Which GPS??
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Which GPS??
Hi Everyone,
I was wondering if I could get your opinions and help me make up my mind. I am the proud new owner of my very first airplane, and aswell as the new Mode S Tx that I'll need to kit out my new baby with, I was also thinking of buying a GPS unit.
The thing is that there are so many available on the market, so it's difficult to make up my mind. At the moment I am toying with either the Garmin 496 or the Skymap IIIC.
Can anyone suggest some other models that they perhaps use and help me figure out the merits of one over the other?
Many thanks
I was wondering if I could get your opinions and help me make up my mind. I am the proud new owner of my very first airplane, and aswell as the new Mode S Tx that I'll need to kit out my new baby with, I was also thinking of buying a GPS unit.
The thing is that there are so many available on the market, so it's difficult to make up my mind. At the moment I am toying with either the Garmin 496 or the Skymap IIIC.
Can anyone suggest some other models that they perhaps use and help me figure out the merits of one over the other?
Many thanks
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Go for the 495 and no I dont mean 496, its the same unit without the road maps. Save yourself some cash, job done.
https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=14751
https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=14751
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The Garmins are very nice units and I have no hesitation in recommending them.
But you may need to consider a few things:
Can I mount it such that it doesn't interfere with control movement or instrument scan?
Can I use on-board electrical power or do I need to consider the battery autonomy?
Can I mount it such that the aerial has a good view of the sky (and preferably is shielded from the ground)?
Is the display bright enough and big enough to be easily read in the proposed location?
All these factors could affect your choice.
If possible, borrow some examples of the models on your short list and give them a practical trial.
But you may need to consider a few things:
Can I mount it such that it doesn't interfere with control movement or instrument scan?
Can I use on-board electrical power or do I need to consider the battery autonomy?
Can I mount it such that the aerial has a good view of the sky (and preferably is shielded from the ground)?
Is the display bright enough and big enough to be easily read in the proposed location?
All these factors could affect your choice.
If possible, borrow some examples of the models on your short list and give them a practical trial.
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Most people choose the 296 or 496/495 because Garmin already own all of aviation and will very soon own the entire world.
I have the 496 yoke-mounted (for its TAWS feature) and it is OK but the screen is small.
I also have the KMD550 MFD which is identical to a Skymap III in its map presentation and I find that much better than the Garmin. However the Skymap III has no batteries.
An absolutely key feature of a GPS is a large moving map because that is where your situational awarenes comes from.
Therefore, I would have a very good look at the Avmap EKP IV. I have not flown with it but the map beats anything else currently out.
Contrary to what many people say, especially the anti-GPS crowd, one does not interact all that much with the GPS during flight. The route is programmed in at the start and one flies the plane as normal (maintaining a heading) while tracking the magenta line. One doesn't sit there head down pressing buttons etc. And the bigger the moving map is, the more brief the interaction is because you get the essential info on a plate.
I have the 496 yoke-mounted (for its TAWS feature) and it is OK but the screen is small.
I also have the KMD550 MFD which is identical to a Skymap III in its map presentation and I find that much better than the Garmin. However the Skymap III has no batteries.
An absolutely key feature of a GPS is a large moving map because that is where your situational awarenes comes from.
Therefore, I would have a very good look at the Avmap EKP IV. I have not flown with it but the map beats anything else currently out.
Contrary to what many people say, especially the anti-GPS crowd, one does not interact all that much with the GPS during flight. The route is programmed in at the start and one flies the plane as normal (maintaining a heading) while tracking the magenta line. One doesn't sit there head down pressing buttons etc. And the bigger the moving map is, the more brief the interaction is because you get the essential info on a plate.
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I'd certainly agree with IO540 on the screen size / situational awareness. I bought a 96C, which is a noce unit (on the ground - note), but a pain the the rear to use in the air. Subsequently, I bought a 296 and it sits on top of the panel with it's nice big(ish) screen. Easy to work out what it's telling me and therefore only a quick glance now and again before looking out of the window again.
C23
C23
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I too reckon that although the screen is a little small, the Garmin 296/496 family of gps's are really terrific. Whichever you buy, you may care to get one of these to mount it
G-Force Mount
They come either as a permanent fixing (for which you will need the owner of the a/c's permission and a mod from the CAA) or with a sucker pad. The sucker pad is so effective that you can tow the a/c with it (we tried with it near the centre of the prop...) and is a darned sight more effective than the yoke mount which Garmin sell.
Whatever the legalities of GPS usage in this country, the broad distinction between the 2 and the 4 is that the 296 comes with most of the info that you need for VFR flight and the 495 comes with what you need for IFR, as well as airfield info etc. The 496 has the road database too.
As IO540 rightly says, these aren't devices which you stare at all flight long - they are a very sophisticated navigational aid which I, for one, am very grateful for.
I haven't much experience with other brands so, as ever, opinions on this subject are a bit like ar*%4oles - everyone has one.
Suffice to say that Garmin's after-sales care has, in my instance, been impeccable (replaced my 296 without a murmer which, well out of warrantee, went tech after hard use) and this alone buys my vote. Oh, Harry Mendelsohnns were great too.....
