JeppView / Flightdeck
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Join Date: May 2003
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Bose-X,
Just wanting to know how reliable the software is, in particular the FlightDeck stuff which I understand to be a moving map facility.
I've had quite a lot of problems with the FliteMap product, and am not keen on bunging them another grand if the software isn't stable !
Also, do you guys use in in the cockpit ? If so, on what hardware ?
FF
Just wanting to know how reliable the software is, in particular the FlightDeck stuff which I understand to be a moving map facility.
I've had quite a lot of problems with the FliteMap product, and am not keen on bunging them another grand if the software isn't stable !
Also, do you guys use in in the cockpit ? If so, on what hardware ?
FF
Join Date: Jun 2004
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For in and around the cockpit I use a Fujitsu P2010 A5 sized notebook, and I am thinking about upgrading to the JVC 741 interlink. (www.dynamism.com)
But most users prefer the Motion Computing tablet, with daylight viewable screen. But that is 12" in size, and I already have an MFD in my plane. ( www.motioncomputing.com )
S.
But most users prefer the Motion Computing tablet, with daylight viewable screen. But that is 12" in size, and I already have an MFD in my plane. ( www.motioncomputing.com )
S.
Join Date: May 2005
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Never seen a review, but mine would be:
Jeppview:
Basically an approach plate (IFR) display/printing package, with 28-day updates.
Hacked together about 10-15 years ago, last looked at in the days of windoze 95, nobody would buy it except for the data which is not really obtainable (in electronic format, on the retail market) any other way and which is very good. The data (mainly approach plates etc) is designed to display adequately on a 800x600 portrait tablet display, in flight. On the ground, it does a great job printing out a selection of plates and for that alone it's worth having if one does a LOT of IFR flight. Expensive to buy and VERY expensive to keep up to date, but (at a price) you can get plates for the whole civilised world, curiously including the UK military airfields, and all designed to the same style.
The latest, Jeppview 3, comes with another hack called Flitedeck which gives you a GPS moving map that automatically switches beween approach plates, en route IFR charts, and airport (ground) diagrams. A very slick product once you suss out how to use it.
Flitestar:
Basically a flight planning package, like say Navbox but with much more detailed VFR charts and various weird extra features. Very easy to generate a flight pack which has so many pages you will never be able to read it in the air! The VFR charts are IMV not detailed enough to eliminate the need for printed charts for VFR flight planning; they are not the same as Jepp's VFR/GPS charts. The VFR map data covers a much bigger area than Jepp's VFR printed charts but a lot of it is really bare. One can print off chart sections etc as part of the route data pack, to carry on the flight, in case the battery went flat etc.
3 updates a year, I think. The Euro IFR version is about £500 which is an almost reasonable price for what you get. The Flitemap version will accept NMEA GPS input to show aircraft position, which is very good.
A slightly more recent hack, too many quirks to mention (e.g. you can load in a planned route but it doesn't display; extra ops are required to see it and it could just display a different one instead), too fiddly to use in flight except as a plain moving map display (Flitemap) with simple route edits being possible.
Integrates with Jeppview so you can click on an airport on the map and see the approach plates for it.
Copy protection is quite strong. The software needs to run on a computer which can have a real physical CD drive attached (can be a USB one) for the updates; one cannot update it from an update CD elsewhere on the network. Lots of serial numbers to mess about with. Flitestar/Map runs with an out of date database but Jeppview stops running if the database is past 2-3 months (a very dodgy practice but one can get around it by setting the PC date back).
Basically, it's all cr*p software. But it comes with data which cannot be obtained any other way, which is updated regularly and is as accurate as you will get anywhere, and that's why people pay the money.
For heavy european VFR pilots it doesn't cut the mustard because it doesn't eliminate the expenditure on printed VFR charts (a stupid marketing decision IMV) especially as Jepp don't publish their Bottlang touring guides in electronic form. I would stick with Navbox for VFR; it's as good and is 1/10 of the cost.
Heavy IFR pilots like it, it offers a working and integrated solution which costs a small fraction of the cost of the flying.
Hope that helps. I'd go on a training course if I was spending the money, otherwise you will wonder what the hell such and such does.
Jeppview:
Basically an approach plate (IFR) display/printing package, with 28-day updates.
Hacked together about 10-15 years ago, last looked at in the days of windoze 95, nobody would buy it except for the data which is not really obtainable (in electronic format, on the retail market) any other way and which is very good. The data (mainly approach plates etc) is designed to display adequately on a 800x600 portrait tablet display, in flight. On the ground, it does a great job printing out a selection of plates and for that alone it's worth having if one does a LOT of IFR flight. Expensive to buy and VERY expensive to keep up to date, but (at a price) you can get plates for the whole civilised world, curiously including the UK military airfields, and all designed to the same style.
