When is the Best Time in the Year to do a IMC?
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Gentleman Aviator
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From: Dubai
When is the Best Time in the Year to do a IMC?
Hello everyone, this is my first post on the Private Flying forum, Im sometimes to be found lurking in the Jet Blast forum but for once I actually have an aviation related question!
Having recently completed my PPL I want to do a IMC rating. Is it best to wait until the autumn/ winter or should I start now? Im based in the UK btw. Also would it be cheaper to do the IMC intensively in a foreign country?
Thanks for reading this and I would be grateful if people would share their experiences, both good and bad!
Having recently completed my PPL I want to do a IMC rating. Is it best to wait until the autumn/ winter or should I start now? Im based in the UK btw. Also would it be cheaper to do the IMC intensively in a foreign country?
Thanks for reading this and I would be grateful if people would share their experiences, both good and bad!
High Flying Bird
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From: Old Sarum ish
Speaking with absolutely no experience, other than a little post-PPL training... I would say that winter might be easier when you start as the air will be smoother & you should find straight and level less work. Having enough cloud to fly in isn't really a problem in the UK. 
Joined: Sep 2003
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From: UK,Twighlight Zone
winter is not really the best time to do it in the Uk unless you are doing it an an anti/de-iced aircraft as the freezing level in the Uk is so low and the very restrictive nature of our airspace does not allow you to get above it. Also choosing a time that gives you an easy ride may not be the best for real world use. Personally I have yet to fly inside a cloud that I found smooth. (In fact todays cloud was full of lighting and rain!)
The average club spamcan trainer unfortunatly in my experiance does not run to the appropriate icing kit.
This time of year is probably the best time to do the rating especially at the moment where we do not seem to have a shortage of cloud but the freezing level is very high.
Please have a look at the other recent threads on IMC training regarding the time after rating before staring the IMC as I think you will find the consenus is get some experiance as a PPL before going on the instuments.
The average club spamcan trainer unfortunatly in my experiance does not run to the appropriate icing kit.
This time of year is probably the best time to do the rating especially at the moment where we do not seem to have a shortage of cloud but the freezing level is very high.
Please have a look at the other recent threads on IMC training regarding the time after rating before staring the IMC as I think you will find the consenus is get some experiance as a PPL before going on the instuments.
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From: Glen Prosen, Scotland
Start now, don't wait for winter. As mentioned the problem with winter is that any clouds often deposit unwelcome layers if ice on the aircraft so better in summer. IMC is a UK only rating (not JAR) so options to learn abroad will be severely limited. I'd recommend doing a good deal of ground work beforehand using a training aid like RANT on your computer. It will save you literally hundreds of pounds in the air.
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I'd recommend doing a good deal of ground work beforehand using a training aid like RANT on your computer. It will save you literally hundreds of pounds in the air.
I agree, start training now. This Summer is so crappy that you will probably be in real IMC for much of the time too! I did mine in May/June and of the 16 hours training, about 9 were in IMC. Invaluable!
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From: Chichester, UK
RANT is a tool for learning how to use navaids to do all the things you need to do for the IMC (or IR) - there's a website at http://www.oddsoft.com/ which used to have a demo, not sure if it still does or not.
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From: UK,Twighlight Zone
Can I still make my point about getting experiance as a PPL before going off and doing the IMC.
An IMC is pretty useless other than as a badge to a new PPL as you do not have the experiance to properly control the aircraft yet or have the spare capacity to deal with the task loading of operating the aircraft safely in IMC.
It is all well and good being able to do it with the instructors sat next to you but when you need it for real the task loading is massive.
The old adage about at 50 hours you think you know everything etc. is true!
An IMC is pretty useless other than as a badge to a new PPL as you do not have the experiance to properly control the aircraft yet or have the spare capacity to deal with the task loading of operating the aircraft safely in IMC.
It is all well and good being able to do it with the instructors sat next to you but when you need it for real the task loading is massive.
The old adage about at 50 hours you think you know everything etc. is true!
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The old adage about at 50 hours you think you know everything etc. is true!
It is all well and good being able to do it with the instructors sat next to you but when you need it for real the task loading is massive.
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From: Chichester, UK
I did an IMC as a fairly new PPL (a bit more than 50 hours, but not many more) and I'd agree with bose-x. However, it's still very good training, provided that you accept that it isn't going to turn you into an IFR god flying NDB approaches down to 600 foot (or 300 foot, if you prefer 
). Is it the best use of money? With hindsight, probably not, but if IFR is your thing and money isn't too tight then it's fun and well worth doing.
