Young passengers/safety
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Young passengers/safety
A bloke at work has asked me to take him and his 2 kids (7 & 9 yrs) for a local flight (over his house etc) in probably a 172.
Met the youngest last night and he is (in polite terms) a bit lively ( in impolite terms,more like a Tasmanian Devil).
Have always been concerned about trying to brief kids that young with emergency evac procedures etc but not too sure about the whole thing now.Had planned to only plug in the speaker plug in headset to avoid distractions.
Not looking for 'should I stay or should I go' type advice but what are other folks exp of young pax?
MM
Met the youngest last night and he is (in polite terms) a bit lively ( in impolite terms,more like a Tasmanian Devil).
Have always been concerned about trying to brief kids that young with emergency evac procedures etc but not too sure about the whole thing now.Had planned to only plug in the speaker plug in headset to avoid distractions.
Not looking for 'should I stay or should I go' type advice but what are other folks exp of young pax?
MM
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I have just over 100hrs now - so not the most experienced pilot, but I've happily taken my kids up for a couple of years now. They are now aged 12 and 9.
I fly a 2 seater, so obviously it's only 1 at a time and so far have not found it to be a problem. Generally I think that kids on their own will behave responsibily given the type of situation, but I don't think I would take both of my kids up together in a 4 seater as they tend to wind each other up.
If you do a search then there is some pretty good advice, but what I did was take the 'little darling' on a walkround to get them involved in the whole thing, sit them in the seat to show them the controls etc and then take them back to the club to do a walkround on my own.
When doing the safety briefing I try and make it a bit of fun so as not to scare them, and on take-off and climbout I get them to sit on their hands.
Once away from the airfield mine are quite happy to take control and when I'm flying I get them to keep a sharp lookout by offering sweets etc for any planes they spot which I haven't.
So overall I haven't found it a problem - yet, and certainly the reward of smiles etc from the right-hand seat is just great.
C23
I fly a 2 seater, so obviously it's only 1 at a time and so far have not found it to be a problem. Generally I think that kids on their own will behave responsibily given the type of situation, but I don't think I would take both of my kids up together in a 4 seater as they tend to wind each other up.
If you do a search then there is some pretty good advice, but what I did was take the 'little darling' on a walkround to get them involved in the whole thing, sit them in the seat to show them the controls etc and then take them back to the club to do a walkround on my own.
When doing the safety briefing I try and make it a bit of fun so as not to scare them, and on take-off and climbout I get them to sit on their hands.
Once away from the airfield mine are quite happy to take control and when I'm flying I get them to keep a sharp lookout by offering sweets etc for any planes they spot which I haven't.
So overall I haven't found it a problem - yet, and certainly the reward of smiles etc from the right-hand seat is just great.
C23
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May I suggest you and the tamer child in the front and dad and the wild one in the back? RH seat set fully back away from any controls. If they behave well then divide the trip into two so wild child can have a turn in the front. Do one circuit first and if there is any trouble simply land and walk away. Make it clear at the outset that this is what you will do.
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Explain up fron the consequences of misbehaviour - and if in doubt don't take them.
My main worry is propellors - keep them well clear.
To be fair, I've found most kids (even wild ones) seem to quieten down around aeroplanes.
Arc
My main worry is propellors - keep them well clear.
To be fair, I've found most kids (even wild ones) seem to quieten down around aeroplanes.
Arc
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I've taken plenty of kids up. My suggestion would be that unless you know them really well, from behaviour in various situations, have an adult on board.
The pilot can't really deal with passengers while flying.
The pilot can't really deal with passengers while flying.
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Im only 15 myself so still a little kid compared to some people on here 
If the 2 children are anything like me and my brother we love to wind each other up... I would advise you to take 1 child up at a time, or stick 1 in the front and the other in the back with the farther. Make it clear to them that if they mess around you will turn back round and land
Best of luck
If the 2 children are anything like me and my brother we love to wind each other up... I would advise you to take 1 child up at a time, or stick 1 in the front and the other in the back with the farther. Make it clear to them that if they mess around you will turn back round and land
Best of luck
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Explain up fron the consequences of misbehaviour - and if in doubt don't take them.
