "something", and also I think the CAA exams are based on specific concepts presented in the TT books.
