VFR to IFR

[Fuji Abound]

Hence my point that unless you specifically request otherwise IFR seperation will automatically be applied if you are flying an approach.

[Spitoon]

Hmm... I do wonder if these standards need revisiting at some point?

You might want to look into just how *accurate* the radar picture that a controller sees really is before thinking about reducing separation standards. And in this case, newer does not always equate to better!

[flyinghigh66]

IFR in Class G - a risky business?

Thanks all. You've basically confirmed how I was intending to handle the switch over. Guess I was after a bit of confidence building at the end of the day.

I still wonder though how IFR really prevents mid air collisions in class G. Basically below TA, 2 aircraft could be quite legally flying IMC IFR at the same level on a head on colission course and they would never know... Above TL, even if you fly the FL for your heading, there is still the chance of 2 aircraft flying in IMC IFR on an intercepting course.

Yep, of course I would be communicating with the LARS/FIS, and listening out to other aircraft, but as you said, there may be silent aircraft out there and without a collision alert system on board to pick up others transponders there is always the risk.... Or is there something completely fundamental I'm missing here ?

I guess I never thought that hard about it before....

Again thanks for the healthy discussion.

[IO540]

I still wonder though how IFR really prevents mid air collisions in class G

It doesn't. Nothing does. Even a radar service doesn't guarantee traffic will be reported to you.

Your protection comes solely from statistics. The UK has seen about one VMC midair a year, and nearly all of them below 1000ft and usually in the vicinity of airfields. There is no known IMC midair since one in WW2. That's why I worry about flying low (and basically don't do it except for takeoff or landing) and couldn't care less about hitting somebody in IMC. Keeping away from glider sites is also a good idea. Fly above the clouds whenever possible; almost nobody does and gliders certainly don't (in the absence of mountains).

The UK probably has a similar traffic density to Germany, and vastly higher (10x to 100x) than most other countries in Europe. The #3 is perhaps France but most French GA activity is very low down, compared with the FL115 uppermost level available to VFR.

Even in controlled airspace there is no guarantee. Somebody could wonder into it non-transponder. If the CAS does not extend to the ground, the radar controller must assume the traffic is below the base of CAS (quite an assumption, eh?). Your protection in CAS is really from the lack of traffic (only about 1000 planes a year bust CAS in the UK) and once you are flying proper IFR you will be high anyway (say FL100 plus) and way under 1% of GA ever goes that high.