Doncaster/Humberside radar services
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 480
Likes: 3
From: Retford, UK
Doncaster/Humberside radar services
Anyone know if there is an official NATS chart showing the radar coverage between Doncaster and Humberside?
Just wondering, as on a recent call to Doncaster for a service I was told I should be speaking to Humberside, and to me I seemed it could have been either in my position.
Just wondering, as on a recent call to Doncaster for a service I was told I should be speaking to Humberside, and to me I seemed it could have been either in my position.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,827
Likes: 7
From: Sometimes north, sometimes south
It won't have been a coverage issue, it'll have been an issue of (a) where you were and (b) the fact that Doncaster isn't a LARS provider but Humberside is. Humberside provides LARS out to 30nm radius which covers as far west as Doncaster. Unless you were looking for a Doncaster zone transit or were transiting round the edge of their zone, they probably decided you weren't of interest/concern to them.
NS
NS
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 444
Likes: 2
From: Up There!!!
East of the Trent you would talk to Humberside West of the Trent you talk to Doncaster.
That seem to be the general rule from us at Sandtoft EGCF, after take off from EGCF we talk to Doncaster initially then get passed off to Humberside if we were heading East.
Hope this helps Trev
That seem to be the general rule from us at Sandtoft EGCF, after take off from EGCF we talk to Doncaster initially then get passed off to Humberside if we were heading East.
Hope this helps Trev
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
From: Herts.
There is actually an official NATS chart to show radar coverage, and its ENR 6-1-6-3.
Not exactly a detailed map, but it gives a general indication of what airspace is covered by LARS and what isn't.
Not exactly a detailed map, but it gives a general indication of what airspace is covered by LARS and what isn't.
niknak
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,335
Likes: 0
From: UK
As has been pointed out, Humberside is a LARS unit and, unless there is an underlying operational reason, they have an obligation to provide LARS to anyone who requests it within the specified area and height specifications of coverage.
If the radar controller is providing a combined LARS and approach control service, they may be too busy providing radar services to their own inbound & outbound aircraft to provide LARS, but under those circumstances they are obliged to log the facts.
Doncaster is not a LARS unit and have no obligation to provide a radar service outside controlled airspace, although it's in both airports cases, it's in their interests to provide some sort of service to anyone transitting the area.
If the radar controller is providing a combined LARS and approach control service, they may be too busy providing radar services to their own inbound & outbound aircraft to provide LARS, but under those circumstances they are obliged to log the facts.
Doncaster is not a LARS unit and have no obligation to provide a radar service outside controlled airspace, although it's in both airports cases, it's in their interests to provide some sort of service to anyone transitting the area.
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 480
Likes: 3
From: Retford, UK
Interesting the details of the obligations to provide LARS or not.
I suppose from the point of view of a pilot in the air, it's a moot point as either Doncaster or Humberside could refuse to provide a service due to workload. Whether or not that is logged is more of an internal matter.
I suppose from the point of view of a pilot in the air, it's a moot point as either Doncaster or Humberside could refuse to provide a service due to workload. Whether or not that is logged is more of an internal matter.
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: UK
Humberside would not refuse to provide a service. They may be too busy at times to provide a Traffic Service or Deconfliction Service, but a Basic Service is certainly always available (when they are open). If they think you should be speaking to a more appropriate unit, they will say so, ie. Waddington/Coningsby/Linton etc.
As has already been said, Doncaster isn't a LARS unit, but Humberside is, so in most cases (unless you wanted to transit Doncaster's airspace) Humberside would be the appropriate unit to speak to.
Just to add, re workload, at most times during the day a second radar postion is available, so if it gets really busy, rather than refusing you a service, Humberside Radar would open the second radar position, so you might be talking to 119.125 (their first point of contact) or they may ask you to re-call them on 129.250.
Hope this helps.
As has already been said, Doncaster isn't a LARS unit, but Humberside is, so in most cases (unless you wanted to transit Doncaster's airspace) Humberside would be the appropriate unit to speak to.
Just to add, re workload, at most times during the day a second radar postion is available, so if it gets really busy, rather than refusing you a service, Humberside Radar would open the second radar position, so you might be talking to 119.125 (their first point of contact) or they may ask you to re-call them on 129.250.
Hope this helps.
