DA40 TDI Crashes in Sweden north of Gothenburg

[deice]

You're not paying attention Sternone. 50 year old designs ought to be completely sorted out already, but they aren't. You're being ignorant to the fact and complaining about a brand new design that is working hard to deliver something completely new. I fail to see what justification you have in your complaints.
Ofcourse there are issues, but your old tried-and-true types are also having problems. We all know you don't like Diamond and personally I couldn't care less if you did, but I don't see the point you're trying to make. What is your agenda? To transform everyone inte Mooney pilots? I'm sorry to say that won't happen.

Ok, Thielert/Diamond have issues. Happy?
Piper/Cessna/Beech/Mooney/Lycoming/Continental have issues too. Comprende?

[sternone]

Especially when it involves a repetitious and ultimately pointless personal vendetta against Europe's largest GA manufacturer.

Sorry, you must type and i quote some Diamond owners:

Europe's largest and World worst GA manufacturer.

[+200 No Flags]

and World worst GA manufacturer.

Prove it!

With statistics please, hearsay and personal opinions don't count.

And this time, I hope you realise changing the subject will not make you appear "cool".

[sternone]

Cool ? Haha, do you really think i'm here for coolness hahahaha, get a grip dude, you're loosing it!!

With statistics please,

According to the CEO of Diamond last year they know of 22 in flight stoppages (22 in flight!! BLIMEY!!!) and for what it counts:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=310819

[Mister Jellybean]

We'll take this very slowly.

Thielert engines have now flown in excess of 500,000 hours. In that time, as you have reminded us incessantly, they had 22 in flight stoppages. Use your calculator and work out the probability of failure per flying hour.

Now obtain some statistics for the remainder of the world's GA fleet over a representative period. Find out how many in flight stoppages there were against hours flown. Do the same calculation. When you have done this, and not before, please report back, quoting your sources.

This is called "adding value" to a debate.

[+200 No Flags]

Let me help you out a bit : what we want to see here is the total amount of flight hours since certification (per type of Diamond) versus the number of proven design-related mechanical failures for this type.

[sternone]

Ok, and what with the unacceptable downtime for example that flight school has and the last resort they have is to sue Diamond ?

If we are all really honest, and we look around, look to flight schools operating DA40's and DA42's 1.7 thielerts, we all know they have excessive downtime compared to other GA airplanes.. BE REALLY HONEST...

[+200 No Flags]

we all know they have excessive downtime compared to other GA airplanes.. BE REALLY HONEST...

Statistics please

[deice]

Ok Sternone - it appears you're ignoring my posts. We operate 5 Diamonds and have had 1 major delay due to problems with parts. The rest have been within reason. Our total of 5 airframes and 7 Thielerts should account for something (?), plus we've flown them 2000+ hrs in a year so far.

What's your story besides trying a DA42 that you thought was crap and hearing about problems through the grapevine?

[sternone]

You guys are all correct.

This place isn't for me. There are a lot of frustrated guys in aviation, and i understand why. It's sad that most of them doesn't have a real life and they become very bitter. It's a problem that in the GA scene these frustrated pople meet guys who are able to do whatever they wan't in GA. Anyway, as it is for me, it isn't for you a great loss that i stop posting on PPRuNe. I learned alot, met some great people in real life that i found on this forum. You all win, and i very much loose, you won the battle, i'm very ugly, very poor, very stupid and specially not a good pilot..please keep this in mind so you can be very happy, and i really don't care.

Luckely real life is a beatifull thing. It has been a long while ago that i must do things that i don't like in my life, and i'm not expecting to change that.

[eltonioni]

At least they have a PPL - though they may not have as many hours logged as you





Sorry, not my style but you do walk into it with your bad attitude.

[Radar]

Just one question remains ....... Why, oh why indulge this guy????? Ignore his ranting and he'll most probably disappear. It should be obvious by now the only thing he requires / craves is an audience. I know it's probably easier said than done but try it for a while. Ignore him.

[deice]

Yes that may be a solution, but I'd rather try and understand what the point is. There is always a goal somewhere. If it is to create havoc, sell something or just piss people off, there's usually something driving a person forward. In my case what I'd like people to appreciate is that something as new and different as a plastic diesel airplane will have it's problems, ESPECIALLY in the light of traditional manufacturers having problems with stuff they've done for ages.
Yes, it's terrible that people get hurt and don't receive service they're entitled to etc, but we should work together to solve problems, not bash them down. There's a guy swimming somewhere off the coast of Iceland after his Cessna 310 sporting twin Lycosauruses gave up the ghost.
Just a few days ago a female jet pilot drove her Citation into the ground killing her son in the process. Clearly aviation is dangerous business.

