Wycombe Air Centre takeover by Cabair
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Wycombe Air Centre takeover by Cabair
I can't believe there isn't more information on this forum about the take-over by Cabair of Wycombe Air Centre. It is very sad for the GA community
Apparently they sent out a letter to each member. By the time the letter got to the staff many employees had heard the news from other people who didn't even work at the company.
From speaking to current employees of WAC, everybody say that it is an excellent place to work, very friendly staff, a very relaxed atmosphere in the clubhouse and many members just pop in for a chat. This informal, relaxed atmosphere is the main reason many stay as club members rather than perhaps going to other local airfields which may be closer to where they live. This is likely to dramatically change once Cabair have got their foot in the door.
A lot of the commitment from the staff came out of loyalty to the three ex directors, who are all well respected within the company.
The other main thing that hasn't even been mentioned yet is the engineering department. WAC engineering has an excellent safety record and a well maintained fleet of aircraft.
Another local flying school will never be the same again.
Apparently they sent out a letter to each member. By the time the letter got to the staff many employees had heard the news from other people who didn't even work at the company.
From speaking to current employees of WAC, everybody say that it is an excellent place to work, very friendly staff, a very relaxed atmosphere in the clubhouse and many members just pop in for a chat. This informal, relaxed atmosphere is the main reason many stay as club members rather than perhaps going to other local airfields which may be closer to where they live. This is likely to dramatically change once Cabair have got their foot in the door.
A lot of the commitment from the staff came out of loyalty to the three ex directors, who are all well respected within the company.
The other main thing that hasn't even been mentioned yet is the engineering department. WAC engineering has an excellent safety record and a well maintained fleet of aircraft.
Another local flying school will never be the same again.
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Quite correct, now that cabair have snapped WAC up then everything will change and have to become cabair blue!! All literatre, prices etc will become the standard cabair rip off prices. It will be intresting to see what happens to the ppl training side of the school, its the staff and students I feel sorry for now as everything will have to become integrated into the cabair way. Profit is always at the number one of every business but as a former employee of cabair I can tell you its not nice every monday morning to have the directors breathing down your neck questioning every hour not flown and every weather dicision made etc. With wycombe being grass to it will be intresting to see what they do in the wet winter months. Costs behind the scenes will be cut, staff at a minimum but the price the customer pays will be hiked up every year or so and then there is the other hidden charges that the customer pays like the fuel surcharge, or the insurance surcharge or the surcharge for the surcharge!! For example a trial lesson that is adveristed at £99 could end up costing the customer £130 at the end of the day (not a great sales pitch to attract new customers). I really am sorry for the customers and staff and moarn the loss of another locall flying school and a great name in the GA community is lost to the cabair machine!
Although not a current member at WAC, I was for 8 years and would agree with many of the reasons above that made it a good place to fly.
WAC never was the cheapest, but for what you paid you got virtually new, well-equipped and well-maintained aircraft to fly in (at least over the last 4/5 years with the new 172's), engineering back-up nearly always available if there was something wrong, committed instructors and a fairly relaxed approach to things like a/c utilisation (eg, happy to let you take an a/c for the day, providing there was 2-3 hours on the hobbs at the end).
WAC was a professionally run Club, with a friendly atmosphere and seemed to be good at finding the right balance (eg, instructors always uniformed, but no sign of the Cabair "shoulder-gold").
Just hope the 3 ex-Directors have been seen right in all of this.
WAC never was the cheapest, but for what you paid you got virtually new, well-equipped and well-maintained aircraft to fly in (at least over the last 4/5 years with the new 172's), engineering back-up nearly always available if there was something wrong, committed instructors and a fairly relaxed approach to things like a/c utilisation (eg, happy to let you take an a/c for the day, providing there was 2-3 hours on the hobbs at the end).
WAC was a professionally run Club, with a friendly atmosphere and seemed to be good at finding the right balance (eg, instructors always uniformed, but no sign of the Cabair "shoulder-gold").
Just hope the 3 ex-Directors have been seen right in all of this.
Yep, sad day, guys. Won't be the same without old Dickie there.
Still, you can always go across the road to the BAFC - that's another good outfit with a sound pedigree.
BTW, HON, how long has Wycombe been all grass ?
Still, you can always go across the road to the BAFC - that's another good outfit with a sound pedigree.
BTW, HON, how long has Wycombe been all grass ?
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Wycombe's grass?
Quite so, landed on 24 which is most definitely asphalt, last week. Departed on 17, which IS grass, though.
