Cessna crash Bristol area
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I was in the Bristol zone at the time, as weather (mostly localised showers)approached from the south. I turned back north in the Chew Valley area. Around 10 minutes later, a more local aircraft went to see if anything could be seen. Contact had been lost with a 150 (out of Clutton Hill) and 'someone had seen something out of their window'. I then left the frequency as I moved north. I hope everything was OK there. 
Bluesky
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Some rather bad news;
BBC NEWS | England | Bristol | Crash pilot had 'taken ecstasy'
A pilot who died when he crashed in a field killing his teenage passenger had taken an illegal drug just hours before the accident, it has emerged.
The Air Accident Investigations Branch (AAIB) said Robert Gunter, 33, was found to have had ecstasy in his blood.
The report into last July's crash said the drug would have impaired his judgement and ability. The father of 13-year-old Jamie Clapp, who also died, expressed his anger at the pilot, who was a family friend.
BBC NEWS | England | Bristol | Crash pilot had 'taken ecstasy'
A pilot who died when he crashed in a field killing his teenage passenger had taken an illegal drug just hours before the accident, it has emerged.
The Air Accident Investigations Branch (AAIB) said Robert Gunter, 33, was found to have had ecstasy in his blood.
The report into last July's crash said the drug would have impaired his judgement and ability. The father of 13-year-old Jamie Clapp, who also died, expressed his anger at the pilot, who was a family friend.
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I think that story actually relates to a crash last July - BBC NEWS | England | Somerset | Two dead in light aircraft crash
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I think that story actually relates to a crash last July -
That explains the circling aircraft abouve where I live. I did see a 150 extremely low flying over my house before hand!!
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http://www.aaib.gov.uk/cms_resources...FCI%2007-8.pdf
Interesting reading. This chap seems to have been the master of his own destiny and his demise was ultimately self-inflicted. The tragedy is that he took an innocent passenger with him.
Unfortunately, muppets like the so called 'commander' of this flight provide a strong case for increased regulation of private pilots (possibly including random alcohol / drug testing and regular checkrides with instructors) and bolster opposition to general aviation. This would be an unfortunate burden on GA, the majority of PPLs being far more responsible and capable.
Interesting reading. This chap seems to have been the master of his own destiny and his demise was ultimately self-inflicted. The tragedy is that he took an innocent passenger with him.
Unfortunately, muppets like the so called 'commander' of this flight provide a strong case for increased regulation of private pilots (possibly including random alcohol / drug testing and regular checkrides with instructors) and bolster opposition to general aviation. This would be an unfortunate burden on GA, the majority of PPLs being far more responsible and capable.
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Unfortunately, muppets like the so called 'commander' of this flight provide a strong case for increased regulation of private pilots
"Don't do that", move along, nothing to see here...
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taking ecstasy is already illegal
I don't foresee widespread random testing in GA as I don't expect the CAA, police or anyone else would wish to bear the cost. RAF pilots are routinely randomly tested and I do not know a single one who thinks it unreasonable. Perhaps a hair, blood, or piss-test should be part of the CAA medical.
Last edited by Fg Off Max Stout; 11th Jul 2008 at 18:11.
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It might indeed be difficult to accept that other people are responsible for their own actions, whatever the outcome, but such is life. I don't see a case being made for anything based on this accident.
Pilots crashing while intoxicated is, luckily, rare, and effects very few. The big brother society on the other hand is ever present, influencing everyone, always expanding; all due to "well meaning" individuals finding "strong cases" for further regulation or enforcement whenever someone has to face the unfortunate consequences of their own, voluntary actions.
We hear complaints every day, everywhere, and rightfully in my view, of the 'nanny state' modern society has become. Witness in this thread how that comes about. The worst results, founded on what is genuinely (but wrongfully) believed to be "the best intentions".
I am an optimist though; I think drug screening of private pilots going about their own business will not happen, because it is a bad idea. Now, let's find an actual problem to solve.
What I think might be the best lesson from this accident is to be very, very careful when choosing who to go fly with; let alone who to let your children fly with. The risks of general aviation vary dramatically depending on the pilot and the standard to which he/she operates, to the point where accident statistics as a measure of risk is quite useless. The real risk will be orders of magnitudes lower --- or higher.
