What To Do In Event Of A Radio Failure
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What To Do In Event Of A Radio Failure
Hi all,
The best thing to do in the event of a radio failure is to divert to the nearest suitable airfield i understand in the context of vfr flights in uncontrolled airspace. But what if the nearest airfield is a large, business airport with aircraft such as 737s etc in and out - e.g. coventry/Cambridge. What is the best practice to adopt when approaching to land at somewhere like this with a radio failure without encountering big problems?
Additionally, what if you are already established in the circuit - say downwind, and you encounter a radio failure, what is the best thing to do if you are not absolutly certain there is not an aircraft on finals that you cant see due to its distance/haze etc? I, at that stage would think it best to call it a day with that airport and try somewhere smaller and quieter?
This has been causing me some problems having only recently qualified and wanting to 'get out there' into the big wide world of flying!
Any help and advice appreciated.
Regards
The best thing to do in the event of a radio failure is to divert to the nearest suitable airfield i understand in the context of vfr flights in uncontrolled airspace. But what if the nearest airfield is a large, business airport with aircraft such as 737s etc in and out - e.g. coventry/Cambridge. What is the best practice to adopt when approaching to land at somewhere like this with a radio failure without encountering big problems?
Additionally, what if you are already established in the circuit - say downwind, and you encounter a radio failure, what is the best thing to do if you are not absolutly certain there is not an aircraft on finals that you cant see due to its distance/haze etc? I, at that stage would think it best to call it a day with that airport and try somewhere smaller and quieter?
This has been causing me some problems having only recently qualified and wanting to 'get out there' into the big wide world of flying!
Any help and advice appreciated.
Regards
Pompey till I die
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Ask for your money back...
In the event of a radio failure, as you point out, you divert to the nearest airfield. Even if that is Heathrow or Gatwick it is far far safer to divert and just jump straight onto finals. These major airports are set up for this.
If you are already in the circuit then your PPL instructor should have informed you of proper procedure. This is generally to fly as low and slow as you can, before bailing out with passengers and leaving the aircraft to ditch and crash.
If you got a PPL and don't know this then you've been ripped off!
If you are already in the circuit then your PPL instructor should have informed you of proper procedure. This is generally to fly as low and slow as you can, before bailing out with passengers and leaving the aircraft to ditch and crash.
If you got a PPL and don't know this then you've been ripped off!
Land in the nearest field then call the tower from your mobile.
This is much, MUCH easier if you're in a helicopter.
PS For a slightly more serious answer, squawk 7600 and make sure that you know what the light signals from the tower mean.
This is much, MUCH easier if you're in a helicopter.
PS For a slightly more serious answer, squawk 7600 and make sure that you know what the light signals from the tower mean.
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"In the event of a radio failure, as you point out, you divert to the nearest airfield. Even if that is Heathrow or Gatwick it is far far safer to divert and just jump straight onto finals. These major airports are set up for this.
If you are already in the circuit then your PPL instructor should have informed you of proper procedure. This is generally to fly as low and slow as you can, before bailing out with passengers and leaving the aircraft to ditch and crash.
If you got a PPL and don't know this then you've been ripped off!"
You can not be serious - What if you are in class G - What if you are outside the controlled airspace etc What about your transponder ? What a daft reply, esp the ripped off bit
If you are already in the circuit then your PPL instructor should have informed you of proper procedure. This is generally to fly as low and slow as you can, before bailing out with passengers and leaving the aircraft to ditch and crash.
If you got a PPL and don't know this then you've been ripped off!"
You can not be serious - What if you are in class G - What if you are outside the controlled airspace etc What about your transponder ? What a daft reply, esp the ripped off bit
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Squawk 7600, if cross country, then avoid controlled airspace, if your in controlled airspace doing circuits, then pay attention for light signals from tower...always, always, make blind calls as at this point, your transmitter may be working, you just won't know it.
It may sound daft but if you have a mobile phone then, I would use it, some form of communication is better than none.
alternatively, try box 2!
It may sound daft but if you have a mobile phone then, I would use it, some form of communication is better than none.
alternatively, try box 2!
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Pompey,
That's a bit harsh. The reality of the radio failure rules is that they are very much open to interperation.
After all, what is the nearest "appropriate" airport? Appropriate in who's opinion? Not all circumstances are black and white. I'm not sure what you think the rules are here, but it sounds to me like your instructor has told you something and you've taken it as correct, while Basin has actually gone and read the AIP. The general advice offered in the AIP is very much open to interperation.
While certain airports may not seem appropriate when first thought of, but if you're on final set up for landing and 1 mile to touch down in good clear VMC, it may be more appropriate to squwak 7600 & land there than head off out through controlled airspace, through danger areas or ATZ's simply because it's the only way out or quickest way out.
In my opinion, it comes down to down to doing what is most sensible. If you can justify it afterwards as the most sensible option, then you made the correct decison.
When thinking about such situations, there are a lot of things to factor in. For example, if the unit you are working has radar, then squwaking 7600 can let everyone know what is going on and get other stuff moved out of your way. Even if they don't have radar, then it can still help, as the message may get passed on to the appropriate unit by someone with radar.