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Yes there is the British Airways Flying Club option on the same airfield, and although they too are very professional in their approach to flying training and have an equally well maintained fleet of aircraft, there is definitely something lacking in their approach to their club members.
Wycombe Air Centre is by far the more friendly and relaxed place for both people learning to fly and advanced training. That is the point I am trying to make about WAC, you can only get their atmosphere from a local privately owned club which is going to be totally lost once cabair get their feet under the table.
And yes Booker does have 1 tarmac and 2 grass runways, so wet weather operation not normally a problem.
Wycombe Air Centre is by far the more friendly and relaxed place for both people learning to fly and advanced training. That is the point I am trying to make about WAC, you can only get their atmosphere from a local privately owned club which is going to be totally lost once cabair get their feet under the table.
And yes Booker does have 1 tarmac and 2 grass runways, so wet weather operation not normally a problem.
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I guess they will become a PPL school only now as the Commercial, IR and FIC is conducted at Cranfield and I doubt whether they (Cabair) will want to dilute their training base for advanced that close to home. To be successful at Booker they will have to be competitive with PPL rates and/or bring in diesels to remain competitive and make money. The Elstree base has seen a considerable fall of in PPL work, so perhaps they will relocate the locus of their London PPL work to Booker.
Whatever the outcome it will concentrate PPL and other training in the hands of a couple of schools so it will not do much for the competitiveness of the industry. I see more schools moving to the sport/recreational arena where is more money to be made at much lower costs that the Group A part of the industry.
Whatever the outcome it will concentrate PPL and other training in the hands of a couple of schools so it will not do much for the competitiveness of the industry. I see more schools moving to the sport/recreational arena where is more money to be made at much lower costs that the Group A part of the industry.
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My posts are being quite unfairly censored by the moderators, I have not written anything that is untrue.
Smarthawke you are spot on with your post.
Smarthawke you are spot on with your post.
Professional Student
As someone who did part of their training with Cabair Denham, and got along well with the instructors/ops people, can I just ask (purely out of interest; no axe to grind or arguements to start) what has happened with Cabair in the past to generate a lot of predictions of doom & gloom on hearing this news?
I understand how a big faceless corporation could be worse than a independent flying club, but am just interested in a little background info if possible - has this happened before?
I understand how a big faceless corporation could be worse than a independent flying club, but am just interested in a little background info if possible - has this happened before?
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Apparently, the first two Commercial students arrived at WACAIR the Monday after the 'take-over' (sorry 'merger' as the nameless director termed it to the staff) so it isn't PPL-only yet.
I understand the staff was told to find space for them - the fact that they were already busy didn't matter.....
I understand the staff was told to find space for them - the fact that they were already busy didn't matter.....
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I understand that WAC will concentrate more on the advanced training, with many students coming from Cabair sources. This in itself is not a such a bad thing as the advanced training can generate a steady income.
This shouldn't be pursued at the expense of the PPL training. If there any no new PPL students, then who are the advanced training instructors going to train in the future?
This shouldn't be pursued at the expense of the PPL training. If there any no new PPL students, then who are the advanced training instructors going to train in the future?
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It is indeed a very sad day for all at EGTB the WAC was a top rate company that was run ethicly, as some have said not the cheapest but always value for money.
The only winner out of this (apart from one of the directors IF and I stress IF what has been said above is true) will be the British airways flying club.
The BAFC is also a very well run club with high standards and I am sure will do very well when Cabair move in. It won't take long for people to catch on to the hidden extra's pricing policy of Cabair when just across the ramp they will find the BAFC's honest and open attitude of "what it says on the list is what you pay".
The only winner out of this (apart from one of the directors IF and I stress IF what has been said above is true) will be the British airways flying club.
The BAFC is also a very well run club with high standards and I am sure will do very well when Cabair move in. It won't take long for people to catch on to the hidden extra's pricing policy of Cabair when just across the ramp they will find the BAFC's honest and open attitude of "what it says on the list is what you pay".
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I have been flying from WAC for 19 years and I did not receive a letter advising of the change of ownership!!
Sadly I am sure they will loose a lot of members which will result in yet more lapsed PPL's.
My understanding is that only one director came out of the deal on top, may be we should accept that the hard realities of business had to take priority over the needs of the members and staff.
They will breaking up a great team!
Sadly I am sure they will loose a lot of members which will result in yet more lapsed PPL's.
My understanding is that only one director came out of the deal on top, may be we should accept that the hard realities of business had to take priority over the needs of the members and staff.
They will breaking up a great team!
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It's a shame this has happened really. I've got just over 15 hours now building up to my PPL, so i havn't been there all that long, but I just hope the brilliant standards don't drop due to the change over!
