Poor state of UK GA. 'Todays Pilot' Letter.

[Who has control?]

Genghis, I didn't explain myself very well. I never meant to imply that marketing is just about increasing the price. You, Sennadog & I are in a agreement, but you two have managed to express it better. . .. .The product on sale is Flying Training. You can sell it at £X per hour or £X+10 per hour. The skill is in attracting customers to you at £X+10. And to do that, you have to be that bit better in your presentation than your rivals. Now you can also sell training at £X-10, but what do you cut back on to remain competative? There will always be customers for the cheap product, but I personally would be prepared to pay extra for a better product, until the price just starts to get silly.

[Monocock]

Picture the scene......... .. .UK airfield struggling for survival due to...high labour costs, high fuel costs, high maintenance costs, high insurance costs, high groundsmen costs, high electricity costs, high a/c purchase costs, high extra costs due to minimum hours working, high advertising costs etc etc etc.. .. .And what do you lot do????????. .. .Go to America cos its cheaper. . .. .Shame on you, you train over the water and then come back home expecting the best facilities when you've invested YOUR money in the USA. I bet the Yanks are laughing. . .. .How dare you pass comment on the state of UK GA when you have invested nothing into it when you trained for your stocking filler FAA licences.. .. .PPRuNe moderators might cut me off for my comments but I will never understand those who go elsewhere to promote other countries systems and then come home and slag off our own.. .. .Please, can someone not back me up with my positive feelings towards GA in the UK.. .. .If we don't look after it we will lose it.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

Monocock - not at all, I support your comments 100%.. .. .WWW

[LowNSlow]

I'm with you monocock but there have been very valid points made.. .. .It can be done ie clean well maintained aircraft, good organisation, tidy office and proffessional staff. I've seen it done in a PPL environment where there was no extra revenue generated by IR's etc. Made a tidy profit too.

[theRolfe2]

Go to America cos its cheaper. . .. .Shame on you, you train over the water and then come back home expecting the best facilities when you've invested YOUR money in the USA. I bet the Yanks are laughing.. .. .How dare you pass comment on the state of UK GA when you have invested nothing into it when you trained for your stocking filler FAA licences. . . . .....and if everybody had your attitude not only would there still be a British Car industry ther'd still be a British Wine industry! The reality is that the UK is at a competetive disadvantage in PPl training compared to several other places. The weather makes it impossible for an average person with a 9-5 job to complete a PPL in a reasonable period of time. I sympathise with anyone trying to make a living as an flight instructor in the UK but ultimatly you are there to serve the public and the public has figured out that they can meet their needs with less hassle by going to the US for a month rather than spending 18 months hanging out at wet airfields. . .. .No matter how much you knock the yanks they still have a product which is better than yours from the perspective of many of your potential customers. By knocking your competors product when your own customers have friends that are happy purchasers of the american alternative all you will succeed in doing is harming your own credability in the eyes of your customers. . .. .So rather than trashing all things west of holyhead why don't you focus your energies on profitable co-existance with your american collegues? Why not team up with them and offer courses which include 10 hours differences training in the UK, paid for at the same time the PPL is paid for? . .. .Please, can someone not back me up with my positive feelings towards GA in the UK.. .. .You didn't express any positive feelings! I don't like your characterization of my FAA licence as a 'stocking filler'. If I made the same comment about UK licences I would be the subject of a storm of criticism. . .. .theRolfe

[FlyingForFun]

I have to admit, I'm with theRolfe on this one, at least partly.. .. .UK schools have a place. Their primary place is serving students who can't, or don't want to, study abroad, as well as part-time students who are in no rush to get their license, and in renting to post-PPL customers who want to fly in the UK and prefer to rent.. .. .Unfortunately, UK schools are not the best way of training if you want to get a license as quickly and/or cheaply as possible. The two main reasons for this are a) the price of fuel, and b) the weather, both of which are out of the hands of the schools.. .. .Having said that, there is no reason why UK schools shouldn't strive to provide the highest quality service that they can, in the areas in which they are important. Their aircraft should be well-kept, instructors should be enthusiastic, all staff should be customer-oriented, and so on.. .. .I only have experience of one school in the UK, and this school does meet all of those requirements (except for keeping the aircraft clean, but it's bl00dy hard work keeping an aircraft clean if it spends half it's like in the circuit on the muddy runways at White Waltham!). .. .Overall, I preferred flying in the US to the UK. But this is not the fault of the schools. Apart from cheaper flying and better weather, there were a number of other advantages, mostly due to legislation, and out of control of the schools: the absence of landing fees, the fact that just about every airport is open at night, the ability to land a fabric-covered open-cockpit bi-plane at international airports without anyone giving you second glance.... .. .But, being based in the UK, and being a renter (although hopefully not for much longer), I am a customer of a UK flying school, and I'm grateful that I have a school nearby which does provide a good service.. .. .FFF. .---------

[Clear_Prop]

I'm with the general Ludwigean Theorem on this one. I think the guts of the problem is that we Bits have, very sadly - and through no fault of our own - become more than a little narrow minded in the way we do business; and are perhaps a bunch of cheapskates when it comes to paying for things. And that obviously extends well beyond GA.. .. .It frightens me to think that people can be so dumb as to throw caution to the wind in search of a cheap deal when considering an activity that, although generally regarded to be very safe, requires very high standards at all levels to actually be "safe". . .. .And there's your catch-22. I agree with Who Has Control? that "you get what you pay for" and I don't think many schools are looking beyond their noses to interpret that in a way that works. Although I can see their predicament - unless you have a target audience that actually respects a quality service, how can you possibly market one? I'm sure a fair few have tried to tackle this question only to fall on their @$$