Orbiting Grangemouth.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Scotland
Orbiting Grangemouth.
I watch a Cessna slowly orbit the Gas plant at Kinneil a lot of mornings at about 8am. I'm just curious if it is a member of PPRUNE and the reasons for the 3 or 4 orbits. He then heads off in the Edinburgh direction. I'd just like to mention as a caution that the high level flares can spout flames a couple of hundred feet up and the resulting turbulance it also creates. This happens without any warning in the event of plant upsets. I't may be an early morning pootle about in the still air and it makes me envious !!!
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,827
Likes: 7
From: Sometimes north, sometimes south
the high level flares can spout flames a couple of hundred feet up and the resulting turbulance it also creates
NS
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,555
Likes: 0
From: Banished (twice) to the pointless forest
Ahhhh Goood Evening PPRUNE.
"Would er, that have er, been the er, photographic er, Lima Papa by any chance? I just ask as, er, well, it would have, er, been er, taking photographs, and er, orbiting Grangemouth, and er, surrounding areas, er, to er, take photographs, of er, Grangemouth..... and the River Forth, er North of, er..... Falkirk and then round not quite as far as er, Kincardine Bridge and er the, er, Petrol refinery........ Lima Papa"
Or was it "Zulu Zulu request a few orbits west of Polmont vrp?"
"Would er, that have er, been the er, photographic er, Lima Papa by any chance? I just ask as, er, well, it would have, er, been er, taking photographs, and er, orbiting Grangemouth, and er, surrounding areas, er, to er, take photographs, of er, Grangemouth..... and the River Forth, er North of, er..... Falkirk and then round not quite as far as er, Kincardine Bridge and er the, er, Petrol refinery........ Lima Papa"
Or was it "Zulu Zulu request a few orbits west of Polmont vrp?"
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
From: Scotland
take photographs, of er, Grangemouth
NorthSouth, this too surpised me as I expected some form of restriction or warning before I had even obtained my first chart.
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 10,804
Likes: 1
Who says they are taking photo's in the visable light spectrum.
If they take photo's in the IR spectrum they can spot leaks and other such stuff. They were accused a few years ago of leaking into the forth. IR photo's can spot gas leaks. Early morning is when the earth is cool giving a good contrasting background.
And I have seen the goundflare dump at another plant and I don't think 3000ft would be enough, yes the flames go up 300-500ft but the thermal will go up and up
And in that first thermal the steam catalyst system won't be up to temp so there will be literally tons of CO in the plume and very possibly enough CO2 to stop the engine. And as its a refinary there will also be Sulphur compounds in it which are rather fatal in very small quanities.
If they take photo's in the IR spectrum they can spot leaks and other such stuff. They were accused a few years ago of leaking into the forth. IR photo's can spot gas leaks. Early morning is when the earth is cool giving a good contrasting background.
And I have seen the goundflare dump at another plant and I don't think 3000ft would be enough, yes the flames go up 300-500ft but the thermal will go up and up
And in that first thermal the steam catalyst system won't be up to temp so there will be literally tons of CO in the plume and very possibly enough CO2 to stop the engine. And as its a refinary there will also be Sulphur compounds in it which are rather fatal in very small quanities.
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,235
Likes: 0
From: Niort
The 'flareable' inventory at a refinery is not enough to cause problems for overflying aircraft. The sites marked on the chart are there because typically they are on major gas pipelines - in the event of a major malfunction the gas inventory is massive - pipelines like the Interconnector at Bacton have thousands of tons of gas which whilst very unlikely to 'get out' could really spoil your day. In contrast Grangemouth has possibly 10 tonnes and much of that at much lower pressures that the transmission lines.
That is of course why it does not have a warning on the chart!
That is of course why it does not have a warning on the chart!
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 10,804
Likes: 1
I can see my mistake as it was St fergus ground flare I saw go off. It was bloody impressive I might add.
Mind you saying that as someone who has been near by when a live pressure test failed and launched a 30kg flange out into Aberdeen bay I tend to stay clear of anything that has lots of pipes visable if I can. I don't particularly like going over the plant on approach to SOU either but needs must on vectors.
Mind you saying that as someone who has been near by when a live pressure test failed and launched a 30kg flange out into Aberdeen bay I tend to stay clear of anything that has lots of pipes visable if I can. I don't particularly like going over the plant on approach to SOU either but needs must on vectors.
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
From: Scotland
Grangemouth & Hound Point
The flights were commercial survey flights for a period of regular data collection -- Aircraft C172 / G-BEHV (based at EDI) - this Cessna can be seen almost anywhere over Scotland & North of England & has been used to collect photos for many publications featuring Scotland from the air - only ever flown by Commercial Pilots !