G-Force Mount
They come either as a permanent fixing (for which you will need the owner of the a/c's permission and a mod from the CAA) or with a sucker pad. The sucker pad is so effective that you can tow the a/c with it (we tried with it near the centre of the prop...) and is a darned sight more effective than the yoke mount which Garmin sell.
Whatever the legalities of GPS usage in this country, the broad distinction between the 2 and the 4 is that the 296 comes with most of the info that you need for VFR flight and the 495 comes with what you need for IFR, as well as airfield info etc. The 496 has the road database too.
As IO540 rightly says, these aren't devices which you stare at all flight long - they are a very sophisticated navigational aid which I, for one, am very grateful for.
I haven't much experience with other brands so, as ever, opinions on this subject are a bit like ar*%4oles - everyone has one.
Suffice to say that Garmin's after-sales care has, in my instance, been impeccable (replaced my 296 without a murmer which, well out of warrantee, went tech after hard use) and this alone buys my vote. Oh, Harry Mendelsohnns were great too.....
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I have a 296, there's free updates available to bring it up to almost 496 spec
saving a lot of cash, however if screen size is important, ( my 296 is sometimes difficult to read ) I'd take a look at -
Moving Terrain Air Navigation Systems AG
saving a lot of cash, however if screen size is important, ( my 296 is sometimes difficult to read ) I'd take a look at -
Moving Terrain Air Navigation Systems AG
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So if you purchased a 296, whats the main differences from that and the 496? What bits can you download for free to get it similar to the 496?
I'm not bothered about the road maps which I understand the 496 does out the box.
I'm not bothered about the road maps which I understand the 496 does out the box.
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I have had a hand held GPS since 1999. My first was a Garmin GPS Pilot 3 which was excellent. I then got a 296 which was a 'giant leap for mankind'. I found the 296 to be user friendly, simple and robust. I have also used the Skymap 3 which is somewhat dated. OK but the graphics are not brilliant.
I am also lucky enough to fly a Garmin 530/430 equipped aircraft commercially and as you would expect they are awesome. Watching a hold or an ILS happening on autopilot is just great. But you really don't need the extras that the 530 provides.
Also, I am not convinced that you need to go for a 496 or a 495. The 495/6 has many features which can only be accessed in the US. The list of UK VRPs which is a major factor for buying a 496, is available on the web to download. VFR Waypoint Add-Ons. Don't be afraid of downloading this, it is really simple. Just install the Garmin disc which comes with the 296 and follow the instructions. It is easy to delete the VRPs (in the Orkneys for example!) you don't want. The website also has all the UK DZs, glider sites, HLSs etc.
I have used a 296 for some 1000hrs now and would advise anyone to go for it, ahead of any other GPS.
I am also lucky enough to fly a Garmin 530/430 equipped aircraft commercially and as you would expect they are awesome. Watching a hold or an ILS happening on autopilot is just great. But you really don't need the extras that the 530 provides.
Also, I am not convinced that you need to go for a 496 or a 495. The 495/6 has many features which can only be accessed in the US. The list of UK VRPs which is a major factor for buying a 496, is available on the web to download. VFR Waypoint Add-Ons. Don't be afraid of downloading this, it is really simple. Just install the Garmin disc which comes with the 296 and follow the instructions. It is easy to delete the VRPs (in the Orkneys for example!) you don't want. The website also has all the UK DZs, glider sites, HLSs etc.
I have used a 296 for some 1000hrs now and would advise anyone to go for it, ahead of any other GPS.
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You really should go for the 495 (don't bother with 496) for the following reasons:
1) it updates the GPS signal 5 times per second which makes the turn co-ordinator on the panel page perfectly useable in an emergency (such as horizon failure in IMC)
2) It has Visual Reporting Points in the database. Absolutely essential if you haven't been able to pre-plan with Bottlang or whatever (I had to divert into Elstree a while back and was told to report at the "golf course" - of course when you look around in that area all you can see are frigging golf courses !! )With the 495 just hit the 'Nearest' button and then go direct to the VRP which will be listed at the top (or near top)
3) The 495/6 have 'Obstacles' in the database. Again, a brilliant feature well worth the money.
Drambuster
1) it updates the GPS signal 5 times per second which makes the turn co-ordinator on the panel page perfectly useable in an emergency (such as horizon failure in IMC)
2) It has Visual Reporting Points in the database. Absolutely essential if you haven't been able to pre-plan with Bottlang or whatever (I had to divert into Elstree a while back and was told to report at the "golf course" - of course when you look around in that area all you can see are frigging golf courses !! )With the 495 just hit the 'Nearest' button and then go direct to the VRP which will be listed at the top (or near top)
3) The 495/6 have 'Obstacles' in the database. Again, a brilliant feature well worth the money.
Drambuster
I am looking at buying a GARMIN unit. Anyone used both the 296 and the 495.
Is the extra perfomance of the 495 worth the extra cost over the 296 ?
Is the extra perfomance of the 495 worth the extra cost over the 296 ?
