What to do if your lost?
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What to do if your lost?
What to do if your lost?
I have only recently gained my PPL license and like to have figure out what I would do in different situations. I am trying to put together the best procedure if i were to get lost.
I would really appreciate your suggestions and experiences.
Nick
I have only recently gained my PPL license and like to have figure out what I would do in different situations. I am trying to put together the best procedure if i were to get lost.
I would really appreciate your suggestions and experiences.
Nick
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There are two options:
1) If you know you're not near any Controlled airspace, take your last known position on the chart, draw a circle around it the radius of which is the distance you know you will have flown since that point (so - if it's 5 minutes at 120Kts then that's a 10nm radius). then work out where you are inside that circle by reference to ground features
2) If you suspect you're near CAS, or (1) above doesn't work, dial up 121.5, squawk 7700 and shout for help (PAN call). There is no shame in doing so, you'll get all the help you'll need, and it'll stop you having a nasty with something bigger and faster.
1) If you know you're not near any Controlled airspace, take your last known position on the chart, draw a circle around it the radius of which is the distance you know you will have flown since that point (so - if it's 5 minutes at 120Kts then that's a 10nm radius). then work out where you are inside that circle by reference to ground features
2) If you suspect you're near CAS, or (1) above doesn't work, dial up 121.5, squawk 7700 and shout for help (PAN call). There is no shame in doing so, you'll get all the help you'll need, and it'll stop you having a nasty with something bigger and faster.
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Sir,
0. Admit to yourself that you are lost, instead of trying to convince yourself you know where you are.
1. Do not continue any further.
2. Check heading and the time travelled from the last known waypoint.
3. If able, return to a place that you recognise and are able indentify without a doubt. (This should be fairly easy if you have OFP and you know how long you've come with a known heading)
4. If 3 doesn't work, use radio to get assistance from ATC and use nav aids to plot yourself onto the map again.
Happy landings sires,
Olabade
0. Admit to yourself that you are lost, instead of trying to convince yourself you know where you are.
1. Do not continue any further.
2. Check heading and the time travelled from the last known waypoint.
3. If able, return to a place that you recognise and are able indentify without a doubt. (This should be fairly easy if you have OFP and you know how long you've come with a known heading)
4. If 3 doesn't work, use radio to get assistance from ATC and use nav aids to plot yourself onto the map again.
Happy landings sires,
Olabade
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I look at one of my 7 GPS devices in my plane and failing that I would use ye olde nav devices like my adf (have to de-tune radio five live first) or perhaps a VOR.
Personally I dont think you can beat the situational awareness that a GPS gives you. I always like ome of the ones that display you as a flashing blob on a CAA chart (such as memory map) which you can have on your phone, a pocket pc or in my case a small tablet pc with a touch screen.
I am aware that there will be others who will rattle on about not using GPS for navigation etc but frankly that is rubbish IMO. If you use GPS together with your maps and looking out of the window to make sure what you see on your map and gps is the same you wont go far wrong.
Personally I dont think you can beat the situational awareness that a GPS gives you. I always like ome of the ones that display you as a flashing blob on a CAA chart (such as memory map) which you can have on your phone, a pocket pc or in my case a small tablet pc with a touch screen.
I am aware that there will be others who will rattle on about not using GPS for navigation etc but frankly that is rubbish IMO. If you use GPS together with your maps and looking out of the window to make sure what you see on your map and gps is the same you wont go far wrong.
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Nickyboy,
Now you have your ppl you may like to think about getting a GPS then you won't ever get lost. Even if it packs up on you will have a good fix at the point it went TU.
Even a walking one will give you enough position awareness to find yourself on the chart and they cost less that one hours aircraft rental.
Steve
[Oops: sorry Stuart, stepped on you]
Now you have your ppl you may like to think about getting a GPS then you won't ever get lost. Even if it packs up on you will have a good fix at the point it went TU.
Even a walking one will give you enough position awareness to find yourself on the chart and they cost less that one hours aircraft rental.
Steve
[Oops: sorry Stuart, stepped on you]
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Apart from what others have said here is not to panic, make large deviations or identify features as being what you want to see rather than what is there.
Double check towns and villages by checking for railway lines, rivers, shapes etc. check for features such as hills, lakes, coastlines.
Chances are you will be talking to someone if not make sure you are. If it is a military radar unit perfect, just tell them of your problem and they will no doubt help.
Even avoid a problem by telling them that you are a new PPL routing from A to B and can they keep an eye on you.
Even as an experienced pilot ATC are there for you to work.
Often under a radar service I will ask to be stepclimbed to a cruise level with airspace letting them sort out the controlled airspace or while flying IMC will ask for stears away from certain areas or aircraft.
So dont be shy of asking for help in the early days. It is reassuring to know someone is keeping half an eye on you until you have the confidence yourself.
