Saying thank you?
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Saying thank you?
Saying thank you?
Can I ask how you end your radio calls with a frequency before switching to an alternate frequency?
Probably sounds a daft question, but it has been on my mind for a while (mine a sad life of finance and flying) and as such I would like to ask others how they end their radio calls with a controller, say Farnborough, who I am sure many on this site regard as a truly fantastic service, before changing to another frequency?
I was reading with interest a recent PPRUNE thread on being told to standby, I think by Solent, and got the overall impression that strictly speaking one shouldn’t add addition RT that isn’t necessary, even if it is just to say “thank you very much for your help” before switching frequency (which is what I do, although probably incorrectly?)
Many thanks
Nick
Can I ask how you end your radio calls with a frequency before switching to an alternate frequency?
Probably sounds a daft question, but it has been on my mind for a while (mine a sad life of finance and flying) and as such I would like to ask others how they end their radio calls with a controller, say Farnborough, who I am sure many on this site regard as a truly fantastic service, before changing to another frequency?
I was reading with interest a recent PPRUNE thread on being told to standby, I think by Solent, and got the overall impression that strictly speaking one shouldn’t add addition RT that isn’t necessary, even if it is just to say “thank you very much for your help” before switching frequency (which is what I do, although probably incorrectly?)
Many thanks
Nick
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Well yes the purist will not take kindly to a thank you, and yes it is probably not helpful if the frequency is really busy.
However, if the controller has gone out of their way to provide a good service then I think you should extend your thanks.
I am always grateful for a transit of some of the busier areas of airspace - through Gatwick, or Heathrow for example.
"Thank you for the transit, much appreciated" nevers goes amiss in my book.
However, if the controller has gone out of their way to provide a good service then I think you should extend your thanks.
I am always grateful for a transit of some of the busier areas of airspace - through Gatwick, or Heathrow for example.
"Thank you for the transit, much appreciated" nevers goes amiss in my book.
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"Many thanks" - if frequency isn't that busy or I've requested something specific.
"Bye bye" - If very busy
Or both if frequency is quiet. Nine times out of ten I say thanks, just out of politeness for whatever service I may have been given.
"Bye bye" - If very busy
Or both if frequency is quiet. Nine times out of ten I say thanks, just out of politeness for whatever service I may have been given.
Over here, it is quite customary to end the conversation with an informal politeness, which is often done in local language. I even heard this at Brussels tower on a rare occasion - though only when the frequency was VERY calm, at 23hrs local or so.
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If ATC is very busy, forget anything that is not by the book. They will not thank you for holding up some other transmission or message. If they are reasonably quiet then saying thanks as part of your acknowledgement is only one word amongst your message.
Generally if you are good at RT you can easily include a word of thanks but if you are one of the verbose "...at this time... " brigade then forget it.
Generally if you are good at RT you can easily include a word of thanks but if you are one of the verbose "...at this time... " brigade then forget it.
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I had a young man come out of a MCC course a few years back. He had come away with the impression, that one should never even say thank-you within the cockpit...in other words, to me...or I to him.
wwweeeelllllllllll that led to a discussion where I explained that aviation in my book, doesn´t cancel out politeness and courtesy, so I suggested that he forget that part of his instruction!
As an aside, he was FP and we were on a non-typical approach, bidirectional VOR(basically a cloud break)....when we reached MAPt, I said missed approach, as we were still in the clouds...
He replied, "but I can see some water below me"....(0 vis forward) "Missed approach NOW!"
He wasn´t happy, but he did it.....we then flew the ILS and when we looked at the VOR approach, he realised that we were flying directly at a mountain and doing the missed too late, would turn us into another mountain on an island....
his face went white when he realised how close things had come and he quietly said "thank-you" Seems his lesson in courtesy was over. He was from a flat country and as he could see ground/water/what-ever beneath him, then there was no danger in descending....quickly made the mental transition to mountainous terrain....
He went on to the military(!) and I wonder how that went...
Approach- "N2345X, what are your intentions?"
N2345X- "Well, I hope to finish my PPL within the next month, then I begin my CPL and instructor´s course. When I have built up enough time, I will go for my IR then instruct for a year before returning to my own country and hopefully become a professional airline pilot."
Approach- "Turn RIGHT, take up heading 180, maintain 2500 feet ...
wwweeeelllllllllll that led to a discussion where I explained that aviation in my book, doesn´t cancel out politeness and courtesy, so I suggested that he forget that part of his instruction!
As an aside, he was FP and we were on a non-typical approach, bidirectional VOR(basically a cloud break)....when we reached MAPt, I said missed approach, as we were still in the clouds...
He replied, "but I can see some water below me"....(0 vis forward) "Missed approach NOW!"
He wasn´t happy, but he did it.....we then flew the ILS and when we looked at the VOR approach, he realised that we were flying directly at a mountain and doing the missed too late, would turn us into another mountain on an island....
his face went white when he realised how close things had come and he quietly said "thank-you" Seems his lesson in courtesy was over. He was from a flat country and as he could see ground/water/what-ever beneath him, then there was no danger in descending....quickly made the mental transition to mountainous terrain....
He went on to the military(!) and I wonder how that went...
Approach- "N2345X, what are your intentions?"
N2345X- "Well, I hope to finish my PPL within the next month, then I begin my CPL and instructor´s course. When I have built up enough time, I will go for my IR then instruct for a year before returning to my own country and hopefully become a professional airline pilot."