I now know the reason for the failure of this particular DA40 and there's a solution to it. Interestingly it applies only to the 2.0 litre engine - the 1.7 is fine. Thank goodness nobody got hurt and I sincerely hope the fix will prevent any more from coming down.
With regards to certain posters I'd enjoy a debate based on factual evidence but apparently that is not the agenda at hand.

Fly safe Sternone.

[BackPacker]

I now know the reason for the failure of this particular DA40 and there's a solution to it. Interestingly it applies only to the 2.0 litre engine - the 1.7 is fine.

This is the second time I've heard about problems with the 2.0 engine (the first one was the DA-42 at Gatwick)- and if I read between the lines of your posts it appears that it is a structural thing, and that an SB or AD is hopefully forthcoming?

I realize that you are probably not at liberty to say anything more, but do you know of any public information with regards to the (probable) cause?

From the very few bits of info that have come out of the C310 accident so far, it looks like fuel starvation or fuel exhaustion, not necessarily an engine problem. Lycomings, Continentals and Thielerts are all the same in that respect: no fuel no power. So I think it's a bit inappropriate to drag this into the debate. If you can call this a debate, that is. It starts to look more like a pissing contest. But I guess that's what you get if you invite a notorious windup into it.

[Mister Jellybean]

I now know the reason for the failure of this particular DA40 and there's a solution to it. Interestingly it applies only to the 2.0 litre engine - the 1.7 is fine.

Had this aircraft been retrofitted with the 2.0 then? This is an early DA40, it was around in 2003.

This is the second time I've heard about problems with the 2.0 engine (the first one was the DA-42 at Gatwick)

The Gatwick DA42 had 1.7 engines.

[deice]

Ok, so the C310 accident may not be mechanical, I was referring to the dangers of flight, but alright, let's leave that one out.

Are you referring to the DA42 which had a dual engine failure after take off? From what I hear they had run the battery flat and not followed proper procedure after engine start using external power. But that may be a different event.

There is an SB for the engine issue and it involves the injector tubes. The redesigned engine with 2 liter displacement has different tubes than the 1.7 and apparently they break from vibration. Bad design perhaps and not good in an aircraft ofcourse. I wouldn't want any engine to fail on me regardless the manufacturer but that's one of the problems. They do fail, lycosauruses, complimentals, teeelerts and what have you..

My dad suffered a crankshaft failure in a Seneca over the deserts of north Africa back in 75. Continental TIO360s - best in the business... As it turns out they had a problem with resonance and quite a few of them broke down back then. I'm sure Conti took a lot of flak for that problem among all the others just like Diamond and Thielert are now.
What about the notorious O320-H engine that powered many C172s in the seventies, I'm sure there are plenty of owners/pilots that have grey hairs thanks to a badly designed Lyc.

It's a ****ty business this...

[deice]

Correction - it's the high pressure fuel line that needs fixing. SB available from Thielert.

[VeriLocation]

personal thoughts on DA40tdi

As a businessman needing to travel across UK and Europe regularly we invested in a DA40 2 years ago (G1000/IFR) and in that time we have had no problems whatsoever - fact. Plus I would add that after learning to fly in Cessenas, PA28's etc it is a superb piece of engineering and ironically with so much technology onboard it actually makes it very simple to fly. It has limits sure but I can fly to mid-France and come back again without refuelling for the cost of around £50. Passengers love it because it is quiet, modern and with helicopter like visibility. Only grumble is the need for a bit more power on take off but once up above the clouds she cruises very smoothly. Agree Diamond could do more on their customer interaction but may be a cultural issue, but I have a solid , reliable, modern means of transport that cannot be matched on ease of use, speed and comfort. Compared to driving in a car around the UK there is no competition. Interesting that a lot of the negative contributors in this debate are not actually owner operators of the DA40 whereas there seems to be mostly good responses from owners. Looking forward to the DA50.

[deice]

I couldn't agree with you more VL. Once you know the G1000 this is a very low workload aircraft and it has unbeatable speed/economy over Cessna & Piper equivalents.
It is, as you say, a bit underpowered. The interesting thing is, in my experience it gets off the ground pretty quick, but takes a while to build up the climb. Handling is superb and with a couple more ponies it would be the ultimate personal/trainer aircraft. I really hope the 170hp version they're putting out this fall will deliver that.

[soay]

Originally Posted by deice

I really hope the 170hp version they're putting out this fall will deliver that.

Letting that cat out of the bag should put a damper on sales between now and then!