Cessna Secondary Seat Stop System Service Bulletin SEB07-5R1
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Cessna Secondary Seat Stop System Service Bulletin SEB07-5R1
I recently became aware of the Cessna's Service Bulletin for Secondary Seat stops. I understand that it's not mandatory however recommended and Cessna are picking up the tab.
I emailed our CAMO / Maintenance org who advised me that under EASA it was mandatory and sorry but Cessna would no longer pick up the tab and we would be looking at the thick end of a grand.
Before I take then to task as to why they didnt bring this to our attention sooner and also ask how many of they have fitted to their own Cessna fleet, I'd like to see if any other G-reg Cessna owners have had this mod fitted.
I emailed our CAMO / Maintenance org who advised me that under EASA it was mandatory and sorry but Cessna would no longer pick up the tab and we would be looking at the thick end of a grand.
Before I take then to task as to why they didnt bring this to our attention sooner and also ask how many of they have fitted to their own Cessna fleet, I'd like to see if any other G-reg Cessna owners have had this mod fitted.
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I can't speak for how many of the UK fleet of Cessnas are fitted with a secondary seat stop, but it's something I check for when I jump into a Cessna I have not flown before. I have yet to see a Cessna which did not have some form of stop. I have seen different kinds, not always the Cessna product.
This is something which should not be overlooked. Other than in 150's, where you could reach to fly in any case, the bigger Cessnas are down right dangerous in the case of a seat release, and no secondary stop. It happened to me twice in the early days, and is very scary!
If you have to fly a Cessna which does not have the system installed, as a temporary measure, the intent is met if you reposition that aft travel stop clip assembly into a hole in the track much further forward (if it has a suitable hole - but most seem to). This will prevent the seat moving back under any circumstances. It will be a misery to get in and out, but it will be safe. I cannot speak to the local legality of this in the UK.
A good mod I have seen as an inertial reel shoulder harness assembly up under the seat, with the belt tab attached to the floor ahead. Again, I don't know how these are approved.
I hope this helps...
This is something which should not be overlooked. Other than in 150's, where you could reach to fly in any case, the bigger Cessnas are down right dangerous in the case of a seat release, and no secondary stop. It happened to me twice in the early days, and is very scary!
If you have to fly a Cessna which does not have the system installed, as a temporary measure, the intent is met if you reposition that aft travel stop clip assembly into a hole in the track much further forward (if it has a suitable hole - but most seem to). This will prevent the seat moving back under any circumstances. It will be a misery to get in and out, but it will be safe. I cannot speak to the local legality of this in the UK.
A good mod I have seen as an inertial reel shoulder harness assembly up under the seat, with the belt tab attached to the floor ahead. Again, I don't know how these are approved.
I hope this helps...
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When I was doing my third solo circuit during training in a C152 I had the seat go rearwards on me during the climbout almost immedietley after takeoff.
To say this came as a surprise was a complete understatement and scared the life out of me. I had to level at 300' and put the nose down to enable me to get the seat forward again.
I don't know about this mod but I make it my business to ensure my seat is fully latched and there is no way it could go back on all my flights now.
To say this came as a surprise was a complete understatement and scared the life out of me. I had to level at 300' and put the nose down to enable me to get the seat forward again.
I don't know about this mod but I make it my business to ensure my seat is fully latched and there is no way it could go back on all my flights now.
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Hi,
I would be very surprised if it has not been done.
£1000 sounds like a joke. The mod done on 'ro consisted of a couple of screws put in the back of the seat runners by the same company that you use, albeit twenty odd years ago.
Your ac was maintained by the same maintenance co. From 1994 with a short break from about 1999
DO.
I would be very surprised if it has not been done.
£1000 sounds like a joke. The mod done on 'ro consisted of a couple of screws put in the back of the seat runners by the same company that you use, albeit twenty odd years ago.
Your ac was maintained by the same maintenance co. From 1994 with a short break from about 1999
DO.