Pace
Double check towns and villages by checking for railway lines, rivers, shapes etc. check for features such as hills, lakes, coastlines.
Chances are you will be talking to someone if not make sure you are. If it is a military radar unit perfect, just tell them of your problem and they will no doubt help.
Even avoid a problem by telling them that you are a new PPL routing from A to B and can they keep an eye on you.
Even as an experienced pilot ATC are there for you to work.
Often under a radar service I will ask to be stepclimbed to a cruise level with airspace letting them sort out the controlled airspace or while flying IMC will ask for stears away from certain areas or aircraft.
So dont be shy of asking for help in the early days. It is reassuring to know someone is keeping half an eye on you until you have the confidence yourself.
Pace
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Originally Posted by Pace
If it is a military radar unit perfect, just tell them of your problem and they will no doubt help.
Doesn't matter whether it's military or civil - you'll get the same help.
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dial up 121.5, squawk 7700 and shout for help (PAN call)
You need to realize that as soon as you squawk 7700, all ATC units that have you on radar, including those that you're not talking to, will start watching you and start clearing the airspace around you, particularly below you. Maybe some rescue units near you will get a heads-up call for a possible emergency landing. After all, from your squawk alone they can't figure out that you only need a position fix from D&D, and are talking to D&D to achieve that. So they'll fear the worst and act accordingly.
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Do Not Sqwauk 7700.....
....are you in immediate, life threatening danger? No? Didn't think so.
The one thing that nobody has mentioned here, and it's sooo easy is the traditional VDF call.
If you look at your VFR chart here in the U.K. you will note that certain aerodromes have the initials VDF next to them. Tune in and ask for either bearings or steers (magnetic or true - up to you)
They will usually give you a bearing from the station - which you can then cross cut with a station you think is at 90 degrees. You can find which stations will work for you as you plot your route.
The full description of the process is detailed in CAP413. No gadgets required.
As SoCalApp has said, I am extremely surprised that your instructor has not covered this with you at some length, and you should have been tested on this by your examiner.
The one thing that nobody has mentioned here, and it's sooo easy is the traditional VDF call.
If you look at your VFR chart here in the U.K. you will note that certain aerodromes have the initials VDF next to them. Tune in and ask for either bearings or steers (magnetic or true - up to you)
They will usually give you a bearing from the station - which you can then cross cut with a station you think is at 90 degrees. You can find which stations will work for you as you plot your route.
The full description of the process is detailed in CAP413. No gadgets required.
As SoCalApp has said, I am extremely surprised that your instructor has not covered this with you at some length, and you should have been tested on this by your examiner.
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Originally Posted by backpacker
I somehow think that D&D would appreciate an "unsure of position, request fix" more than a full-blown emergency squawk with a PAN call and everything
If you're near CAS, or you suspect may have infringed, then it's a PAN on 121.5 and a 7700 squawk because:
1) The unit responsible for the CAS can avoid you like the plague if inside, or plan ahead in case you're likely to infringe (we can see which way you're tracking)
2) D&D can speak to you whereever you are in the country, and the flashing emergency squawk will pinpoint you faster on their (and other) screens.
The calls you make to D&D are either real (PAN or MAYDAY) or practice (Practice PAN or "Training Fix"). If you're lost you won't be doing one of the latter - go back and read my original post, those options are still valid if you're not talking to an ATC unit. However - if you are talking to an ATC unit already (and I mean proper ATC) use them first obviously.
Originally Posted by DuchessDriver
If you look at your VFR chart here in the U.K. you will note that certain aerodromes have the initials VDF next to them. Tune in and ask for either bearings or steers (magnetic or true - up to you)
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Buy yourself the biggest-screen GPS you can afford, learn how to use it, and you won't get lost 
Otherwise, the answer depends on whether you are trying to impress an instructor, or trying to impress your girlfriend.
In the former case, you call up D&D on 121.5 and tell them you are unsure of position and ask for help. They don't have much to do these days and like the practice.
In the latter case, you will have learnt how to track a VOR and what a DME is, and will have these instruments in your plane, so you do a VOR/DME or DME/DME (or VOR/VOR) fix. In fact, you will have navigated using GPS backed up by VOR/DME so will not have got lost in the first place
Off to get my coat before the shells start coming in
Otherwise, the answer depends on whether you are trying to impress an instructor, or trying to impress your girlfriend.
In the former case, you call up D&D on 121.5 and tell them you are unsure of position and ask for help. They don't have much to do these days and like the practice.
In the latter case, you will have learnt how to track a VOR and what a DME is, and will have these instruments in your plane, so you do a VOR/DME or DME/DME (or VOR/VOR) fix. In fact, you will have navigated using GPS backed up by VOR/DME so will not have got lost in the first place
Off to get my coat before the shells start coming in
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It may sound obvious, but look directly below you.
