License revalidation
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License revalidation
My SEP and MEP revalidations are both due for renewal in the next month. I had naively been under the impression that I would only be required to take the flight "test" for the MEP and that this would then automatically requalify me for SEP privileges as well, but I am now advised that I must take two separate flights in both a single and a twin in order to remain qualified to fly both singles and twins. Surely this is crazy. What possible situation could I possibly come across in a single which I could not deal with having checked out satisfactorily on normal symmetrical operations in a twin? Surely if I can fly a twin I can fly a single ? As it seems to stand at the moment , if I "pass" my revalidation for SEP in a simple C150, then I am deemed capable to continue flying my complex fuel injected , retractable, turbo charged,constant speed single, but if I "pass" my MEP in a complex twin , then I am not qualified to fly a simple single. Is this barmy or what? and why do these "instructional" flights apparently effectively amount to a retest GFT? (er sorry, I mean skill test or whatever fancy name they use these days,) when there is specifically only a requirement for exposure to instruction ?
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You seem a little confused. In order to revalidate the MEP there is a mandatory test, this may include one sector with the examiner if you do not have 10 sectors as PIC in the validity period of the rating.
In order to revalidate the SEP, you must either pass a test in a SEP Class aeroplane, not so daft because you do not do PFLs in the MEP. However, if you have 12 hours total SEP time in the 12 months preceeding expiry of the rating to include 6 hours PIC and 12 take offs and landings plus a 1 hour flight with an instructor, you do not have to do a test. The Test on the MEP will count as the one hour with an instructor.
Make sure you revalidate before the expiry date or the rating will expire and any experience gained will be null and void. You can revalidate by test up to 3 months early and by experience for the SEP up to 12 months early with no loss of time on the rating.
In order to revalidate the SEP, you must either pass a test in a SEP Class aeroplane, not so daft because you do not do PFLs in the MEP. However, if you have 12 hours total SEP time in the 12 months preceeding expiry of the rating to include 6 hours PIC and 12 take offs and landings plus a 1 hour flight with an instructor, you do not have to do a test. The Test on the MEP will count as the one hour with an instructor.
Make sure you revalidate before the expiry date or the rating will expire and any experience gained will be null and void. You can revalidate by test up to 3 months early and by experience for the SEP up to 12 months early with no loss of time on the rating.
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Thanks Noggin. The point about PFL's is a good one, (assuming you can find an instructor who is willing to risk a prosecution from the CAA in conducting one.) I suppose I should have made it clear however, that I have more than enough hours, more than enough take offs and more than enough landings and route sectors to meet all of the requirements for both ratings . I would have thought therefore that the flight with an examiner for the MEP would have met the requirements to renew the SEP without a further flight. I am advised however that because the MEP is a different " class" of aeroplane , that the MEP flight cannot be used to revalidate the SEP, (unless I have been incorrectly advised by both AOPA and my examiner who says he checked the matter with the CAA.)
On the subject of route sectors, as far as I can see this is a complete red herring , since an MEP revalidation flight is required regardless of whether one has only one route sector or one thousand route sectors !
On the subject of route sectors, as far as I can see this is a complete red herring , since an MEP revalidation flight is required regardless of whether one has only one route sector or one thousand route sectors !
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flybymike
You have been incorrectly advised by both AOPA and your examiner. Ask them to read JAR-FCL 1.245(c)(1)(ii)(B).
So long as you have completed the 12 hours SEP, then any other profficiency check or skill test, on any type or class, replaces the requirement to do an hour on the SEP with an instructor. You do not have to do a SEP check or test. Any TRE can sign your C of E.
However, if you allow your SEP rating to expire, even by one day, then you will have to do a SEP skill test.
Airclues
You have been incorrectly advised by both AOPA and your examiner. Ask them to read JAR-FCL 1.245(c)(1)(ii)(B).
So long as you have completed the 12 hours SEP, then any other profficiency check or skill test, on any type or class, replaces the requirement to do an hour on the SEP with an instructor. You do not have to do a SEP check or test. Any TRE can sign your C of E.
However, if you allow your SEP rating to expire, even by one day, then you will have to do a SEP skill test.
Airclues
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Thanks captain airclues. Alas I actually did my SEP flight today, but I still have to do My MEP flight (booked for Wednesday) It's a shame I didn't do the MEP first then I wouldn't have apparently wasted money on the SEP. I will mention the matter to my examiner quoting the holy rules you have uttered and see what response I get, apart from muted embarrassment, but in the interests of harmony with my examiner I don't imagine I will create a fuss about it. I think I will have to think hard about renewing my AOPA subscription though.
If your Examiner knew that you were intending to fly your MEP revalidation proficiency check, then he took your money under false pretences, in my opinion. It is indeed abundantly clear that a mandatory proficiency check is required for MEP revalidation, but that very same flight will count as your SEP 'dual training flight' so long as it's at least an hour AND you have done your 12 hours (of which 6 PIC and 12 T/O and landings).
Examiners have absolutely no excuse for claiming not to know this - we've all had a reminder recently from the CAA. If the same FE is going to do your MEP revalidation, I suggest you ask for the fee to be waived in view of your unneccesary SEP revalidation proficiency check!
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: BEagle ]
Examiners have absolutely no excuse for claiming not to know this - we've all had a reminder recently from the CAA. If the same FE is going to do your MEP revalidation, I suggest you ask for the fee to be waived in view of your unneccesary SEP revalidation proficiency check!
[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: BEagle ]
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Thanks Beagle. I haven't actually paid for the SEP revalidation yet, and I will certainly bring the matter up with my examiner about the unecessary flight before I settle up financially. It is in fact the same examiner who will be conducting both flight tests. I don't therefore think I will make a scene until he has signed me off for the MEP !
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I did say in my post that:
The Test on the MEP will count as the one hour with an instructor.
In fact you could do a base check on a 747 in a Simulator and that would count as the flight with an instructor for SEP revalidation.
The Test on the MEP will count as the one hour with an instructor.
In fact you could do a base check on a 747 in a Simulator and that would count as the flight with an instructor for SEP revalidation.