My main worry is propellors - keep them well clear.
To be fair, I've found most kids (even wild ones) seem to quieten down around aeroplanes.
My main worry is propellors - keep them well clear.
To be fair, I've found most kids (even wild ones) seem to quieten down around aeroplanes.
They will naturally be excited when they turn up. Two walk-rounds, one by yourself and one with them is a good idea, but dont get too technical unless they keep asking questions.
Unless they are really badly brought up
, I think most kids know exactly when to behave and when they can play around and relax. At 7 and 9they are more than old enough. By explaining why they need to do exactly what you say without question, and, more importantly what not to do and why, I doubt you will have problems. Talk to them directly, not though their parents, it will have more impact. As with any first flight, take it easy at first, but I can almost guarentee that going "sideways" ie banked turns, will be very popular and produce massive grins.......Regards, SD..
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I asked the same thing about a year ago and had some pretty good advise.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=246730
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=246730
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Have taken my 13 and 11 year old neice and nephew flying. For me the key was making sure they got the maximum benefit from the experience. Explain as much as possible in undertsandable terms, involve them as much as is safe such as explain the walk around, what is safe and what isn't. Actually go through the whole pre-flight brief, e.g. fire extinguisher, first aid, opening the door.
I had massive smiles all round after the flight that included a land away (and a go around - not my fault) so they could swap over RHS.
In essence I agree with skydriller.
The more we take up, the more chance we have of encouraging the next generation.
I had massive smiles all round after the flight that included a land away (and a go around - not my fault) so they could swap over RHS.
In essence I agree with skydriller.
The more we take up, the more chance we have of encouraging the next generation.
I took the girlfriend's nephew up when he had just turned 6, a mate of mine in the front, she sat in the back with him. He was extremely well behaved throughout, and far from making noise, he was very reluctant to talk at all over the intercom, preferring to nod when asked questions like 'are you enjoying it?' in case his talking might mess something up.
In my experience (as an FI), taking up trial lessons, most people (including kids) in such an unfamiliar environment wait to be told exactly what to do and when. Sometimes frustrating, but they are very unlikely to mess about.
In my experience (as an FI), taking up trial lessons, most people (including kids) in such an unfamiliar environment wait to be told exactly what to do and when. Sometimes frustrating, but they are very unlikely to mess about.
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I was asked to take my two nephews for a jolly over the summer and took the eldest (who was 9 and loved it and behaved well). However, I declined to take the other (6 years old and spawn of the devil if ever there was one) on the grounds that he never did anything he was told by either of his parents or me. I felt that he could have constituted a danger to the safty of the aircraft and I simply couldn't be bothered to entertain an oik.
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My 3-year-old flies regularly with me. But I wouldn't fly with someone else's, and I don't do anything more than the merest local bimble with just the two of us - I always take another adult if I can.
Also, I have the sort of intercom where I can isolate the pilot position from the rest of the aircraft. Very necessary as I struggled the other day to explain to said 3-year-old why he couldn't ask me questions half way down a PAR...
Tim
Also, I have the sort of intercom where I can isolate the pilot position from the rest of the aircraft. Very necessary as I struggled the other day to explain to said 3-year-old why he couldn't ask me questions half way down a PAR...
Tim
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Maybe not quite what the original poster meant but perhaps worth discussion.
I have been flying a a while now and in latter years, have thought long and hard about flying with either my children or someone elses.
Whilst we would like to think that we take great care and that our form of sport is very safe, I believe that I take a calulated risk every time I fly in a private aircraft. As an adult I have the opportunity and capability to weigh that risk, a child does not.
My personal decision is not to take children flying.
I have been flying a a while now and in latter years, have thought long and hard about flying with either my children or someone elses.
Whilst we would like to think that we take great care and that our form of sport is very safe, I believe that I take a calulated risk every time I fly in a private aircraft. As an adult I have the opportunity and capability to weigh that risk, a child does not.
