Radio call before engine startup
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Radio call before engine startup
During my PPL, we allways did our engine startup and checks before putting in a call to ATC, but I just wondered what other pilots view would be on calling ATC, and then doing the engine startup, plus reasons for and against it?
Depends on the type of ATS at the airfield.
If it's Air/Ground Radio only, then I think you're fine doing what you've always done.
A full ATC will probably want you to request an engine start. Same goes for an Information service, I think?
If it's Air/Ground Radio only, then I think you're fine doing what you've always done.
A full ATC will probably want you to request an engine start. Same goes for an Information service, I think?
Pompey till I die
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I flew from an "information" ATS
From where I fly the AFIS want a call before you start taxiying, rather than before engine start. I was lead to believe that aircraft batteries were not that adept at supplying lots of electrical items and so you really don't want to switch the radio on until the alternator is running.
Certainly when I do my alpha check (pitot heater, landing light, stall warner etc) I don't leave these items on for very long as the engine is not running at this point.
Who knows about big 747's etc ?
Certainly when I do my alpha check (pitot heater, landing light, stall warner etc) I don't leave these items on for very long as the engine is not running at this point.
Who knows about big 747's etc ?
Blah Blah Blah
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It all depends on the operations procedure for the airfield. Nothing to do with the type of ATC.
Example:
Ronaldsway Isle of Man. Start her up and do what you got to do, then request taxi and departuer information
Bristol Filton. Pre start checks, call for engine start permission, start her up and do what you go to do, then request taxi and departure information.
Example:
Ronaldsway Isle of Man. Start her up and do what you got to do, then request taxi and departuer information
Bristol Filton. Pre start checks, call for engine start permission, start her up and do what you go to do, then request taxi and departure information.
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I tend to call for start at any airfield I've not started at before unless you can hear that the procedure is otherwise from the RT.
as gcolyer says, nothing to do with the type of ATC, if they're radio and have parachute dropping they'll probably want you to call for start.
as gcolyer says, nothing to do with the type of ATC, if they're radio and have parachute dropping they'll probably want you to call for start.
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The idea behind it is to avoid your starting engines and then AT telling you they cant get you away for half an hour. Depending on the aircraft it is a major hassle to shut everything down again (although not so for most of us).
As others have said it therefore really comes down to the airport. At anything reasonably large you will probably have called AT from ops to book out anyway so just ask then if they require a start up call when you are on the 'phone to them.
I suppose if you are not sure it just as easy to ask before, but the worst that can happen if you start without doing so is you call for taxi to be told there will be half an hours delay. Guess you will just shut down again in that case.
(Edited to add having just read the question properly)
I guess you could save yourself a cup of fuel if there are some checks you can get out of the way before startup. For example it is interesting some people start and then sit on the pad fiddling around putting their route into the GPS which if it is complicated make take a while when this could all be done with the engines off.
However on some types (with glass cockpits) watch you dont drain the battery whilst doing so.
Also, you will see plenty of people call for startup and then start with all the avionics still switched on,
and finally in the winter when it is cold running the engine for a while longer on the pad may be no bad thing anyway to bring it up to operating temp.
In short, all down to the circumstances.
As others have said it therefore really comes down to the airport. At anything reasonably large you will probably have called AT from ops to book out anyway so just ask then if they require a start up call when you are on the 'phone to them.
I suppose if you are not sure it just as easy to ask before, but the worst that can happen if you start without doing so is you call for taxi to be told there will be half an hours delay. Guess you will just shut down again in that case.
(Edited to add having just read the question properly)
I guess you could save yourself a cup of fuel if there are some checks you can get out of the way before startup. For example it is interesting some people start and then sit on the pad fiddling around putting their route into the GPS which if it is complicated make take a while when this could all be done with the engines off.
However on some types (with glass cockpits) watch you dont drain the battery whilst doing so.
