NATS prepare to launch free pre-flight planning tool

[Justiciar]

There is a sad tendency to be overcritical. This seems to me to be a bold effort, though I shall almost certainly buy the full product, which greatly impresses me.

Is this the final official recognition that flight planning with chart and protractor is not fit for purpose in the 21st century? Given that this comes via NATS Infringement section we can assume that it is driven by safety issues surrounding incursions. No one can deny that plotting on this sort of tool is better than reading off tracks from a protractor on a chart.

I do tend to agree though that the ideal development would be a software version that can be downloaded for those occasions when there is no internet connection available. This surely cannot be too difficult as it seems to be based upon the full version of the program?

[WelshHopper]

I do tend to agree though that the ideal development would be a software version that can be downloaded for those occasions when there is no internet connection available. This surely cannot be too difficult as it seems to be based upon the full version of the program?

The problem is, even the full version relies on it's internet connection, due to the Notams/weather being held as a data source located on an internet based server. So whilst you could use it (the full program, or any available "offline" version) for basic flight planning, it would not have the most recent flight planning information. With that in mind I couldn't really see NATS endorsing an offline version.

Just my opinion of course

WelshHopper

[Tim Dawson]

It would be relatively trivial for us to enable an "Install" button that installed the software to your computer and created a shortcut on your desktop. We'd need to cache the NOTAM briefing and display an appropriate warning (something like "NOTAM briefing is 4 hours old") but then arriving at the airfield and getting a brief for a change of plan would be possible.

A NOTAM briefing that's 4 hours old isn't necessarily unsafe, though clearly a more recent one is preferable. After all, getting a NOTAM briefing in the morning and flying in the afternoon is not an unusual thing to do. It relies on the authorities not publishing NOTAM for important/dangerous events at the last minute.

[mikehallam]

Best thing, if NATS can provide it, is at least to display the std 1/2 million UK Charts. They do on the 'sister' kit the AWARE gps - used airborne.

It would make planning and operation more of a seamless back to back affair.

mike hallam.

[MFC_Fly]

Best thing, if NATS can provide it, is at least to display the std 1/2 million UK Charts. They do on the 'sister' kit the AWARE gps - used airborne.

I disagree. The beauty of SkyDemon, and presumably this on-line version, is that the displayed data is updated with every AIRAC cycle, i.e. every 4 weeks. CAA charts are only updated (roughly) yearly and all intermediate changes need to be amended by hand or, more likely, not

The charts look close enough to the CAA ones to make them more than acceptable.

Since some of the functionality that I paid for in the full version is now available for free it would be nice to see a reduction in our annual subscription Tim

MFC

[mikehallam]

BUT the AWARE mapping system actually does update monthly, so why not the planning chart ?

mike hallam

[Tim Dawson]

Actually, it doesn't. Airspace is updated every 28 days but the map is not. This can lead to airspace data (against which warnings are generated) being out of sync with the map.

[MFC_Fly]

As Tim says, the Aware maps are the standard ones you get on paper (although from the digital mapping data and not simply scanned paper charts) and are only updated at the same time, and the updated charts are not free. It is only the airspace data that is updated every 4 weeks with Aware, so you may very likely see the chart display one thing and the overlaid Aware data (in horrible colours, IMHO) another!

What about our discount Tim? A bit late for me though, having just renewed for another 12 months

MFC

[stevelup]

Best thing, if NATS can provide it, is at least to display the std 1/2 million UK Charts.

I too disagree - the best thing about SkyDemon is the vector charts.

[bad bear]

as a non aeroplane person, picking up on comments from the gliding website, it would be good if this tool warned of areas of intense gliding activity as depicted on 1;500,000 map and WARNED OF WINCH CABLES at gliding sites.... sometimes up to 3,000' or more.

great idea by the way.

bb

[ozbeck]

I love the simplicity of the SkyDemon chart for planning, even though I use an Airbox Clarity with the CAA charts whilst in the air.

I always have a niggling doubt when something calculates the plog for me that I have not 'absorbed' the wind and heading information fully, and don't have the same feel for the route as I would if I had calculated from scratch.

That makes me a bit of a Ludite, however, a wind arrow displayed on the chart (according to the input wind velocity) would certainly help provide this overall picture more fully.

Just an idea and don't know if any of the other systems do this.

[WelshHopper]

as a non aeroplane person, picking up on comments from the gliding website, it would be good if this tool warned of areas of intense gliding activity as depicted on 1;500,000 map and WARNED OF WINCH CABLES at gliding sites.... sometimes up to 3,000' or more.

I know the paid version of SkyDemon has this functionality (There is a little button to turn it on), would be great if the free version could warn for these sites as welll.

[stevelup]

Unless I'm missing something, it does?

All the sporting sites (gliding, hang gliding and parachuting) appear on the chart, and if you hover the mouse it shows you the cable height of gliding sites.

[chrisN]

I must be thick, so please bear with me – I don’t understand what Tim D and MFC said above.

If airspace digital data are updated with AIRAC cycles, and those are loaded into AWARE and/or this latest thing, why is the “map” not updated? What map?

Obviously, not a paper chart you carry with you – that only gets updated if you apply pen and ink to it.

Are you saying that the screens on these devices show an un-updated airspace map, while updated airspace data is nevertheless resident now on the device?

If so, whose bright idea was that?

Puzzled of Haverhill.

[stevelup]

The airspace definitions on the Aware device are updated on the AIRAC cycle but the underlying charts are not - just like your paper chart isn't. You need to buy a new digital chart for the device once a year, again just like your paper chart.

So for example this autumn when Lyneham CTR and CTA are disestablished, the Aware and all the other devices using raster maps will still show the airspace on the screen until the following March. They will of course not alert you any more though.

By contrast, that airspace will disappear from the display completely on vector based devices such as SkyDemon.

[lordhedges]

Not true Steve - The Aware will always alert you if it's been updated as the airspace definitions are what you are updating - these are displayed as vectors over the raster maps.

[stevelup]

You need to read what I wrote again. That's exactly what I said....

...that the alerts will reflect the current airspace but the underlying chart won't!

[dc9-32]

well I still can't get Silverlight to install, using either versions of IE

[stevelup]

Perhaps worth trying to do it via the Microsoft Site?

[dc9-32]

Thanks Steve - tried that before and no good either