Approach- "Turn RIGHT, take up heading 180, maintain 2500 feet ...
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I (well my a/c) was paid a compliment by the lady in the tower on taxi out at Cannes yesterday. I pondered my response for a moment, flicking through the mental r/t pages for the correct thing to say. Nothing. Next I tried to think of something witty or amusing. Nothing. Couldn't think of anything better than "THANK YOU", so that's exactly what I said.
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If the frequency is not busy I will usually say "thank you - good day" usually on the end of my last message. so if I have to report squawk and frequency change it would be "7000, 123 decimal 45, thankyou - good day"
Or if I have been helped out - "Thanks for your help - good day"
But if it's busy then no thanks is nessasery. And by the book its no comment needed.
But I have been thanked by ATC, I don't need it, but I like to know they have noticed.
Or if I have been helped out - "Thanks for your help - good day"
But if it's busy then no thanks is nessasery. And by the book its no comment needed.
But I have been thanked by ATC, I don't need it, but I like to know they have noticed.
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I've noticed a lack of "thank you's" from aircraft on RT even late at night when it's quiet and they've been offered a direct short-cut in the cruise. The odd "thanks for your help" or "cheers" would be nice for ATC to hear surely..
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It all depends on frequency congestion and what's going on. If it's simply a hand-off, one doesn't need a soliloquy.
"Foxtrot Niner Ringworm Six X-Ray Lollipop, contact Zelda Center on 126.5."
"126.5, Six X-Ray Lollipop, g'day." works just fine.
"Zelda Center, Foxtrot Niner Ringworm Six X-Ray Lollipop, request."
"Six X-Ray Lollipop, Zelda Center, go ahead with request."
"Zelda, Six X-Ray Lollipop request climb niner thousand, and direct ASCOT."
"Six X-Ray Lollipop, cleared direct ASCOT, climb and maintain niner thousand, contact Burudi on 124.3."
"Six X-Ray Lollipop, climb niner thousand direct ASCOT, Burundi on 124.3, thanks for the help, g'day."
Simple courtesy.
If the frequency is busy stick to strict jargon and forget the "g'day."
"Foxtrot Niner Ringworm Six X-Ray Lollipop, contact Zelda Center on 126.5."
"126.5, Six X-Ray Lollipop, g'day." works just fine.
"Zelda Center, Foxtrot Niner Ringworm Six X-Ray Lollipop, request."
"Six X-Ray Lollipop, Zelda Center, go ahead with request."
"Zelda, Six X-Ray Lollipop request climb niner thousand, and direct ASCOT."
"Six X-Ray Lollipop, cleared direct ASCOT, climb and maintain niner thousand, contact Burudi on 124.3."
"Six X-Ray Lollipop, climb niner thousand direct ASCOT, Burundi on 124.3, thanks for the help, g'day."
Simple courtesy.
If the frequency is busy stick to strict jargon and forget the "g'day."
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Here is an little funny story that I think is relevant to this thread.
It's stolen from the ATC humour thread on the atc forum
It's stolen from the ATC humour thread on the atc forum
True story which stills makes me smile: Couple of years ago I was working in Texas teaching commercial students most of which were Mexican! One particular student was very keen but struggled with the language and hence radio work at times became a bit of an issue. I had suggested to him that as a future professional pilot it might be good practice to add a polite 'good morning' or 'good afternoon' to his initial calls to ATC. Few days later having done a night flight to Austin and appropriately coffeed and refreshed we were getting ready to fly back to San Antonio and said student makes initial call remembering my 'words of wisdom'. "Austin Tower, N*****, Good Night". There followed an appopriate stunned silence then entering into the spirit of things, "N*****, Austin Tower... Sleep well"
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ICAO Doc 9432 (Manual of Radiotelephony) specifically states "The use of courtesies should be avoided"
I think it's very situation specific if you should include courtesies (bye bye, thank you, have a nice weekend etc.). If it's busy don't waste time expressing your gratitude. If it's just been standard R/T with no special effort, like coordinating requests for you, why should I include a thank you? I don't thank ATC for every clearance I get, the words would loose its value. Unfortunately some pilots are so keen to include a "thank you" for everything that they even forget to read back their callsign.
Don't get me wrong, I like someone lightening up the conversation a little that could otherwise be very bland. I usually thank ATC when they have put an effort in to provide best service. But there is time and place for everything.
I think it's very situation specific if you should include courtesies (bye bye, thank you, have a nice weekend etc.). If it's busy don't waste time expressing your gratitude. If it's just been standard R/T with no special effort, like coordinating requests for you, why should I include a thank you? I don't thank ATC for every clearance I get, the words would loose its value. Unfortunately some pilots are so keen to include a "thank you" for everything that they even forget to read back their callsign.
Don't get me wrong, I like someone lightening up the conversation a little that could otherwise be very bland. I usually thank ATC when they have put an effort in to provide best service. But there is time and place for everything.
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ICAO Doc 9432 (Manual of Radiotelephony) specifically states "The use of courtesies should be avoided"
I think a bit of levity is fine, i remember calling 'complete and taxiing to the pumps' on my solo flight and having tower say 'Congratualtions XYZ' possibly one of the best single moments of my life.
And if anybody thinks the pro's don't do this needs to do a bit of flying 'after hours'. Doing a bit of night flying i listened intently to a description of a 'fit' female contoller playing netball, and a light hearted slanging match between two rival domestic operators.. which was bloody hilarious.
This may have identified me... or my location.....