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It is over a year ago since I was invloved with this SB so can't remeber the exact words but as far as I remember it is madatory for the Pilot seat (EASA maint.), all the aircraft I was involved with had it done and parts paid for by Cessna and some allowance for labour as well 
(Cessna service centre)
You are also correct it is now out of time for Cessna to foot the bill!
Pilot DAR:- The seat belt arrangment you have seen is the latest kit from Cessna.
It is also recommended to have one on the right hand seat but you had to buy your own.
I would be annoyed as well, this should have been picked up (EASA G-reg) when you had an airworthiness review when going EASA and all SB's AD's were checked from birth.
Mind you I have been shocked at the varying standards and interapretation of the SB's, lifed items, props, pitot static lines, seat belts etc. etc.
(Cessna service centre)You are also correct it is now out of time for Cessna to foot the bill!
Pilot DAR:- The seat belt arrangment you have seen is the latest kit from Cessna.
It is also recommended to have one on the right hand seat but you had to buy your own.
I would be annoyed as well, this should have been picked up (EASA G-reg) when you had an airworthiness review when going EASA and all SB's AD's were checked from birth.
Mind you I have been shocked at the varying standards and interapretation of the SB's, lifed items, props, pitot static lines, seat belts etc. etc.
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This is a different mod from the extra screw at the end of the seat runner. It looks to me like they effectively fit an inertia type seat belt under the seat and fix it to the floor.
More info at http://www.cessna.org/htmlatis/SEB07-5R2.pdf
I think this is what Pilot-DAR has seen.
Just-Local - already been through the seat belt shenanigans as well. Had a argument with our CAMO and he eventually rescinded (thanks to lots of PPRUNE input) . I recently discovered by accident (UPS contact me about a import duty charge) that they are sending other belts there now too.
More info at http://www.cessna.org/htmlatis/SEB07-5R2.pdf
I think this is what Pilot-DAR has seen.
Just-Local - already been through the seat belt shenanigans as well. Had a argument with our CAMO and he eventually rescinded (thanks to lots of PPRUNE input) . I recently discovered by accident (UPS contact me about a import duty charge) that they are sending other belts there now too.
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I emailed our CAMO / Maintenance org who advised me that under EASA it was mandatory and sorry but Cessna would no longer pick up the tab and we would be looking at the thick end of a grand.
Ask your again CAMO why it is mandatory, and why its taken since 2007 for you to be told about it! Sounds like a change to a more enlightened CAMO is required, or you can deal with the CAMO duties yourself.
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Utter rubbish, as said SB's are NONE mandatory, if they were Mandatory you would see every Cessna 150 152 with about 10 fuel drains per wing....... never seen one with them fitted.
There was a CAA letter that came out a few years back trying to clarify the position on SB's but as much as I have looked I cannot lay my hands on it.
Really you want to be asking this in the engineering forum, a lot of us would point you in the right direction.
There is a company in Germany rewebs/overhauls seatbelts and they come with an EASA form 1 for what its worth.
There was a CAA letter that came out a few years back trying to clarify the position on SB's but as much as I have looked I cannot lay my hands on it.
Really you want to be asking this in the engineering forum, a lot of us would point you in the right direction.
There is a company in Germany rewebs/overhauls seatbelts and they come with an EASA form 1 for what its worth.
I highly recommend this SB be fitted. It is much better than the screw stop because it does not restrict the rearward travel of the seat when entering/exiting/adjusting the seat. The inertial reel winds in and out under normal travel but will lock if the seat lets go. It is free from Cessna and eliminates a proven killer (uncommanded seat release). The screw through theh seat track is not good enough unless you are quite tall, because inorder to let the seat back far enough to get in you will b eso far back that I would ague control of the aircraft would be put in jeopardy. If you are flying a Cessna with a seat track block, you should when sitting in teh seat run teh seat back as far as it will go and see if you can reach the controls and in particular if you can apply full rudder and full down elevator. If the answer is no, than an uncommanded seat release could result in you unable to control the aircraft. If this happens right after takeoff in a nose high accident than you will probably have a major or even fatal accident.
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WARNING! SIPQ* Alert!