I went through this process 3 months - I settled for the Avmap EKP IV.
I also have it for my own plane, so it is only occasionally for use in another aircraft. This means that compactness/portability is less important.
The screen is awesome, big, clear, perfect.
I have no regrets whatsoever.
Sam.
I also have it for my own plane, so it is only occasionally for use in another aircraft. This means that compactness/portability is less important.
The screen is awesome, big, clear, perfect.
I have no regrets whatsoever.
Sam.
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I have been using Avmap EKP IV for a while and apart from rather clunky PC interface 
using C-MAP's "PC Planner" and "suspect" battery life (doesn't really matter, since I am running it from the main battery anyway) it is great.
Mine is panel mounted, using Air Gizmo mount.
Dead easy to use (once you get used to quirky menu
)
and (stiil) the largest screen.
Chris
using C-MAP's "PC Planner" and "suspect" battery life (doesn't really matter, since I am running it from the main battery anyway) it is great.Mine is panel mounted, using Air Gizmo mount.
Dead easy to use (once you get used to quirky menu
) and (stiil) the largest screen.
Chris
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Piper Cub Flyer
you can add a whole lot of stuff, choose what you want
I think, the only diff 296 / 496 that you can't update
is the airfield taxi ways, which I believe isn't available
in the UK anyway ? ( just Europe )
you can add a whole lot of stuff, choose what you want
I think, the only diff 296 / 496 that you can't update
is the airfield taxi ways, which I believe isn't available
in the UK anyway ? ( just Europe )
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I second IO540's words about a large moving map. Garmin units are nice self-contained gizmos but their screens are way too small. My preference would be something like an IBM (Lenovo) X60 or X61 convertible notebook/tablet with Jeppesen Flitedeck and a GPS receiver-only unit attached. It can be used as a kneeboard or on a gooseneck stand.
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Well....if you might want to use the GPS unit for IFR ops in the future (provided of course the UKCAA ever gets off the dime and allows same for IFR approaches) you need a panel mount unit, approved for such ops.
The Bendix-King KLN89b and KLN94 are superb for this, and quite reasonably priced...especially used 89b's
Having used a King KLN 89b for over ten years in my private aeroplane, it has supplied very reliable and accurate service.
If you want to go used, JA Air Center in the USA has KLN89b's (and a few KLN94's avialable from time to time, fully serviced and yellow tagged, and...the price is right.
J.A. Air Center - DuPage Airport - West Chicago, IL
The Bendix-King KLN89b and KLN94 are superb for this, and quite reasonably priced...especially used 89b's
Having used a King KLN 89b for over ten years in my private aeroplane, it has supplied very reliable and accurate service.
If you want to go used, JA Air Center in the USA has KLN89b's (and a few KLN94's avialable from time to time, fully serviced and yellow tagged, and...the price is right.
J.A. Air Center - DuPage Airport - West Chicago, IL
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I have been using Avmap EKP IV for a while and apart from rather clunky PC interface using C-MAP's "PC Planner"
using C-MAP's "PC Planner"
Have you tried loading routes into the Avmap from either Navbox Pro, or from Jepp's Flitestar?
My preference would be something like an IBM (Lenovo) X60 or X61 convertible notebook/tablet with Jeppesen Flitedeck and a GPS receiver-only unit attached. It can be used as a kneeboard or on a gooseneck stand.
That way you get the real printed charts running as a GPS moving map. The ultimate for VFR. But this can be pricey and is not for everybody as it isn't exactly compact.
The Bendix-King KLN89b and KLN94 are superb for this, and quite reasonably priced...especially used 89b's
Having used a King KLN 89b for over ten years in my private aeroplane, it has supplied very reliable and accurate service.
Having used a King KLN 89b for over ten years in my private aeroplane, it has supplied very reliable and accurate service.
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Originally Posted by IO540
I would agree, for very easy VFR. I use a Motion LS800 tablet for this, running various VFR charts which can be "found" in various places That way you get the real printed charts running as a GPS moving map. The ultimate for VFR. But this can be pricey and is not for everybody as it isn't exactly compact.
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Yes I have used Flitedeck. It gives you Jepp's fairly primitive enroute charts, approach plates, but the SID/STARs are not georeferenced so running them under FD is of no use.
For IFR (airways) one uses the more normal kit (GPS and ILS etc) for nav. IMHO, FD is good for passenger use, to see how well or badly the pilot is doing on the IAP
The old Jepp FliteMap product was good - that would run all the Flitestar chart representations, plus the VFR Raster Charts. They discontinued FM around 2005.
For IFR (airways) one uses the more normal kit (GPS and ILS etc) for nav. IMHO, FD is good for passenger use, to see how well or badly the pilot is doing on the IAP
The old Jepp FliteMap product was good - that would run all the Flitestar chart representations, plus the VFR Raster Charts. They discontinued FM around 2005.
Pompey till I die
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Oohhhhh
I was wondering if I could get your opinions and help me make up my mind. I am the proud new owner of my very first airplane, and aswell as the new Mode S Tx that I'll need to kit out my new baby with, I was also thinking of buying a GPS unit.