Is a CTA a "Zone"
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From: S Warwickshire
I would normally just make a request for a VFR(/IFR/SVFR) transit, without qualifying Zone or CTA.
It is quite likely that a transit will go through both, and a clearance will be issued to enter "controlled airspace".
I don't know what CAP413 says, but a controller is primarily interested in your altitude and routing through the controlled airspace as a whole.
It is quite likely that a transit will go through both, and a clearance will be issued to enter "controlled airspace".
I don't know what CAP413 says, but a controller is primarily interested in your altitude and routing through the controlled airspace as a whole.
Joined: Apr 2000
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From: a galaxy far, far,away...
Technically a zone is from sfc to a specified level eg sfc-2000. An area is from one specified level to another eg 2000-5000.
Realistically no-one's going to stand on semantics. I hope!
Realistically no-one's going to stand on semantics. I hope!
Joined: Jan 2004
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From: The world's most liveable city
I would normally just make a request for a VFR(/IFR/SVFR) transit, without qualifying Zone or CTA.
It is quite likely that a transit will go through both, and a clearance will be issued to enter "controlled airspace".
I don't know what CAP413 says, but a controller is primarily interested in your altitude and routing through the controlled airspace as a whole.
It is quite likely that a transit will go through both, and a clearance will be issued to enter "controlled airspace".
I don't know what CAP413 says, but a controller is primarily interested in your altitude and routing through the controlled airspace as a whole.
Joined: Mar 2001
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From: Apa, apo ndi kulikonse!
Because your clearance would be "Not above" (say 2000ft) and if the CTA base was 1500ft you are likely not to be in the CTA!
And the ANO defines SVFR as clearance through a zone (not all CTAs are piddly little things of course)
All semantics as said really...... damn them rules!
And the ANO defines SVFR as clearance through a zone (not all CTAs are piddly little things of course)
All semantics as said really...... damn them rules!
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2001
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From: 75N 16E
Becareful what point you wish to transit as you may be best calling Bournemouth.
However, now I fly from somewhere else, and if routing to the Channel Islands via NEDUL / ORTAC the easiest option for me (other than skirting their airspace) is to climb to 3000 (to remain below N866) and transit Bournemouth from say Tarrent Rushton to Hengistbury Head and intercept the SAM radial (I forget which one).
As mentioned, a CTA is not a zone, and CAP413 doesn't clarify. If my initial call is for "zone transit" they may assume straight away that I want to transit their Zone which I don't.
If I were to go now, I'd call Solent and ask "to transit their airspace" or "CTA transit". I imagine I'd be told to call Bournemouth anyway, but it is only polite to call the agency listed on the chart
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Alan, I'm not disagreeing, but I don't find any link in the ANO between SVFR and it only being available in a CTR. Conversely, the AIP is quite specific and talks only about CTRs. Taking this a step further, the only weather criteria I can find for SVFR refer to in-flight visibility and not contact with the surface (as I am thinking about CTR/CTA transits, I am ignoring to 600ft cloudbase bit for arrivals and departure here). To confuse the issue the AIP says the following:
Note that in sight of the surface bit is "implicit", whatever that means! I can quite happily determine my position and maintain obstacle clearance without seeing the surface. Indeed, I have often offered to take an IFR clearance only to be given a VFR/SVFR one. 
As I see things, in theory, you can have a SVFR clearance above cloud through a CTR but not a CTA.
I think I will take a cold flannel and lie down in a dark room now.
2.3 When operating on a Special VFR clearance, the pilot must comply with ATC instructions and remain at all times in flight conditions which enable him to determine his flight path and to keep clear of obstacles. Therefore, it is implicit in all Special VFR clearances that the aircraft remains clear of cloud and in sight of the surface. It may be necessary for ATC purposes to impose a height limitation on a Special VFR clearance which will require the pilot to fly either at or not above a specific level.
As I see things, in theory, you can have a SVFR clearance above cloud through a CTR but not a CTA.
I think I will take a cold flannel and lie down in a dark room now.
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From: Apa, apo ndi kulikonse!
SVFR
"A flight made at any time in a control zone which is Class A airspace, or in any other control zone in IMC or at night, in respect of which the appropriate air traffic control unit has given permission for the flight to be made in accordance with special instructions given by that unit instead of in accordance with the Instrument Flight Rules and in the course of which flight the aircraft complies with any instructions given by that unit and remains clear of cloud and in sight of the surface. (R of A)"
"A flight made at any time in a control zone which is Class A airspace, or in any other control zone in IMC or at night, in respect of which the appropriate air traffic control unit has given permission for the flight to be made in accordance with special instructions given by that unit instead of in accordance with the Instrument Flight Rules and in the course of which flight the aircraft complies with any instructions given by that unit and remains clear of cloud and in sight of the surface. (R of A)"
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From: 50+ north
Although you will not find any reference to it in the Air Pilot or NOTAMs, I understand that Solent delegate control of the Solent CTA overhead Bournemouth and west thereof to Bournemouth, So it would appear that you shouls call Bournemouth for a crossing.
