Blocked Runway
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From: suffolk
Blocked Runway
I arrived overhead a private strip recently,only to find someone playing football with their dog in the middle of the strip. Having circled several times(annoying the locals) I decided to do a low pass to get them to move.
This had the effect of getting them to look up at me and wave!(but not move!)
After some considerable time,longer than it took fly there,they moved and I landed.
They then came up to look at the aircraft with the dogs off the lead before I had shut down.
This is not the first time this has happenedto me.
Taking the recent tragic events with the giro into account it could have been worse,as indeed it could have been had I been low on fuel.
Bearing in mind the people should not be on the runway,was I wrong to buzz them? (500ft rule) and if I HAD to land (for whatever reason) would that have made any difference (500ft rule)?
This had the effect of getting them to look up at me and wave!(but not move!)
After some considerable time,longer than it took fly there,they moved and I landed.
They then came up to look at the aircraft with the dogs off the lead before I had shut down.
This is not the first time this has happenedto me.
Taking the recent tragic events with the giro into account it could have been worse,as indeed it could have been had I been low on fuel.
Bearing in mind the people should not be on the runway,was I wrong to buzz them? (500ft rule) and if I HAD to land (for whatever reason) would that have made any difference (500ft rule)?
Joined: Mar 2007
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From: London
In my view you were wrong to buzz them. You were not making an approach to land and broke the 500ft rule. If you had an engine failure while buzzing them you could have killed them and yourself.
They may be irritating ignorant XXXX, but if they choose for whatever reason not to respond to your circling I would have gone elsewhere and maybe discussed it with the strip owner later to consider fencing, signs etc.
LF
They may be irritating ignorant XXXX, but if they choose for whatever reason not to respond to your circling I would have gone elsewhere and maybe discussed it with the strip owner later to consider fencing, signs etc.
LF
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From: London
I tend to agree with LateFinals but to be honest I'm not sure I would have acted differently. Must have been very frustrating and hopefully you politely pointed out to the idiot in question the error of his/her ways.
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From: France
By far the safest policy is to go somewhere else because these visitors can be totally unpredictable -- especally the dogs. You should never be so low on fuel (or daylight) that you have to land.
If the circuit restrictions permit you could try lining up for an approach but then give up on final long before the threshold if you see that they don't understand your intention. I don't see how flying a low pass over the field will help.
Non pilots have no idea of the danger and you will find all sorts of things on little used grass strips. Dogs are the most common hazard but I have seen people with horses and even someone giving driving lessons. Mostly this happens when the strip is so rarely used local people don't realize it is a landing strip.
I assume that the strip is not yours. In this case you might want to have a word with the owner. Very often the visitors are regulars from the area and someone can have a chat with them.
If the circuit restrictions permit you could try lining up for an approach but then give up on final long before the threshold if you see that they don't understand your intention. I don't see how flying a low pass over the field will help.
Non pilots have no idea of the danger and you will find all sorts of things on little used grass strips. Dogs are the most common hazard but I have seen people with horses and even someone giving driving lessons. Mostly this happens when the strip is so rarely used local people don't realize it is a landing strip.
I assume that the strip is not yours. In this case you might want to have a word with the owner. Very often the visitors are regulars from the area and someone can have a chat with them.
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From: suffolk
The point here that I did not explain very well in the first post is this...If i diverted to another strip somewhere and then return later ,the same thing is likely to occur!
Also I should add that the "buzz" WAS 501ft .(obviously) but would I have been justified in going lower to make it clear that I wanted to land .
Also I should add that the "buzz" WAS 501ft .(obviously) but would I have been justified in going lower to make it clear that I wanted to land .
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From: France
If you come back later and find it blocked again then maybe you need to go there on the ground and talk to the owner. Or you can phone the owner from your alternative and ask her/him to shoo away the visitors. Don't try phoning from the air unless you have someone else to take care of the flying.
And try going lower if you want but it will do no good. Even if you pass at 6ft over the grass they will only wave more and maybe film it with their mobiles for YouTube, the CAA and the police. They will not get the hint.
Best plan IMHO is to ask the owner to explain things to the locals and maybe put a small sign requesting they stand to one side and restrain their pets when they see an A/C approaching.
And try going lower if you want but it will do no good. Even if you pass at 6ft over the grass they will only wave more and maybe film it with their mobiles for YouTube, the CAA and the police. They will not get the hint.
Best plan IMHO is to ask the owner to explain things to the locals and maybe put a small sign requesting they stand to one side and restrain their pets when they see an A/C approaching.
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From: Niort
This is an issue almost inherent in farm strips.
My last strip was very popular with dog and other walkers. Yes they are a bloody nuisance but a conversation with them will usually much help. What will not help is 'buzzing' them.
Remember they have usually got no idea that you want to land - it simply does not register in their empty little heads that the neatly mown section of a field has not been prepared especially for them to walk their dog!
So if you want to cause difficulties for the strip owner/operator and yourself then just try and scare them off.
I'll admit to a few nasty comments to the elderly couple who took to parking their Range Rover in the middle of the strip but walkers - leave them be - 500 odd metres doesn take that long to walk (although it is a real pi**er when they walk to the end and then turn around and walk back!!