My personal decision is not to take children flying.
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Decisions
Strake,I take your point and have dicussed this with the father and like most matters concerning his children he makes the decisions for them at that tender age ( I guess like he does for car journeys,kids rugby etc).
Thanks for the input.
MM
Thanks for the input.
MM
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Totally agree with your approach modelman. I did exactly the same thing after I started flying and taking friends and family up for a trip.
It's a path we have to tread to give our children experience and excitement balanced with caution.
I'm sure your friends kids will behave well and enjoy the experience...as will you.
It's a path we have to tread to give our children experience and excitement balanced with caution.
I'm sure your friends kids will behave well and enjoy the experience...as will you.
mm,
I've done some young eagles flights in a C140, plus my own 5-year old, and I've taken a co-workers 6 & 8 year olds up in a glider. The conclusion I've come to is that a short first flight is the best. Even 15 minutes is a world of new sensations to a kid. They may well not know the difference between 15 minutes and an hour assuming they enjoy it. It's better to bring them back early, and have them desiring more than to go too long. With a short flight you can make a good assessment of what to do with them next time, if there is a next time.
-- IFMU
I've done some young eagles flights in a C140, plus my own 5-year old, and I've taken a co-workers 6 & 8 year olds up in a glider. The conclusion I've come to is that a short first flight is the best. Even 15 minutes is a world of new sensations to a kid. They may well not know the difference between 15 minutes and an hour assuming they enjoy it. It's better to bring them back early, and have them desiring more than to go too long. With a short flight you can make a good assessment of what to do with them next time, if there is a next time.
-- IFMU
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Modelman
I've no experience of taking children flying (only taken adults) but I do have a lot of experience of handling kids.
If you do decide to take them, make your 'rules' absolutely clear before you even set off for the airfield and make it clear to them and their parents that if they don't follow the 'rules', the flight is off.
In a related situation, my sister was due to take young relatives of a similar age horse riding. Older child was OK, but younger was a little horror so my sister explained carefully what was expected of them.
When they arrived younger child started 'kicking off' and shouting about which horse to ride, etc and my sister turned on her heel and said we are going home.
The little horror's mother was upset and promised he would behave, but my sister said she'd made her position clear at the beginning and couldn't trust the child to behave around unpredictable animals.
I've no experience of taking children flying (only taken adults) but I do have a lot of experience of handling kids.
If you do decide to take them, make your 'rules' absolutely clear before you even set off for the airfield and make it clear to them and their parents that if they don't follow the 'rules', the flight is off.
In a related situation, my sister was due to take young relatives of a similar age horse riding. Older child was OK, but younger was a little horror so my sister explained carefully what was expected of them.
When they arrived younger child started 'kicking off' and shouting about which horse to ride, etc and my sister turned on her heel and said we are going home.
The little horror's mother was upset and promised he would behave, but my sister said she'd made her position clear at the beginning and couldn't trust the child to behave around unpredictable animals.
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The little horror's mother was upset and promised he would behave, but my sister said she'd made her position clear at the beginning and couldn't trust the child to behave around unpredictable animals.
Make sure the children understand the rules and that you will turn straight back if they mis behave.
Best of luck
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Hm
I've been coaching young people for several years, and sadly, in today's climate, a VERY firm rule I have is ALWAYS make sure there's another adult present at ALL times - and preferably the young person's mother.
NEVER be alone with someone else's child, not even for a few seconds, not even if they are your closest friends or even relatives.
Having said that, if you are competent and the parents have weighed the risks, and you are properly insured, this will a great experience you will all remember for ever.
Best Wishes
SD
I've been coaching young people for several years, and sadly, in today's climate, a VERY firm rule I have is ALWAYS make sure there's another adult present at ALL times - and preferably the young person's mother.
NEVER be alone with someone else's child, not even for a few seconds, not even if they are your closest friends or even relatives.
Having said that, if you are competent and the parents have weighed the risks, and you are properly insured, this will a great experience you will all remember for ever.
Best Wishes
SD