The latest, Jeppview 3, comes with another hack called Flitedeck which gives you a GPS moving map that automatically switches beween approach plates, en route IFR charts, and airport (ground) diagrams. A very slick product once you suss out how to use it.
Flitestar:
Basically a flight planning package, like say Navbox but with much more detailed VFR charts and various weird extra features. Very easy to generate a flight pack which has so many pages you will never be able to read it in the air! The VFR charts are IMV not detailed enough to eliminate the need for printed charts for VFR flight planning; they are not the same as Jepp's VFR/GPS charts. The VFR map data covers a much bigger area than Jepp's VFR printed charts but a lot of it is really bare. One can print off chart sections etc as part of the route data pack, to carry on the flight, in case the battery went flat etc.
3 updates a year, I think. The Euro IFR version is about £500 which is an almost reasonable price for what you get. The Flitemap version will accept NMEA GPS input to show aircraft position, which is very good.
A slightly more recent hack, too many quirks to mention (e.g. you can load in a planned route but it doesn't display; extra ops are required to see it and it could just display a different one instead), too fiddly to use in flight except as a plain moving map display (Flitemap) with simple route edits being possible.
Integrates with Jeppview so you can click on an airport on the map and see the approach plates for it.
Copy protection is quite strong. The software needs to run on a computer which can have a real physical CD drive attached (can be a USB one) for the updates; one cannot update it from an update CD elsewhere on the network. Lots of serial numbers to mess about with. Flitestar/Map runs with an out of date database but Jeppview stops running if the database is past 2-3 months (a very dodgy practice but one can get around it by setting the PC date back).
Basically, it's all cr*p software. But it comes with data which cannot be obtained any other way, which is updated regularly and is as accurate as you will get anywhere, and that's why people pay the money.
For heavy european VFR pilots it doesn't cut the mustard because it doesn't eliminate the expenditure on printed VFR charts (a stupid marketing decision IMV) especially as Jepp don't publish their Bottlang touring guides in electronic form. I would stick with Navbox for VFR; it's as good and is 1/10 of the cost.
Heavy IFR pilots like it, it offers a working and integrated solution which costs a small fraction of the cost of the flying.
Hope that helps. I'd go on a training course if I was spending the money, otherwise you will wonder what the hell such and such does.
Join Date: Apr 2004
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Thanks for the review. Its staggering that there are not any trial versions in this day and age. Maybe its because of all the hacks and peculiarities that they dont bother so that you have to buy it to find out.
I am trying to decide between buying a tablet pc with all this functionality or fitting a Garmin MX20 to link up to my dual 430's and also the approach plate option. That seems a bloody good piece of kit.
What frustrates me is I cant get to look at the options and get a hands on feel for them.
Has anyone got either the MX20 with approach plates or the Jeppview 3 that they would be willing to demo to me. I will happily travel to see them as it would surely involve a flight so gives me a good excuse.
I am trying to decide between buying a tablet pc with all this functionality or fitting a Garmin MX20 to link up to my dual 430's and also the approach plate option. That seems a bloody good piece of kit.
What frustrates me is I cant get to look at the options and get a hands on feel for them.
Has anyone got either the MX20 with approach plates or the Jeppview 3 that they would be willing to demo to me. I will happily travel to see them as it would surely involve a flight so gives me a good excuse.
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I have Jeppview and Flightstar in fact the full suite with all the update services and more than happy to demo. I can also give you a demo disk of them that will run for 30days.
I actually get all my updates from the internet for the services rather than the CD's. It is easier and cheaper.
You can also install the software on upto 3 PC's which works fine for me. I have one on my desktop and 2 laptops. I personallu have had no problem with the copy protection but then I have found no need to pirate the software! It is easy to move the licence key from machine to machine so if you chance PC's you just deactivate the one instance and reactive on another machine.
I run the Flightdeck on a tablet PC, but to be honest prefer a printed plate and the overlay in the GNS430's. My view being that if I cant read the plate and fly the approach then perhaps I should not be there in the first place!
I actually get all my updates from the internet for the services rather than the CD's. It is easier and cheaper.
You can also install the software on upto 3 PC's which works fine for me. I have one on my desktop and 2 laptops. I personallu have had no problem with the copy protection but then I have found no need to pirate the software! It is easy to move the licence key from machine to machine so if you chance PC's you just deactivate the one instance and reactive on another machine.
I run the Flightdeck on a tablet PC, but to be honest prefer a printed plate and the overlay in the GNS430's. My view being that if I cant read the plate and fly the approach then perhaps I should not be there in the first place!
