Ways to train your RT?
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2007
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From: the low lands
Ways to train your RT?
I'm a low time pilot and I am looking for ways to keep my RT skills up to date.
The best training is off course by flying regurarly, but it would also be nice if you could train the RT procedures, which are less likely to occur (Mayday call, relay a message, etc.).
Some time ago I used a computer based training (CBT) from OATmedia, but did not like it that much.
Is a CBT available or are there other ways to keep your skill on a high(er) level.
Any suggestions are welcome.
The best training is off course by flying regurarly, but it would also be nice if you could train the RT procedures, which are less likely to occur (Mayday call, relay a message, etc.).
Some time ago I used a computer based training (CBT) from OATmedia, but did not like it that much.
Is a CBT available or are there other ways to keep your skill on a high(er) level.
Any suggestions are welcome.
Joined: Jul 2010
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From: Ansião (PT)
@Whopity: that makes nice reading, even to a foreigner. Thanks for mentioning!
@Mr Veenstra: correct phraseology of emergency calls should be your least concern. If ever you do have to make one, there will be more immediate concerns. And any information you forgot to pass will be asked for if and as required. Relaying would be a better subject for study - in my own R/T syllabus it was briefly mentioned, but in the exam it wasn't. Nor have I ever heard it happen, in my (limited) pilot's experience and (longer) listening at aerodromes.
I do recommend spending the odd afternoon listening at an aerodrome's frequency, and if anything is said that you don't understand, do not be afraid to walk in and ask for enlightenment.
@Mr Veenstra: correct phraseology of emergency calls should be your least concern. If ever you do have to make one, there will be more immediate concerns. And any information you forgot to pass will be asked for if and as required. Relaying would be a better subject for study - in my own R/T syllabus it was briefly mentioned, but in the exam it wasn't. Nor have I ever heard it happen, in my (limited) pilot's experience and (longer) listening at aerodromes.
I do recommend spending the odd afternoon listening at an aerodrome's frequency, and if anything is said that you don't understand, do not be afraid to walk in and ask for enlightenment.
Joined: Feb 2008
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From: New York City
In addition to what's been mentioned, listening to ATC via LiveATC.net will certainly keep your mind thinking in the right direction. While it's fairly US based, there is quite a bit of international coverage.
Joined: Jul 2009
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From: Belgium
I agree with this last comment. A few times listening on liveatc.net made a huge difference for me myself. Although most is commercial traffic, it helps getting used to the language.
Also a little practice now and then, such as flying in controlled areas or to controlled airports keeps me sharp.
Also a little practice now and then, such as flying in controlled areas or to controlled airports keeps me sharp.
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From: Amsterdam
I second the idea of simply listening in to R/T, either via your own scanner or via any of the numerous links on the internet. In addition to the repetitive hearing of standard phraseology, you'll also hear that everybody, including professional pilots and ATC, make mistakes and deviate from standard phraseology, just like you. So it'll make you more proficient in your R/T, but also more relaxed because you're less afraid of making mistakes.
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From: An ATC centre this side of the moon.
Use the appropriate Flight Information Service......I often visit my local flying clubs to try to convince the young inexperianced PPL's to practice their R/T by talking to Scottish Info.......we are here to help and its better to fcuk up on my frequency than a busy airfield talking mainly to IFR commercial flights!!
Yes we ARE human and really are here to help!!
Yes we ARE human and really are here to help!!
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: UK
correct phraseology of emergency calls should be your least concern.
37.30 2) For aircraft radiotelephone stations and aircraft earth stations operating on frequencies allocated exclusively to the aeronautical mobile service or the aeronautical mobile-satellite service, each administration may itself fix the conditions for obtaining a radiotelephone operator's restricted certificate, provided that the operation of the transmitter requires only the use of simple external switching devices. The administration shall ensure that the operator has an adequate knowledge of radiotelephone operation and procedure particularly as far as distress, urgency and safety are concerned. This in no way contravenes the provisions of No. 37.2.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2007
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From: the low lands
@Whopity: Great reading
I have listened to ATC on Dutch Aerodromes through ATCBOX. It is very helpful, I should listen more often. But still: there is a big difference between listening and actually making the calls.
On my RT exam I had a 2D view on a computer of a particular route and had to cross several traffic zones. I had to make the right calls (and relay a Mayday call). The examiner answered the calls. It would be great if there was some sort of tool which has the same functionality (I know this is difficult to make), only without a (human) examiner.
As I understand, no such thing is on the market?
Thank you for your help.
I have listened to ATC on Dutch Aerodromes through ATCBOX. It is very helpful, I should listen more often. But still: there is a big difference between listening and actually making the calls.
On my RT exam I had a 2D view on a computer of a particular route and had to cross several traffic zones. I had to make the right calls (and relay a Mayday call). The examiner answered the calls. It would be great if there was some sort of tool which has the same functionality (I know this is difficult to make), only without a (human) examiner.
As I understand, no such thing is on the market?
Thank you for your help.
