Royal Flights
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: Slightly left of centreline
Royal Flights
Hi,
I am interested to know how members of the General Aviation fraternity brief themselves on Royal Flights that may be taking place, before they get airborne. I know that RAF Units have a Safeguard procedure for Royal and Selected Helicopter Flights and will inform local airfields and Flying Clubs when they take place, but this procedure does not cover fixed wing Royal Flights.
Do you have a telephone number to call prior to flight, or do you talk to the nearest agency once airborne?
Any input would be gratefully received.
Thanks
Raven
I am interested to know how members of the General Aviation fraternity brief themselves on Royal Flights that may be taking place, before they get airborne. I know that RAF Units have a Safeguard procedure for Royal and Selected Helicopter Flights and will inform local airfields and Flying Clubs when they take place, but this procedure does not cover fixed wing Royal Flights.
Do you have a telephone number to call prior to flight, or do you talk to the nearest agency once airborne?
Any input would be gratefully received.
Thanks
Raven
Joined: Jul 2002
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL(H)
Posts: 3,057
Likes: 58
From: UK
Raven30,
There was what appeared to be a 'Purple Flight' last Sunday. If it wasn't a Royal Flight, then there were certainly plenty of temporary upgrades to Class A airspace around the Farnborough, Odiham and Lyneham areas.
I found out about it by calling 0500 354802.
It's worth making time to call this number before every flight.
HTH,
B73
Edited to add: Ooops, sorry Mariner9. Just realised that I've repeated what you suggested.
There was what appeared to be a 'Purple Flight' last Sunday. If it wasn't a Royal Flight, then there were certainly plenty of temporary upgrades to Class A airspace around the Farnborough, Odiham and Lyneham areas.
I found out about it by calling 0500 354802.
It's worth making time to call this number before every flight.
HTH,
B73
Edited to add: Ooops, sorry Mariner9. Just realised that I've repeated what you suggested.
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: Slightly left of centreline
AlanM
Yes they are NOTAMd, but as separate signals and not as part of the Daily NOTAM brief thats available from the NATS website. Since flying clubs and small airfields do not receive mil NOTAMS, they need to access the information some other way.
I have no previous experience of the information number quoted, however, is that not for TRAs? I have just rung the number and received info on TRAs but nothing else, and I believe there is a purple flight today.
This is the reason for the initial question, I am trying to get a better understanding of the whole notification system.
Thanks
Raven
Yes they are NOTAMd, but as separate signals and not as part of the Daily NOTAM brief thats available from the NATS website. Since flying clubs and small airfields do not receive mil NOTAMS, they need to access the information some other way.
I have no previous experience of the information number quoted, however, is that not for TRAs? I have just rung the number and received info on TRAs but nothing else, and I believe there is a purple flight today.
This is the reason for the initial question, I am trying to get a better understanding of the whole notification system.
Thanks
Raven
Joined: May 2006
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From: Swanwick
Fixed Wing Royal Flight information is notamed and available on line.
Perhaps you are looking under the wrong "title".... Purple Airspace was junked several years ago. Fixed Wing RFs when operating outside of permenant CAS operate within Controlled Airspace Temporaory better known as CAS (T).
As well as CAS(T) being notamed you will also get details on CAS(T) on the AIS freephone number 0500354802. On that line you will hear reference to Airspace Upgrades....That is CAS(T)
Royal Heli Flight info is not notamed for security reasons and as far as GA ac are concerned normal rules of the air apply. Mil ac have avoidance criteria but that doesnt apply to GA.
DD
Perhaps you are looking under the wrong "title".... Purple Airspace was junked several years ago. Fixed Wing RFs when operating outside of permenant CAS operate within Controlled Airspace Temporaory better known as CAS (T).
As well as CAS(T) being notamed you will also get details on CAS(T) on the AIS freephone number 0500354802. On that line you will hear reference to Airspace Upgrades....That is CAS(T)
Royal Heli Flight info is not notamed for security reasons and as far as GA ac are concerned normal rules of the air apply. Mil ac have avoidance criteria but that doesnt apply to GA.
DD
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: Savannah GA & Portsmouth UK
This is what they look like
Q)EGTT/QACCA/IV/NBO/AE/000/065/5130N00200W015
A)EGDL FROM 07/02/25 12:40 TO 07/02/25 13:40 B0356/07
E) AUS-02-0230/AS1
TEMPORARY CONTROLLED AIRSPACE (CLASS A) ESTABLISHED AS FOLLOWS:
LYNEHAM CTR EXTENDED 6NM EAST TO MIMBI (5133N 00142W). CONTROLLING
AUTHORITY LYNEHAM ATC.
F)SFC G)FL065
It's in the normal AIS brief. So don't you pick up the other info either? What about RA(T) (what used to be TRA's). Do you bimble through the Red Arrows displays as well?
Q)EGTT/QACCA/IV/NBO/AE/000/065/5130N00200W015
A)EGDL FROM 07/02/25 12:40 TO 07/02/25 13:40 B0356/07
E) AUS-02-0230/AS1
TEMPORARY CONTROLLED AIRSPACE (CLASS A) ESTABLISHED AS FOLLOWS:
LYNEHAM CTR EXTENDED 6NM EAST TO MIMBI (5133N 00142W). CONTROLLING
AUTHORITY LYNEHAM ATC.