Don't forget that many large airports will have the coloured lamps (the name of which, I've forgotton) to give you signals.
Large airports often have specific radio failure proceedures, which you will find in the AIP entry. When flying to one of these airports, I always print out the AIP entry and bring it with me, just in case.
Often with a radio failue you can receive, but not transmit, or vise versa. When you can receive, ATC will sometimes ask you to do inventive stuff. One I heard of last year was where a pilot squwked 7600, and ATC said "If you can hear this then squwak ident." After that clearance to land was given.
Making blind transmittions can help too.
The other thing to consider is that perhaps you haven't had a radio failure at all. Perhaps you've had an alternator failure, which seems to be a very common failure. This could mean that your batter has simply run low. Check it. If it's the case, turning off everything else electrial may be enough to get you one or two more transmittions which may help you a lot!
There are lots of variables, which can lead to sensible decisons which might not seem so sensible on a casual first look.
dp
That's a bit harsh. The reality of the radio failure rules is that they are very much open to interperation.
After all, what is the nearest "appropriate" airport? Appropriate in who's opinion? Not all circumstances are black and white. I'm not sure what you think the rules are here, but it sounds to me like your instructor has told you something and you've taken it as correct, while Basin has actually gone and read the AIP. The general advice offered in the AIP is very much open to interperation.
While certain airports may not seem appropriate when first thought of, but if you're on final set up for landing and 1 mile to touch down in good clear VMC, it may be more appropriate to squwak 7600 & land there than head off out through controlled airspace, through danger areas or ATZ's simply because it's the only way out or quickest way out.
In my opinion, it comes down to down to doing what is most sensible. If you can justify it afterwards as the most sensible option, then you made the correct decison.
When thinking about such situations, there are a lot of things to factor in. For example, if the unit you are working has radar, then squwaking 7600 can let everyone know what is going on and get other stuff moved out of your way. Even if they don't have radar, then it can still help, as the message may get passed on to the appropriate unit by someone with radar.
Don't forget that many large airports will have the coloured lamps (the name of which, I've forgotton) to give you signals.
Large airports often have specific radio failure proceedures, which you will find in the AIP entry. When flying to one of these airports, I always print out the AIP entry and bring it with me, just in case.
Often with a radio failue you can receive, but not transmit, or vise versa. When you can receive, ATC will sometimes ask you to do inventive stuff. One I heard of last year was where a pilot squwked 7600, and ATC said "If you can hear this then squwak ident." After that clearance to land was given.
Making blind transmittions can help too.
The other thing to consider is that perhaps you haven't had a radio failure at all. Perhaps you've had an alternator failure, which seems to be a very common failure. This could mean that your batter has simply run low. Check it. If it's the case, turning off everything else electrial may be enough to get you one or two more transmittions which may help you a lot!
There are lots of variables, which can lead to sensible decisons which might not seem so sensible on a casual first look.
dp
Pompey till I die
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I'm saying if you got a PPL and don't know this stuff then something is amiss.The poster is probably the sort of person who agonises over whether to wear epaulettes or not to their flight school.
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Have the telephone number of the Rescue Co-ordination Centre (Kinloss) in your mobile phone.....and call them. They can triangulate your position and give you the nearest suitable airfield.
I kid you not, many years ago I worked at a Radar Unit and a German F4 had a total electrics & hydraulics failure. Using a mobile phone he was vectored to a military airfield equipped with a cable, where he made a safe landing having 'blown' the gear down and using the arrestor cable to stop.
I kid you not, many years ago I worked at a Radar Unit and a German F4 had a total electrics & hydraulics failure. Using a mobile phone he was vectored to a military airfield equipped with a cable, where he made a safe landing having 'blown' the gear down and using the arrestor cable to stop.
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Snide comments
Quote:
"The poster is probably the sort of person who agonises over whether to wear epaulettes or not to their flight school."
You got your licence yet mate?
MM
"The poster is probably the sort of person who agonises over whether to wear epaulettes or not to their flight school."
You got your licence yet mate?
MM
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Hard to believe that a GA spamcan with a duff radio, in Class G, should divert anywhere at all. You can fly non-radio in Class G! Just continue to destination, and land using the standard procedure (whatever that is, say overfly the runway at 500ft and then join the circuit).
In controlled airspace, on a VFR flight, one would fly the current clearance until it is exhausted, then continue on the filed (or, more likely, the previous notified) route. In the UK, that is likely to take out out of CAS.
In practice, this can lead to complications, and getting into a busy airfield on a sunny Sunday can be hard. I had a radio failure in the circuit during PPL training (solo) and bought a handheld radio immediately. I still carry it, with a backup GPS, in the emergency bag. It has a headset adaptor and a velcro PTT switch.
In the event of a radio failure, as you point out, you divert to the nearest airfield. Even if that is Heathrow or Gatwick it is far far safer to divert and just jump straight onto finals. These major airports are set up for this
is simply unbelievable.
