White Waltham fuel rip-off
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2002
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From: England
White Waltham fuel rip-off
White Waltham have now increased the price of fuel to £1.20 per litre. So if you are thinking of visiting make sure that you don't need to take on fuel.
Any other clubs out there fleecing the members for fuel ?
Any other clubs out there fleecing the members for fuel ?
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 589
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From: UK
....because the refineries give the stuff away to Aerodrome operators free of course!!
The wholesale price of AVGAS has risen nearly 20p per litre since last year, surely the 'end user' has to take some of the additional cost?
The wholesale price of AVGAS has risen nearly 20p per litre since last year, surely the 'end user' has to take some of the additional cost?
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 42
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From: West London
White Waltham
To give WW their due, they don't charge a landing fee if you uplift more than about 40Lts of fuel. That would be equivalent to a landing fee of £1.20 for fuel priced at £1.05/Lt and uplifting the 40Lts.
I know of plenty of places that charge a tenner or more for a landing fee and then still want more than £1.05/Lt for fuel.
Also, compared to a lot of near to London airfields WW does have a unique atmosphere and a decent clubhouse/bar with friendly and helpful staff.
And no, I'm not based there or have anything to do with them other than being an occasional visitor.
I know of plenty of places that charge a tenner or more for a landing fee and then still want more than £1.05/Lt for fuel.
Also, compared to a lot of near to London airfields WW does have a unique atmosphere and a decent clubhouse/bar with friendly and helpful staff.
And no, I'm not based there or have anything to do with them other than being an occasional visitor.
Better red than ...
Joined: Aug 2004
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 1,415
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From: Appleby-in-Westmorland Cumbria England
But was the £1.20/ l inc VAT?
If so it is 'about right'.
Quite a few places charge no LF if uplifting a reasonable amount of fuel.
If a SEP has a capacity of 74USG (280.09l) and uplifts close to this then it is a higher landing fee than if you uplift 11USG because it is tied to fuel uplift volume.
Hope the rest of the country does not follow suite on the price ...
If so it is 'about right'.
Quite a few places charge no LF if uplifting a reasonable amount of fuel.
If a SEP has a capacity of 74USG (280.09l) and uplifts close to this then it is a higher landing fee than if you uplift 11USG because it is tied to fuel uplift volume.
Hope the rest of the country does not follow suite on the price ...
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 20
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From: Ipswich
Try Cambridge.
1.32 / Litre (inc vat) !!!
A little research shows Northampton (Sywell) at 1.12 / Litre and Peterboro (Connington) at 1.18 / Litre.
Anyone volunteer to maintain a sticky with up to dat AvGas prices?
1.32 / Litre (inc vat) !!!
A little research shows Northampton (Sywell) at 1.12 / Litre and Peterboro (Connington) at 1.18 / Litre.
Anyone volunteer to maintain a sticky with up to dat AvGas prices?
Better red than ...
Joined: Aug 2004
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 1,415
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From: Appleby-in-Westmorland Cumbria England
Anyone volunteer to maintain a sticky with up to dat AvGas prices?
Cambridge was most expensive at £1.16
Fenland least at £0.81
... and a normal distribution curve in between.
Hope Lycoming can come up with a J A1 burning diesel retrofit soon.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 575
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From: Hither and Thither
£1.20 for fuel - absolutely disgraceful! (not)
If someone has to divert in for emergency/weather reasons, and they are going to get ripped off like this (pretty standard charge) for fuel, we need a campaign for free fuel uplift for emergency/weather diversions. It is only right and proper that an airfield should pick up the charges for everything to do with flying if there is an emergency or weather diversion involved.
Imagine the safety implications of someone trying to forge on those extra few miles just to be able to pick up cheaper fuel at a more distant aerodrome due to the non-participation of a particular airfiled in the scheme.
Perhaps AOPA's CS could take this on?
If someone has to divert in for emergency/weather reasons, and they are going to get ripped off like this (pretty standard charge) for fuel, we need a campaign for free fuel uplift for emergency/weather diversions. It is only right and proper that an airfield should pick up the charges for everything to do with flying if there is an emergency or weather diversion involved.
Imagine the safety implications of someone trying to forge on those extra few miles just to be able to pick up cheaper fuel at a more distant aerodrome due to the non-participation of a particular airfiled in the scheme.
Perhaps AOPA's CS could take this on?
Better red than ...