F)SFC G)FL065
It's in the normal AIS brief. So don't you pick up the other info either? What about RA(T) (what used to be TRA's). Do you bimble through the Red Arrows displays as well?
Pre-flight action by commander of aircraft
52 The commander of an aircraft registered in the United Kingdom shall take all reasonable steps to satisfy himself before the aircraft takes off:
(a) that the flight can safely be made, taking into account the latest information available as to the route and aerodrome to be used, the weather reports and forecasts available and any alternative course of action which can be adopted in case the flight cannot be completed as planned;
52 The commander of an aircraft registered in the United Kingdom shall take all reasonable steps to satisfy himself before the aircraft takes off:
(a) that the flight can safely be made, taking into account the latest information available as to the route and aerodrome to be used, the weather reports and forecasts available and any alternative course of action which can be adopted in case the flight cannot be completed as planned;
Joined: Oct 2006
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From: Fareham
Mike
I read them as part of my normal Notam check (via NotamPlot). If they are in the system I see them. Do they come up as standard? Similarly, I have always assumed that the Reds were included in the standard Notams; please tell me this is true.
I'm not sure if I ever really take in the Royal flight Notams though as on the graphical system they usually come up as a circular plot. The persistent use of IFR reporting points is a pain to us VFR pilots who do not even know where the IFR points are. Yes, I know I could plot them but..... I don't have an army of Flight Sergeant's staffing my operations department.
I read them as part of my normal Notam check (via NotamPlot). If they are in the system I see them. Do they come up as standard? Similarly, I have always assumed that the Reds were included in the standard Notams; please tell me this is true.
I'm not sure if I ever really take in the Royal flight Notams though as on the graphical system they usually come up as a circular plot. The persistent use of IFR reporting points is a pain to us VFR pilots who do not even know where the IFR points are. Yes, I know I could plot them but..... I don't have an army of Flight Sergeant's staffing my operations department.
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: Savannah GA & Portsmouth UK
I read them as part of my normal Notam check (via NotamPlot). If they are in the system I see them. Do they come up as standard? Similarly, I have always assumed that the Reds were included in the standard Notams; please tell me this is true.
The use of significant points that don't appear on the CAA's VFR chart in NOTAM scoped for VFR is something I've brought up previously with my AOPA hat on at meetings with the CAA. In the example I posted above it's pretty clear where the restriction is (LYNEHAM CTR EXTENDED 6NM EAST ) but that's not always the case. I've now brought this point to the attention of Phil Roberts, who is Assistant Director of Airspace Policy 1 at the CAA and also chairs the DAP Airspace Infringement Working Group. He's looking into it and has promised to come back to me.
Mike
Joined: Jul 2002
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL(H)
Posts: 3,057
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From: UK
This then allowed me to look at the specific details via NotamPro.
HTH,
B73
Joined: May 2001
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From: UK
As a NotamPro user I would also be interested if anyone knows how it handles RF.
Mike well done for referring the use of IFR points so quickly - having some one who is able to get "straight to the top" and supporting GA is refreshing - thank you.
Mike well done for referring the use of IFR points so quickly - having some one who is able to get "straight to the top" and supporting GA is refreshing - thank you.
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 111
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From: Slightly left of centreline
Thanks for all the replies and information.
Mike,
Very unlikely that I will infringe any restricted airspace as I don't have any form of licence!
As I said, my knowledge of GA self briefing procedures was limited and I wanted to change that - helps with the day job.
Raven 30
Mike,
Very unlikely that I will infringe any restricted airspace as I don't have any form of licence!
As I said, my knowledge of GA self briefing procedures was limited and I wanted to change that - helps with the day job.
Raven 30
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,787
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From: EuroGA.org
This kind of stuff should all be in the notam narrow route briefing, with no need to phone any phone numbers, partly because no foreign pilot is likely to know about these numbers (and will correctly rely on the established international system for this kind of thing) and partly because most UK pilots, myself included, never call those numbers either.
What I would like to hear is a rational explanation why VIPs need publicly announced protection like this. It makes it so much easier for a terrorist with a shoulder launched missile to position themselves in the right place at the right time. The protection of CAS is illusory anyway because anybody could bimble into it by accident, and many do. Loads of pilots just do local bimbles and never get notams anyway. If I was a VIP I would fly covertly.
What I would like to hear is a rational explanation why VIPs need publicly announced protection like this. It makes it so much easier for a terrorist with a shoulder launched missile to position themselves in the right place at the right time. The protection of CAS is illusory anyway because anybody could bimble into it by accident, and many do. Loads of pilots just do local bimbles and never get notams anyway. If I was a VIP I would fly covertly.
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 201
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From: Fareham
IO540 - How true. It must be utter madness to promulgate the movements of VIPs so publicly. Sure, they can persecute (sorry prosecute) the bimblers but that won't put HRH back in the air once he has been bimbled into....
I'm quite tempted to start a thread in the general rumours and news section about how stupid this is and see how long it takes for the press to pick up on it. What do you think?
I'm quite tempted to start a thread in the general rumours and news section about how stupid this is and see how long it takes for the press to pick up on it. What do you think?