In controlled airspace, on a VFR flight, one would fly the current clearance until it is exhausted, then continue on the filed (or, more likely, the previous notified) route. In the UK, that is likely to take out out of CAS.
In practice, this can lead to complications, and getting into a busy airfield on a sunny Sunday can be hard. I had a radio failure in the circuit during PPL training (solo) and bought a handheld radio immediately. I still carry it, with a backup GPS, in the emergency bag. It has a headset adaptor and a velcro PTT switch.
In the event of a radio failure, as you point out, you divert to the nearest airfield. Even if that is Heathrow or Gatwick it is far far safer to divert and just jump straight onto finals. These major airports are set up for this
is simply unbelievable.
The Original Whirly
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PompeyPaul,
If you meant to be serious, which I doubt...well, words fail me. if you meant to be funny, it wasn't! The poster asked a serious question, to which the answer was not obvious. If you can't be bothered to answer, then just leave it to someone else who can.
I agree with IO540. But squawk 7600 and make radio calls anyway, since that way someone should get the message. And get a handheld radio and keep it in your flightbag, then you won't have to worry.
If you meant to be serious, which I doubt...well, words fail me. if you meant to be funny, it wasn't! The poster asked a serious question, to which the answer was not obvious. If you can't be bothered to answer, then just leave it to someone else who can.
I agree with IO540. But squawk 7600 and make radio calls anyway, since that way someone should get the message. And get a handheld radio and keep it in your flightbag, then you won't have to worry.
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That IS the first sensible answer. (IOs)
In fact (and forgive me if I sound pompous) but I find myself posting less on PPRuNe because of the "quality" of so many more of the threads these days. Is it a worrying indication of the training new pilots are receiving or is it the increased tendency to post wind ups - which are fine only if they are amusing or helpfully provactive rather than just daft.
Any way most GA will spend most of its time outside CAS - I assume this is what BASIN had in mind. It seems to me an awful lot of pilots dont talk to anyone ouside CAS anyway (not something I personally agree with, but there it is) so if you are one of them, you are hardly going to notice your radio has failed. Why therefore, or indeed what do you think you would achieve by diverting, I have no idea. Therefore continue en route to your planned destination and which presumably you will know the procedures to follow in the event of a RF.
If you are flying IFR or in CAS or are cleared for appraoch you will know the rules, which are quite clear and you will be expected to comply.
Anyone who is flying regularly including in IMC and CAS would do well to consider carrying a spare hand held.
In fact (and forgive me if I sound pompous) but I find myself posting less on PPRuNe because of the "quality" of so many more of the threads these days. Is it a worrying indication of the training new pilots are receiving or is it the increased tendency to post wind ups - which are fine only if they are amusing or helpfully provactive rather than just daft.
Any way most GA will spend most of its time outside CAS - I assume this is what BASIN had in mind. It seems to me an awful lot of pilots dont talk to anyone ouside CAS anyway (not something I personally agree with, but there it is) so if you are one of them, you are hardly going to notice your radio has failed. Why therefore, or indeed what do you think you would achieve by diverting, I have no idea. Therefore continue en route to your planned destination and which presumably you will know the procedures to follow in the event of a RF.
If you are flying IFR or in CAS or are cleared for appraoch you will know the rules, which are quite clear and you will be expected to comply.
Anyone who is flying regularly including in IMC and CAS would do well to consider carrying a spare hand held.
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Agree with IO, but with one slight variation. As you fly to your destination, you dig out your Icom, plug in your headset and this makes things less unusual. If you are landing non radio (which many pilots do all the time so it is not a big deal) remember to use the signal square.
Rod1
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This very scenario happened to me as I was about to ask for joining instructions at my home airfield (radio aircraft only airfield no radar). In the heat of the moment I couldn't remember whether to squawk 7600 or 7500 and since I didn't want to be met by all three emergency services and an armed response team I decided to see if I could find the problem. Discovered wire had come off the PTT switch so Dad (who was my passenger) leant me his Swiss army knife I peeled back the insulation and held the ends of the wire together to make my calls.
Pompey till I die
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Erm?!
Snide Comments
Quote:
"The poster is probably the sort of person who agonises over whether to wear epaulettes or not to their flight school."
Quote:
"The poster is probably the sort of person who agonises over whether to wear epaulettes or not to their flight school."
You got your licence yet mate?
MM
MM
Squawk 7600. Transmit blind. Go back to the previous live channel, try switching coms, try another channel, try 121.5, use your mobile to phone the tower \ approach. DO NOT ENTER CONTROLLED AIRSPACE! Keep transmitting as usual but make it clear you are transmitting blind.
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Pompey, are we all blessed with your ability to know everything?
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=283747
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=283747
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As has been said, carrying a handheld radio, with headset adapter if possible, goes a long way to taking the stress out of the situation ... however, if you've had the unit for a few years, just make sure that the battery hasn't degraded to the point where you get a lot less life out of it than you are expecting, even if you know you've charged it up properly !
Actual experience is a great "smug feeling" remover ..
FF
Actual experience is a great "smug feeling" remover ..
FF