Pilots crashing while intoxicated is, luckily, rare, and effects very few. The big brother society on the other hand is ever present, influencing everyone, always expanding; all due to "well meaning" individuals finding "strong cases" for further regulation or enforcement whenever someone has to face the unfortunate consequences of their own, voluntary actions.
We hear complaints every day, everywhere, and rightfully in my view, of the 'nanny state' modern society has become. Witness in this thread how that comes about. The worst results, founded on what is genuinely (but wrongfully) believed to be "the best intentions".
I am an optimist though; I think drug screening of private pilots going about their own business will not happen, because it is a bad idea. Now, let's find an actual problem to solve.
What I think might be the best lesson from this accident is to be very, very careful when choosing who to go fly with; let alone who to let your children fly with. The risks of general aviation vary dramatically depending on the pilot and the standard to which he/she operates, to the point where accident statistics as a measure of risk is quite useless. The real risk will be orders of magnitudes lower --- or higher.
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He's not, now he's dead, but maybe others will. My point being that this need not have happened in the first place. It wasn't that cryptic surely! I shed no tears for the pilot but the passenger's death is appalling and a direct result of the pilot's negligence.
The pilot should not have been allowed to fly for a number of reasons, primarily his lack of ability, lack of airmanship and use of drugs. The first two were highlighted to the CAA but not acted upon. The latter could have been detected if a suitable system was in place.
I do not believe that drug testing for pilots constitutes some nanny-state big brother meddling - in my opinion it is one fundamental criterion of suitability to operate aircraft. Are policemen breathalyzing drivers infringing the drivers' rights to privacy? Are simulator assessments of ability for professional pilots big brother meddling? This is a flight safety issue and as such probably deserves a bit more consideration than
Some aircraft accidents will always happen, but easily preventable ones should be averted!
The pilot should not have been allowed to fly for a number of reasons, primarily his lack of ability, lack of airmanship and use of drugs. The first two were highlighted to the CAA but not acted upon. The latter could have been detected if a suitable system was in place.
I do not believe that drug testing for pilots constitutes some nanny-state big brother meddling - in my opinion it is one fundamental criterion of suitability to operate aircraft. Are policemen breathalyzing drivers infringing the drivers' rights to privacy? Are simulator assessments of ability for professional pilots big brother meddling? This is a flight safety issue and as such probably deserves a bit more consideration than
Some aircraft accidents will always happen, but easily preventable ones should be averted!
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Random drugs testing would not have stopped this guy, any more than random breath testing stops the hard core drink drivers, who continue to drink drive despite losing their licences etc until they are jailed. Anyone who takes ecstacy then flies doesn't care much for rules.
The incentive to "stay clean" that random testing generates doesn't work in this arena. Professional pilot/ RAF- loss of career (in people who are by their nature career focussed this is obviously major), loss of driving licence - major pain in the ass for most people, loss of PPL - not the end of the world.
Testing in CAA medicals is also fairly pointless -hair will give a marijuana trace for months but nothing else, urine & blood is indetectable for most substances a few days after "indulging", its pretty easy to fudge a medical every few years.
May I also mention - look at the fuss over this because he took ecstacy. Why has no-one mentioned the alcohol associated deaths in this months AAIB bulletin? And last months? Not news, is it - but kills far more people. Maybe we should have a breathalyser attached to the starter, at least pissed people will then have to prop swing and thereby kill themselves before take off!
The incentive to "stay clean" that random testing generates doesn't work in this arena. Professional pilot/ RAF- loss of career (in people who are by their nature career focussed this is obviously major), loss of driving licence - major pain in the ass for most people, loss of PPL - not the end of the world.
Testing in CAA medicals is also fairly pointless -hair will give a marijuana trace for months but nothing else, urine & blood is indetectable for most substances a few days after "indulging", its pretty easy to fudge a medical every few years.
May I also mention - look at the fuss over this because he took ecstacy. Why has no-one mentioned the alcohol associated deaths in this months AAIB bulletin? And last months?
Not news, is it - but kills far more people. Maybe we should have a breathalyser attached to the starter, at least pissed people will then have to prop swing and thereby kill themselves before take off!
"Eight hours from bottle to throttle" is a well-known, if inaccurate, measure of how long it takes for alcohol; to leave the bloodstream but what is the timescale for ectasy? Never done drugs so I've no feel for how long this might be.