It is no secret that the seats on 150/152 aircraft have a nasty history of unlatching and sliding all the way aft (generally on take-off). Those of us who have not had it happen in flight ourselves have at least heard the stories of it happening to others in the past.
How is it, given the age of the aircraft, that something official is only now being circulated in the form of an SB - I would have thought an AD would have been issued donkey's ago? Perhaps this is a little naive of me but if I’m honest I always 'assumed' that given the history the aircraft affected would have had something retrofitted years ago, not that this stops me slamming myself against the back of the seat before flight each time.
Ryan
*SIPQ = Silly Inexperienced Pilot Question
It is no secret that the seats on 150/152 aircraft have a nasty history of unlatching and sliding all the way aft (generally on take-off). Those of us who have not had it happen in flight ourselves have at least heard the stories of it happening to others in the past.
How is it, given the age of the aircraft, that something official is only now being circulated in the form of an SB - I would have thought an AD would have been issued donkey's ago? Perhaps this is a little naive of me but if I’m honest I always 'assumed' that given the history the aircraft affected would have had something retrofitted years ago, not that this stops me slamming myself against the back of the seat before flight each time.
Ryan
*SIPQ = Silly Inexperienced Pilot Question
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The 150/152 are about the only single Cessnas to which the SB does not apply, as the seats really don't move far enough back to get you in total trouble, just really startle you!
The underlying requirement for the mod to all the other Cessnas is at least 20 years old.
The underlying requirement for the mod to all the other Cessnas is at least 20 years old.
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I had the inertia reel type fitted on my F172H a couple of years ago. The fitting was carried out by Mann Aviation at Fairoaks during its annual. In fact as I recall it was recommended by the engineer dealing with the aircraft.
It looked like a very sensible safety precaution to me even for a tall pilot. I’m around 6ft 3.5 inches. Seats unexpectedly sliding about at a critical phase in flight may well risk dangerous mishandling of the aircraft even if the pilot can reach the controls.
I strongly advise shopping around on price. I don’t believe I paid anything like the cost you have been quoted.
It looked like a very sensible safety precaution to me even for a tall pilot. I’m around 6ft 3.5 inches. Seats unexpectedly sliding about at a critical phase in flight may well risk dangerous mishandling of the aircraft even if the pilot can reach the controls.
I strongly advise shopping around on price. I don’t believe I paid anything like the cost you have been quoted.
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Pilot and Co-Pilot Secondary Seat Stop
Cessna issued SEB07-5AR2 on June 15, 2010 extending the compliance and reimbursement period to June 15, 2012. They will reimburse for the pilot seat kit and installation. The co-pilot seat kit price is currently $496.00. The kit SK210-174B is the same for both seats. Contact a Cessna Single Engine Service Station for details to have Cessna Service Bulletin SEB07-5 Revision 2 accomplished on your airplane. I have heard that you can now have any AE do the installation.
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Every I know of, has the moved screw to limit movement. No sec restrain fitted one in my vicinity. All have the exempt in their maintenance program to state, we know of it and have decided not to go that road - private ops though.
The inexpensive seat stop mod in Botswana on our fleet of C206s was a 1/8" split pin through a drilled hole in the seat rail vertical web and one leg folded over the top. Worked just fine.
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Our C182 still doesnt have the mod fitted. Principally because its been offline for a good part of the past 2 years after 2 prop strikes.
Really should have made the necessary arrangements whilst it was on the ground however it does need to be installed by an Authorised Cessna Service Centre.
However we're now back online and Ive just learned from Westair at Blackpool that Cessna have extended the period for free kit/fitting to the end of 2014.
Probably because of the huge backlog in orders that they havent been able to fulfill.
Really should have made the necessary arrangements whilst it was on the ground however it does need to be installed by an Authorised Cessna Service Centre.
However we're now back online and Ive just learned from Westair at Blackpool that Cessna have extended the period for free kit/fitting to the end of 2014.
Probably because of the huge backlog in orders that they havent been able to fulfill.
For a 185 there are 145 back orders for the kit. Do yourself a favour and get a free Cessna support subscription with weekly email notification and then it makes it real easy to keep on top of and access a whole range of Service Information.