Anyway, in my opinion it can't get as bad as
over the other side of the apron! (If I'm allowed to say that???)
To be fair that's all I've heard anyway, and from the fact that on a couple of occasions I've been checking out the plane, a couple of their instructors have hurled snide remarks from the fuel pumps. There again, the people I've heard that from are long-time WAC flyers, so I'm sure they're a tiny bit biased
(Sorry this edit comes after all the comments asking why I don't like BAFC, but as you can see in the "Reason for Editing", the last paragraph here was for some reason cutout - hope it explains all!)
Anyway, in my opinion it can't get as bad as
over the other side of the apron! (If I'm allowed to say that???)To be fair that's all I've heard anyway, and from the fact that on a couple of occasions I've been checking out the plane, a couple of their instructors have hurled snide remarks from the fuel pumps. There again, the people I've heard that from are long-time WAC flyers, so I'm sure they're a tiny bit biased
(Sorry this edit comes after all the comments asking why I don't like BAFC, but as you can see in the "Reason for Editing", the last paragraph here was for some reason cutout - hope it explains all!)
Last edited by VOR_DME; 11th Oct 2006 at 15:10. Reason: Half my message cut out
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VOR DME
Rather harsh comments regarding the 'other' people at Wycombe, why for you have that opinion? Just interested, I know quite a lot of very happy people over there who have been flying there for many years.
Rather harsh comments regarding the 'other' people at Wycombe, why for you have that opinion? Just interested, I know quite a lot of very happy people over there who have been flying there for many years.
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WAC - What a lack of style !
Sad…very sad… and what a lack of style!
I got the “sad news” a couple of days ago reading the announcement inside one of the UK top aviation magazine. I’m currently flying at WAC and as a member, I would have appreciated a couple of nice words tracing the past and illustrating the future…
As a member….Ooops …maybe I’m not anymore…I might just be a paying customer…I never considered myself a paying customer at WAC…but a pilot... a pilot, part of a club…
…sad…very sad…
I loved the professional support that the staff and the instructors gave us every time we showed up.
We… “The members” felt special…and part of a special Club…what’s left now?
Is it the new style?…or just a lack of style…!!!
A letter (have anyone received one…) tracing the glorious past and shaping the future would have made the difference … a letter...two nice words…just that…
Is WAC’s top management sensible to “members loyalty” and what we represented so far…I doubt it now…
Dear “Management” …you just lost my support…
Sad…very sad… and... in what lack of style!
I got the “sad news” a couple of days ago reading the announcement inside one of the UK top aviation magazine. I’m currently flying at WAC and as a member, I would have appreciated a couple of nice words tracing the past and illustrating the future…
As a member….Ooops …maybe I’m not anymore…I might just be a paying customer…I never considered myself a paying customer at WAC…but a pilot... a pilot, part of a club…
…sad…very sad…
I loved the professional support that the staff and the instructors gave us every time we showed up.
We… “The members” felt special…and part of a special Club…what’s left now?
Is it the new style?…or just a lack of style…!!!
A letter (have anyone received one…) tracing the glorious past and shaping the future would have made the difference … a letter...two nice words…just that…
Is WAC’s top management sensible to “members loyalty” and what we represented so far…I doubt it now…
Dear “Management” …you just lost my support…
Sad…very sad… and... in what lack of style!
Last edited by VMF-214 "Pappy"; 10th Oct 2006 at 20:11.
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Originally Posted by smarthawke
Rather harsh comments regarding the 'other' people at Wycombe, why for you have that opinion? Just interested, I know quite a lot of very happy people over there who have been flying there for many years.
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Sad news indeed
I first flew with WAC 90's - chose them over BAFC for the more "clubby" atmosphere.
Don't like the sound of Cabair taking WAC over although if their business standards are as questionable as some of their instructors training methods then they won't be there for long. I have lost count of the number of times I (and fellow non-Cabair flyers) have been "cut up" and had to go around in the circuit (at Denham) by Cabair students+instructors returning from the local area and busting into the circuit pattern straight to final. So much for the "conforming to the pattern of traffic formed.." rule.
I first flew with WAC 90's - chose them over BAFC for the more "clubby" atmosphere.
Don't like the sound of Cabair taking WAC over although if their business standards are as questionable as some of their instructors training methods then they won't be there for long. I have lost count of the number of times I (and fellow non-Cabair flyers) have been "cut up" and had to go around in the circuit (at Denham) by Cabair students+instructors returning from the local area and busting into the circuit pattern straight to final. So much for the "conforming to the pattern of traffic formed.." rule.