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 335
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From: New Zealand
Never be afraid of talking to ATC just remember
Who You Are
Where You Are
And What You Want To Do
Speak Slowly, Clearly and ATC will do the same, Speak fast and they'll rattle back the reply!
I compose the message in my head first.
I made loads of mistakes and still do on the odd occasion (forgetting to amend my call sign to messages etc) ATC will use standard phrases too if you don't understand things. I was asked once to identify over a certain VRP and i got confused told him i was squawking 1200!! ATC replied "NO Press the Ident button..... " totally understood and complied, i gringe... i even added "Rodger Pressing Ident"
You could also bail up an instructor in a room and get him to pretend to be ATC, i did this once, useful to get thrown a few curve balls like go arounds and funky approach instructions.
Who You Are
Where You Are
And What You Want To Do
Speak Slowly, Clearly and ATC will do the same, Speak fast and they'll rattle back the reply!
I compose the message in my head first.
I made loads of mistakes and still do on the odd occasion (forgetting to amend my call sign to messages etc) ATC will use standard phrases too if you don't understand things. I was asked once to identify over a certain VRP and i got confused told him i was squawking 1200!! ATC replied "NO Press the Ident button..... " totally understood and complied, i gringe... i even added "Rodger Pressing Ident"
You could also bail up an instructor in a room and get him to pretend to be ATC, i did this once, useful to get thrown a few curve balls like go arounds and funky approach instructions.
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: USA
Planning out your transmission works best.
I talk on the radio professionally (I'd say I fly professionally, but we ought not get paid for doing this, so it's a professional talker. The flying is free). Even so, I find that for some transmissions such as position reports, I often write everything down and read it off.
Otherwise, I usually compose what I have to say in my head, before pressing the transmit button.
In the event of emergency radio traffic, concentrate on getting the message out. Remember that plain English works just fine.
I talk on the radio professionally (I'd say I fly professionally, but we ought not get paid for doing this, so it's a professional talker. The flying is free). Even so, I find that for some transmissions such as position reports, I often write everything down and read it off.
Otherwise, I usually compose what I have to say in my head, before pressing the transmit button.
In the event of emergency radio traffic, concentrate on getting the message out. Remember that plain English works just fine.
Joined: Nov 2007
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From: Downwind
I recommend LiveATC.net also, although try to stay away from US frequencies. RT is quite different in FAA land and to listen to it while still getting to grips with your own RT will only serve to confuse you. I recommend listening to the Irish airports (regional if possible i.e. EIKN which gets significant GA aircraft at weekends) as their RT is very very similar. Unfortuantely it is illegal to broadcast or listen to UK radio streams online (due to Ofcom I believe?).
Hope that helps,
Ryan
Hope that helps,
Ryan
Joined: Jan 2011
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From: New Zealand
As long as you get out the Mayday Mayday Mayday callsign and rough position this helps a lot, 7777 is great and ELT activation is also usefull.
Give them as much opportunity to find/help you as poss.
About 7 months ago I heard a chap request a Taxi to Wairau Hospital while enroute to Omaka from Nelson (Via the flying club), no mayday or Pan, the guy was a Dr and flying over for an emergency case. Tower cleared him straight in, we were all advised to stay clear , the guy came straight in on long finals to RWY12. All plain english, Not strictly an emergency but he got all the help he needed.
Give them as much opportunity to find/help you as poss.
About 7 months ago I heard a chap request a Taxi to Wairau Hospital while enroute to Omaka from Nelson (Via the flying club), no mayday or Pan, the guy was a Dr and flying over for an emergency case. Tower cleared him straight in, we were all advised to stay clear , the guy came straight in on long finals to RWY12. All plain english, Not strictly an emergency but he got all the help he needed.
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Amsterdam
7777 is great
the guy was a Dr and flying over for an emergency case. Tower cleared him straight in,
I was climbing out when I got a low fuel pressure warning. I only needed to tell ATC "returning with a technical problem" and the proverbial waters parted. Engine never missed a beat, no mayday or pan, no drama but still a non-standard circuit (I was on the deadside at that time) and priority landing. They even managed to verify the number of POB.
Joined: Jan 2011
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From: New Zealand
Quote:
7777 is great
Oops. Little revision in order there, Flying Kiwi?
7777 is great
Oops. Little revision in order there, Flying Kiwi?
Although in france once we nearly got the mirages called on us....(is that a NUCLEAR power plant..oh dear) anybody ever been intercepted? thread hijack!
Joined: Jul 2010
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From: Ansião (PT)
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 90
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From: the low lands
@torob: thank you for pointing this out to me. I'll definitely look into it.
@Jan: They only provide US training (right?). The R/T is quite different in the US.
Thanks to everybody for their comments.
Until today, I didn't fly for a few months and noticed that my R/T skills were a bit rough, but I managed ok. The fact I didn't fly for a few month was the reason I posted this message.
@Jan: They only provide US training (right?). The R/T is quite different in the US.
Thanks to everybody for their comments.
Until today, I didn't fly for a few months and noticed that my R/T skills were a bit rough, but I managed ok. The fact I didn't fly for a few month was the reason I posted this message.