I was once on a cross-country and couldn't see the aerodrome I was using as a fix.
Due to shadows and light I did not see the airfield as I approached it in a low wing SEP.
As soon as I dipped the wing to turn in an effort to fix my position (and therefore go no further) lo and behold I was directly above the fix!
Don't panic and follow the good advice proffered elsewhere in this Thread.
KR
FOK
I was once on a cross-country and couldn't see the aerodrome I was using as a fix.
Due to shadows and light I did not see the airfield as I approached it in a low wing SEP.
As soon as I dipped the wing to turn in an effort to fix my position (and therefore go no further) lo and behold I was directly above the fix!
Don't panic and follow the good advice proffered elsewhere in this Thread.
KR
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1) The unit responsible for the CAS can avoid you like the plague if inside, or plan ahead in case you're likely to infringe (we can see which way you're tracking)
2) D&D can speak to you whereever you are in the country, and the flashing emergency squawk will pinpoint you faster on their (and other) screens.
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Chilli.....
If you're inadvertantly inside CAS then, rest assured, the controller is already ontop of you and, where necessary vectoring away his IFR traffic to maintain the separation it should be affored. You don't need 7700 for this.....
If you suspect you're inside CAS then your call should be to that unit first - if they can't help you (you're probably not inside their space) and will recommend a call to D&D.
If you don't have the nouse to be able to talk to someone on the radio - you shouldn't be up there in the first place - and certainly nowhere near CAS!
DD
If you're inadvertantly inside CAS then, rest assured, the controller is already ontop of you and, where necessary vectoring away his IFR traffic to maintain the separation it should be affored. You don't need 7700 for this.....
If you suspect you're inside CAS then your call should be to that unit first - if they can't help you (you're probably not inside their space) and will recommend a call to D&D.
If you don't have the nouse to be able to talk to someone on the radio - you shouldn't be up there in the first place - and certainly nowhere near CAS!
DD
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In the former case, you call up D&D on 121.5 and tell them you are unsure of position and ask for help. They don't have much to do these days and like the practice.
Yes a GPS would be a reassuring extra to have but if not make sure you are using a service explain that you are new and just ask for them to keep half an eye on your progress. Save the girlfriend telling her mates that half the country was on alert to save you both
Pace
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But they don't require 7700 for that, surely? I mean, if a CAS controller sees a 7000 squawk heading directly for his/her airspace, wouldn't he/she start planning for an infringement already?
Does D&D have nationwide radar coverage? I though they did VDF triangulation?
DuchessDriver - feel free to look at my profile first before teaching me to suck eggs
The whole point about being lost is you DON'T KNOW where you are, you dont know who's CAS you may have infringed (I've been involved in an aircraft lost scenario where the aircraft was 50 miles away from where they thought they were). 121.5 is a single point of contact who will liaise and co-ordinate, effecting transfer of control if necessary, to the relevant ATC unit.
Yes, I will be avoiding any infringer . However, by squawking 7700, and calling 121.5 you can be pinpointed accurately AND SPOKEN TO whilst D&D carry out the above actions. The squawk isn't for my benefit as an ATCO, it's for the lost aircrafts benefit in being quickly located.
Last edited by Chilli Monster; 12th Jan 2009 at 18:25.
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The big picture
My CFI ,over 50 yrs professional flying,told me to look for the big picture,in my case the North Sea coastline.
He reckoned,go to the coast,fly along it until you know where you are then you should be OK.
Wherever you are,somewhere to the N,S,E,W will be a large feature,ie,mountain,lake,reservoir,forest,city,motorway etc.
Don't be put off by the cocky replies you get from some,most are well meaning.
Enjoy your flying.
Lister
He reckoned,go to the coast,fly along it until you know where you are then you should be OK.
Wherever you are,somewhere to the N,S,E,W will be a large feature,ie,mountain,lake,reservoir,forest,city,motorway etc.
Don't be put off by the cocky replies you get from some,most are well meaning.
Enjoy your flying.
Lister
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Buy the best moving map GPS you can afford. Learn how to establish the altitude of controlled airspace from it without having to pause for thought. Preferably wire it in to the aircraft power supply and in any event keep a spare set of batteries handy. Update the database as often as you need to (generally after any major airspace changes in the part of the world you fly in).
Fly around for the next 20 years and never be lost.
If the above plan should fail you, call D&D on 121.5 Don't try and rely on any other options at that stage. If you are lost, you are lost.
P.S. I'm in the bunker with IO540.
Fly around for the next 20 years and never be lost.
If the above plan should fail you, call D&D on 121.5 Don't try and rely on any other options at that stage. If you are lost, you are lost.
P.S. I'm in the bunker with IO540.