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That sounds great. I would love to see it. Where are you based. My Bonanza is currently out of skies at the moment having a top end overhaul but will be back in a week or two I hope ( I have been thinking this for about the last four weeks) and at the moment I am having to hire club aircraft so it may be a couple of weeks until I could get to you. I am based in Blackpool.
I am down at Turweston tomorrow if you are anywhere near there.
I am down at Turweston tomorrow if you are anywhere near there.
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Any chance you could PM me a number to get you on so if I get away from my meeting on time I could perhaps give you a try seeing as I am not very far away. If its not convenient for you I could try again in a couple of weeks.
Cheers
Stuart
Cheers
Stuart
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justsomepilot
Thought you oughta know that Jepp provide their VFR GPS charts on CD especially for Flitstar/map. Available in about 6 different area coverages, plus complete set of course.
stuart
There is in fact a demo CD out with Jeppview and Flitestar on it, it fell out of Flyer and Pilot mags March/April-ish. They'll send you one. Also includes their catalog (ue).
cheers
atb
Thought you oughta know that Jepp provide their VFR GPS charts on CD especially for Flitstar/map. Available in about 6 different area coverages, plus complete set of course.
stuart
There is in fact a demo CD out with Jeppview and Flitestar on it, it fell out of Flyer and Pilot mags March/April-ish. They'll send you one. Also includes their catalog (ue).
cheers
atb
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Thought you oughta know that Jepp provide their VFR GPS charts on CD especially for Flitstar/map. Available in about 6 different area coverages, plus complete set of course.
I am familiar with Flitestar and flitemap and I can assure you that the VFR charts that come with/for that are nothing like the Jepp printed "VFR/GPS 1:500,000" charts. Most of the elevation data is missing for example.
If Jeppessen do provide their real pirnted charts on CD that would be very interesting, but what is the method of displaying them? I spoke about this to them at a recent show and the salesman didn't know about such a product.
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If Jeppessen do provide their real pirnted charts on CD that would be very interesting, but what is the method of displaying them? I spoke about this to them at a recent show and the salesman didn't know about such a product.
They sure do. Display possibilities can be found in FliteStar under help, help topics, index, and by inserting something like 'displaying raster charts'
Hope this helps.
....salesman was possibly a specialist in other fields.......with so many products on offer I guess it's difficult if nye impossible to know all about all.
cheers
atb
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Thanks for the link. Looks like it's Euro 289 for Europe, and interestingly this data extends beyond their printed VFR/GPS chart coverage.
I wonder if this stuff works on Flitemap (GPS moving map).
I wonder if this stuff works on Flitemap (GPS moving map).
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atb1943
As you appear to have good contacts at Jeppesen
perhaps you are able to ask them why their European raster charts (I bought the CD) are actually SCANS (yes, scans, not the original electronic data). Poor quality scans too.
It's amazing that somebody at Jeppesen (who obviously have the data in electronic form and could easily generate proper TIFFs or similar) just picked up a load of their printed charts and fed them into a scanner.
The chart set is also padded out with well out of date TPC charts (even poorer quality scans than those of the VFR/GPS charts, with lots of JPEG compression artefacts) for the further reaches of Europe! Complete with well out of date danger areas, etc. Those charts themselves have missing dates, presumably so one cannot tell just how far out of date they are (I know some "current" ONC charts are c. 1998).
At these prices, Jepp should sell only current material, or they should take the trouble to transcribe the changes (which they also have in electronic form, from e.g. their IFR charts) onto the TPC charts before they feed them into the scanner.
A rather poor product!
Perhaps they scanned the stuff in deliberately to prevent people ripping off the data commercially.
As you appear to have good contacts at Jeppesen
perhaps you are able to ask them why their European raster charts (I bought the CD) are actually SCANS (yes, scans, not the original electronic data). Poor quality scans too. It's amazing that somebody at Jeppesen (who obviously have the data in electronic form and could easily generate proper TIFFs or similar) just picked up a load of their printed charts and fed them into a scanner.
The chart set is also padded out with well out of date TPC charts (even poorer quality scans than those of the VFR/GPS charts, with lots of JPEG compression artefacts) for the further reaches of Europe! Complete with well out of date danger areas, etc. Those charts themselves have missing dates, presumably so one cannot tell just how far out of date they are (I know some "current" ONC charts are c. 1998).
At these prices, Jepp should sell only current material, or they should take the trouble to transcribe the changes (which they also have in electronic form, from e.g. their IFR charts) onto the TPC charts before they feed them into the scanner.
A rather poor product!
Perhaps they scanned the stuff in deliberately to prevent people ripping off the data commercially.