Also, you will see plenty of people call for startup and then start with all the avionics still switched on,
and finally in the winter when it is cold running the engine for a while longer on the pad may be no bad thing anyway to bring it up to operating temp.
In short, all down to the circumstances.
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In airfields where startup needs radio permission I use the trusty Icom:Same applies to getting the ATIS: saves on a/c batteries I imagine.......
And confirms the Icom is working in case it's needed in anger later in the flight.
Safe (and informed) flying
Cusco
And confirms the Icom is working in case it's needed in anger later in the flight.
Safe (and informed) flying
Cusco
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Normally it is broadcast on the ATIS or in some flight guide or other.....
If in doubt at an ATC field, call for start and even if you didn't have to they will clear you to start. I think I have done it once in 7 years?
If in doubt at an ATC field, call for start and even if you didn't have to they will clear you to start. I think I have done it once in 7 years?
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Biggin Hill does not require a call before start up, or didn't when I did my training there a couple of years ago.
As Fuji Abound says, the best thing to do is to ask when you come to book out, either in the ops room or talking to the tower on the phone.
Cheers,
CapCon
As Fuji Abound says, the best thing to do is to ask when you come to book out, either in the ops room or talking to the tower on the phone.
Cheers,
CapCon
I'd always call for start for a airways flight with a possibility of a slot (saves starting and then shutting down!). I would also tend to call for start for IFR where a clearance needs to be coordinated with Approach or another agency. It gives ATC more time to sort it out. Otherwise only if specifically required by AIP.
I've always understood that it can damage a radio if the starter is used when the radio is switched on. Something to do with spikes, I was told.
I once had an engine stop on final and we had to advise ATC that we were switching off the radio before restarting the engine to taxi clear.
I once had an engine stop on final and we had to advise ATC that we were switching off the radio before restarting the engine to taxi clear.
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I would always call for start clearance, irrespective of where I was at, if for no other reason than to advise others of the fact. There is also the comfort in knowing that if you have a problem on start up - engine fire? cabin fire? that you know the radio is working when you start calling for help!
Pulse 1, I've never heard of 'spikes' from starting an aircraft with the radio switched on. Likewise, if your battery cannot sustain a couple of calls whilst on the ground, then I would suggest that you have something wrong somewhere!!
The Winco
Pulse 1, I've never heard of 'spikes' from starting an aircraft with the radio switched on. Likewise, if your battery cannot sustain a couple of calls whilst on the ground, then I would suggest that you have something wrong somewhere!!
The Winco
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Originally Posted by tangovictor
I also was taught, never start or stop the engine with the radio on, due to spikes
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In Europe, thought you only needed to call for start-up clearance if you were on an IFR flight plan?
Post 9-11, in the States, you have to call before start even VFR at the majors (I had to do it at Salt Lake City one time), but for security reasons.
Post 9-11, in the States, you have to call before start even VFR at the majors (I had to do it at Salt Lake City one time), but for security reasons.
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I have never had to call up and request an engine start - VFR or IFR. Nor have I ever read it in the AF/D when reviewing an airfield's info. (at least in California).
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Current RAF practice, even on Elementary training aeroplanes - Grob Tutors and the like, is to have radios on pre-start, local procedures will dictate whether they are also checked pre-start. Does mean you have someone to squeel to in the unlikely event of a fire on startup, although that's obviously only a factor if at an airfield with fire cover!
However, as the avionics fitted are relatively new and shiney, they may, for all I know, have built in over- and under-voltage protection, that may be lacking in older radios. That's based on absolutely knowledge of avionics design, a pure unadulterated guess!
However, as the avionics fitted are relatively new and shiney, they may, for all I know, have built in over- and under-voltage protection, that may be lacking in older radios. That's based on absolutely knowledge of avionics design, a pure unadulterated guess!
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Many people have mentioned "spikes" when starting the engine with the avionics still on, so what if you turned the radio stack off quickly while you started the engine? Admitedly, you would be out of radio contact for a minute or so, but...