Joined: Aug 2004
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 1,415
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From: Appleby-in-Westmorland Cumbria England
Yes, it is incl. of VAT
Thank you for the simple answer.
Therefore, net of VAT £1.02, which is actually "quite good" and in fact "quite average".
Endex, I think?
niknak
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,335
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From: UK
Sensible is obviously way behind the times, avgas prices have gone up - by an average of 5 - 8 p a litre - in the last two weeks, this is entirely due to the spot price of oil on the futures market going up by a similar percentage.
Do you think that the suppliers (airfields) are benefiting from this? The short answer is no, in fact their profit margins go down considerably in such situations and often they lose out entirely.
Pay the market rate, just as you would for your car, (for Red 4 and Sensible's benefit, supermarkets dont supply avgas), or try and arrange for your own supplies, perhaps then you'll realise exactly what's involved.
P.S.
Red Four speaks out of his/her hat, free landing fees maybe, but any pilot of any worth would sort out safety first and worry about peripheral factors second, to do anything else would be grossly negligent.
Do you think that the suppliers (airfields) are benefiting from this? The short answer is no, in fact their profit margins go down considerably in such situations and often they lose out entirely.
Pay the market rate, just as you would for your car, (for Red 4 and Sensible's benefit, supermarkets dont supply avgas), or try and arrange for your own supplies, perhaps then you'll realise exactly what's involved.
P.S.
Red Four speaks out of his/her hat, free landing fees maybe, but any pilot of any worth would sort out safety first and worry about peripheral factors second, to do anything else would be grossly negligent.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 616
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From: Essex, UK
Lets get real. Oil is $60 a barrel.
If any of us ran our businesses, or our bosses businesses, at less than 20% gross margin, we would soon be out of a job or business.
If I was buying Avgas at 98p a litre, I would sell it at £1.20.
If someone else still has tank residue that they bought at 85p, then go fly there and fill up.
We all have a very rude awakening coming to us.
If any of us ran our businesses, or our bosses businesses, at less than 20% gross margin, we would soon be out of a job or business.
If I was buying Avgas at 98p a litre, I would sell it at £1.20.
If someone else still has tank residue that they bought at 85p, then go fly there and fill up.
We all have a very rude awakening coming to us.
A little less conversation,
a little more aviation...
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 696
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From: Bracknell, UK
niknak - Red Four was extracting the Michael.
In the past couple of months we've managed to put about £2K
a month through Waltham's pumps into the Yak....I swear the
thing knows the way back to the pumps on it's own. It's still
cheaper per litre than beer, and Yaks don't run too well on
beer (but donglers do, so bung a couple of quid in the Dongler
Beer Fund tin next time at the pumps).
Besides, if WLAC fuel is so expensive, why do Booker seem
to have been organising regular "Refuel at Waltham"
weekends recently?
In the past couple of months we've managed to put about £2K
a month through Waltham's pumps into the Yak....I swear the
thing knows the way back to the pumps on it's own. It's still
cheaper per litre than beer, and Yaks don't run too well on
beer (but donglers do, so bung a couple of quid in the Dongler
Beer Fund tin next time at the pumps).
Besides, if WLAC fuel is so expensive, why do Booker seem
to have been organising regular "Refuel at Waltham"
weekends recently?
Better red than ...
Joined: Aug 2004
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 1,415
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From: Appleby-in-Westmorland Cumbria England
Somebody asked me a PM question about an earlier point.
Attached the answer verbatim for the ROW.
Attached the answer verbatim for the ROW.
Helicopter Club of GB (HCGB) "Helitorque" - provided freed to members. Editor Pat Malone (real name and PPrune Handle as well). I don't believe you can buy it at News-stands. Each edition gives a run down on 100LL, A1, landing and other charges by UK airfield.
Just another number
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,077
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From: UK
Enjoy the 'cheap' fuel while you can. BA are currently hedging their 2006 fuel at the equivalent of $78/barrel. Expect $100/barrel by mid 2006. Flying is going to become rather expensive.
Airclues
Airclues
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 712
Likes: 17
From: SE England
A quick look at The Hangar fuel comparison section would seem to confirm that £1.20 is about the going rate. Don't refuel at Aberdeen though, where its 17 % higher!
Incidentally, Booker refuelled elsewhere recently due to a problem with the pumps, not cost.
Incidentally, Booker refuelled elsewhere recently due to a problem with the pumps, not cost.