As an aside, most low-hours IMC holders seem to do very little, if any, solo flying in IMC, so the only bit of the IMC training you'll probably use regularly while flying VFR is the radio nav stuff. You could cover the same stuff for much less money with the shorter AOPA Radio Navigation course - the attraction of the IMC must be strong though, because i've never met anyone who has done the AOPA course
). Is it the best use of money? With hindsight, probably not, but if IFR is your thing and money isn't too tight then it's fun and well worth doing. As an aside, most low-hours IMC holders seem to do very little, if any, solo flying in IMC, so the only bit of the IMC training you'll probably use regularly while flying VFR is the radio nav stuff. You could cover the same stuff for much less money with the shorter AOPA Radio Navigation course - the attraction of the IMC must be strong though, because i've never met anyone who has done the AOPA course
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From: Preston, UK
AOPA radio Nav course
Well I did the AOPA Nav course at Sherburn in the early eighties.
It counted towards the minimum hours needed for the IMC, which I did later.
I did it because I wanted to be able to use the available Nav kit in the aircraft I was hiring at the time.
You don't hear about it much these days though.
It counted towards the minimum hours needed for the IMC, which I did later.
I did it because I wanted to be able to use the available Nav kit in the aircraft I was hiring at the time.
You don't hear about it much these days though.
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: Chichester, UK
A bit like saying instrument flying is in the PPL, AA 
Looking through the book, the AOPA course seems far more comprehensive than the PPL - all I did in my PPL test was position fixing (VOR/DME, simple!) and tracking a VOR radial for a couple of minutes...
Looking through the book, the AOPA course seems far more comprehensive than the PPL - all I did in my PPL test was position fixing (VOR/DME, simple!) and tracking a VOR radial for a couple of minutes...
Joined: Jul 2004
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From: SURREY
I too have recently finished my PPL but am not sure of the need of an IMC rating as i would still want to see the ground even if i where to be tracking a VOR. Im actually wanting to get the MEP rating next and do cross-channel flying, so i guess it would not be valid on these routes anyway?
Does having an IMC rating still limit you to flying conditions throughout the year in a non anti-ice plane, but is it usefull to have anyway?
Does having an IMC rating still limit you to flying conditions throughout the year in a non anti-ice plane, but is it usefull to have anyway?
Cut & Paste Intellectual
Joined: Jul 2003
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
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From: Durham
Mr Murdoch
In the summertime during daylight hours- my humble recommendation.
Cost factor: don't forget the words of John Ruskin
The price might also be more than money?
Enjoy - it's great experience and one a Gentlemen Aviator should relish.
In the summertime during daylight hours- my humble recommendation.
Cost factor: don't forget the words of John Ruskin
"It is unwise to pay too much but is worse to pay too little. When you pay too much, you lose a little money... that is all. When you pay too little you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the things it was bought for"
Enjoy - it's great experience and one a Gentlemen Aviator should relish.
Joined: Sep 2003
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From: UK,Twighlight Zone
you will find and MEP rating is pretty restrictive without an anstrument rating of some sort. The IMC is a very good start.
I fly around 150hrs a year in twins and have found very little of that flying that could be done CFR only and make the most of the vast price you pay for a twin.
I fly around 150hrs a year in twins and have found very little of that flying that could be done CFR only and make the most of the vast price you pay for a twin.
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: UK
winter is not really the best time to do it in the Uk unless you are doing it an an anti/de-iced aircraft as the freezing level in the Uk is so low and the very restrictive nature of our airspace does not allow you to get above it.
I think autumn is probably best, as you've got most stability. Spring is almost certainly worst. I recently completed a week of fairly intense IF training in February, without weather interruption, but perhaps I was just lucky.
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: Brighton, UK
am not sure of the need of an IMC rating as i would still want to see the ground even if i where to be tracking a VOR.
As it turns out, keeping a cool head meant I got back in one piece but I have now resolved that I will get my IMC as soon as I can afford it. The way the weather goes in the UK you never know when you may need to call on it.
Joined: Sep 2003
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From: UK,Twighlight Zone
bookworm,
sorry to disagree, but the freezing level in the UK IS low enough to cause problems. When I did my IMC we did it late Autumn through early winter with most approaches into Cambridge and there were a number of days when I suffered severe airframe icing.
Don't be fooled by the freezing level you see on the metforms. I have had ice form at 1500ft above the flatlands.
Doing IR training was actually a lot better as we were above the freezing level most of the time.
sorry to disagree, but the freezing level in the UK IS low enough to cause problems. When I did my IMC we did it late Autumn through early winter with most approaches into Cambridge and there were a number of days when I suffered severe airframe icing.
Don't be fooled by the freezing level you see on the metforms. I have had ice form at 1500ft above the flatlands.
Doing IR training was actually a lot better as we were above the freezing level most of the time.