My last strip was very popular with dog and other walkers. Yes they are a bloody nuisance but a conversation with them will usually much help. What will not help is 'buzzing' them.
Remember they have usually got no idea that you want to land - it simply does not register in their empty little heads that the neatly mown section of a field has not been prepared especially for them to walk their dog!
So if you want to cause difficulties for the strip owner/operator and yourself then just try and scare them off.
I'll admit to a few nasty comments to the elderly couple who took to parking their Range Rover in the middle of the strip but walkers - leave them be - 500 odd metres doesn take that long to walk (although it is a real pi**er when they walk to the end and then turn around and walk back!!
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From: The Burrow, N53:48:02 W1:48:57, The Tin Tent - EGBS, EGBO
The dog owners may not be aware of the potential dangers involved. A couple of years ago I had my caravan at Ashridge Farm Caravan Club site for a couple of nights. Also there was a family with whom I chatted. It transpired that they had recently visited North Weald and had let their dog run free - fortunately it was a dog which came when called. They were absolutely horrified when I quietly pointed out the dangers and why the landrover had gone out to them and asked me to apologise to NW on their behalf which I did - Aer Babe can confirm this. I am sure that theirs is one dog which will never again roam free around an airfield. I exercise my dog on the club airfield after it has closed. He has a wonderful time running free, tracking interesting smells and generally doing what dogs love to do but I always have one eye on the sky. During the day I use the old taxiway to get to the fields where he can run free in safety but he is always on the lead until we reach them and back on it before we get anywhere near the taxiway on our return.
Joined: Dec 2000
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From: Various
1 piece of paper, A quick scribble with a chinagraph pencil, Several choice profanities. Dropped to the numpty from 501 feet. In defence you can at least claim it to be the least-risk option since the next aviator might (in your opinion) have decided to land anyway.
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Unfortunately, you aren't allowed to drop anything, even a piece of paper, from an aircraft without permission. See para 2.
Dropping of articles and animals
66 (1) Articles and animals (whether or not attached to a parachute) shall not be dropped, or
permitted to drop, from an aircraft in flight so as to endanger persons or property.
(2) Subject to paragraph (3), except under and in accordance with the terms of an aerial application certificate granted under article 68 of this Order, articles and animals (whether or not attached to a parachute) shall not be dropped, or permitted to drop, to the surface from an aircraft flying over the United Kingdom.
66 (1) Articles and animals (whether or not attached to a parachute) shall not be dropped, or
permitted to drop, from an aircraft in flight so as to endanger persons or property.
(2) Subject to paragraph (3), except under and in accordance with the terms of an aerial application certificate granted under article 68 of this Order, articles and animals (whether or not attached to a parachute) shall not be dropped, or permitted to drop, to the surface from an aircraft flying over the United Kingdom.
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From: France
articles ... shall not be dropped, or permitted to drop, to the surface from an aircraft flying over the United Kingdom.
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From: France
but you can dump water ballast!
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From: Toronto
Anybody with a strip would be wise to have warning or no public admittance signs since in the case of any accident the lawyers will include the strip owner as one of the defendants.
In the case of a PPR strip, it is of course the PIC's responsibility to contact the operator beforehand. Perhaps it is the owner and his dog.
At our glider club, we do have signs up, shoo off the dirtbikers and other motorheads, and let the dogs and model a/c loose after the gliders have been put away
In the case of a PPR strip, it is of course the PIC's responsibility to contact the operator beforehand. Perhaps it is the owner and his dog.
At our glider club, we do have signs up, shoo off the dirtbikers and other motorheads, and let the dogs and model a/c loose after the gliders have been put away
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From: East Anglia
This often happens with unmanned strips. We have dogwalkers, horse riders etc.
The worst is kite flyers who just lay all their lines out across the runway to untangle them. Luckily, the last time it happened I was on the ground and was able to go and grab all the lines etc and bundle them up so an aircraft could land. The kite flyers got quite disgruntled that I'd undone their untangling. They didn't even seem to realise that they had no right to be there.
You do have to be careful about buzzing them as someone was prosecuted for doing this at Nayland some time ago.
ZA
The worst is kite flyers who just lay all their lines out across the runway to untangle them. Luckily, the last time it happened I was on the ground and was able to go and grab all the lines etc and bundle them up so an aircraft could land. The kite flyers got quite disgruntled that I'd undone their untangling. They didn't even seem to realise that they had no right to be there.
You do have to be careful about buzzing them as someone was prosecuted for doing this at Nayland some time ago.
ZA
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From: E Anglia
You do have to be careful about buzzing them as someone was prosecuted for doing this at Nayland some time ago.
Concentrates the interlopers' minds a treat.
If I see the strip occupied, I shove the prop to fully fine at 501ft in the overhead, wait a few seconds till all eyes are skyward due to the change in engine noise, then I lower the gear.
It's worked on the one occasion I've done it: by the time the circuit to land was completed the strip was deserted.
Cusco
Last edited by Cusco; 12th March 2009 at 22:42.