PA 28 Warrior 161
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I'd be very inclined to read the POH for the one you're flying, in conjunction with your W&B calculation.
Typical Vr is around 55 knots. Climbout depends whether you want best rate, best angle, or a compromise: somewhere between 63 and 75 knots. Descent whatever the profile needs - Vne is between 153 and 160 knots depending on variant. Approach speed typically 65 knots (weight dependant); RPM to suit speed and descent angle, but probably in the range 1500 to 2200 RPM. For a 3 degree GP and two up, I used around 1850 when I last flew one (couple of years ago).
Typical Vr is around 55 knots. Climbout depends whether you want best rate, best angle, or a compromise: somewhere between 63 and 75 knots. Descent whatever the profile needs - Vne is between 153 and 160 knots depending on variant. Approach speed typically 65 knots (weight dependant); RPM to suit speed and descent angle, but probably in the range 1500 to 2200 RPM. For a 3 degree GP and two up, I used around 1850 when I last flew one (couple of years ago).
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I'm just to take a dual check, and these are newly learned for a specific PA28-161 (all in knots):
Vr 60
Normal climb speed 80
Vy 79 (best rate)
Vx 63 (best angle)
Cruise climb 95
Typical Cruise 95 (max 100)
Vne 160
Vno 126
Vfe 103
Va (max weight) 111
Va (min weight) 88
Base leg 75
Approach (clean/dirty/short field) 70/65/60
Best glide 73
Max x wind 17 (demonstrated, not me!)
Vr 60
Normal climb speed 80
Vy 79 (best rate)
Vx 63 (best angle)
Cruise climb 95
Typical Cruise 95 (max 100)
Vne 160
Vno 126
Vfe 103
Va (max weight) 111
Va (min weight) 88
Base leg 75
Approach (clean/dirty/short field) 70/65/60
Best glide 73
Max x wind 17 (demonstrated, not me!)
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Cruise speed is odd. I did my PPL and IMC on a variety of PA-28-161s, and while the IMC one would happily criuise at 110kts none of the others did much over 100kts. No obvious external differences, so I've never really understood why one PA-28 was quicker than any of the others- only real difference is that the IMC one is not a club aeroplane and has never been used for ab initio circuit bashing, while the others have; I wonder if years of thump'n'gos work things loose or out of shape and add to the drag? Something for a PA-28 buyer to watch out for maybe.
- Vr is 45 to 55 depending upon weight, 60 is too fast.
- Typical 75% cruise is 105-115 depending upon weight and altitude, 100 seems rather slow to me.
- No idea about RPM settings on finals, I do it by feel and never look ! The POH shows 2500 for descent power setting.
G
N.B. If this is a flying school "quiz" and they haven't given you access to the official POH, give them a boiiocking and ask for a copy, you shouldn't be going near the aircraft without having read and digested it.
- Typical 75% cruise is 105-115 depending upon weight and altitude, 100 seems rather slow to me.
- No idea about RPM settings on finals, I do it by feel and never look ! The POH shows 2500 for descent power setting.
G
N.B. If this is a flying school "quiz" and they haven't given you access to the official POH, give them a boiiocking and ask for a copy, you shouldn't be going near the aircraft without having read and digested it.
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Be interested to see what kind of approach you are going to fly with 2500 rpm Ghengis old chap - that's cruise power. Somewhere around 1900 for downwind and 1600-1700 for base leg and final should do the trick.
Rotating at 45kts would be a bit daft too as the stall speed for a clean a/c with no power is around 53 kts. 60 kts is much closer to the figures used when I was flying PA28's, and gives a far greater margin of safety should you have a failure on take off.
Either way, defo check out the POH for your specific a/c. Pprune is not always the most reliable source of info.
Rotating at 45kts would be a bit daft too as the stall speed for a clean a/c with no power is around 53 kts. 60 kts is much closer to the figures used when I was flying PA28's, and gives a far greater margin of safety should you have a failure on take off.
Either way, defo check out the POH for your specific a/c. Pprune is not always the most reliable source of info.
45-55 is from the POH, personally I use 50 lightweight and 55 heavy. 65 is the normal initial climb speed, so you wouldn't be flying below Vso outside ground effect.
2500 does seem a little odd now you mention it, it's around 70% power in level flight. I think it's probably quoted as the optimum for maximum rate of descent - bearing in mind that RPM will increase without power in a steep dive. It's certainly not an appropriate speed for an approach to land.
G
2500 does seem a little odd now you mention it, it's around 70% power in level flight. I think it's probably quoted as the optimum for maximum rate of descent - bearing in mind that RPM will increase without power in a steep dive. It's certainly not an appropriate speed for an approach to land.
G
A little less conversation,
a little more aviation...
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One of the Warriors at White Waltham has recently had a 4 blade
prop fitted - only flown it once, but significantly quieter and seemed to be quicker - generally in the cruise at 2300rpm the rest of the Warriors make ~95kt - as I recall, G-DM was making
better than that at the same RPM. New engine as well though.
prop fitted - only flown it once, but significantly quieter and seemed to be quicker - generally in the cruise at 2300rpm the rest of the Warriors make ~95kt - as I recall, G-DM was making
better than that at the same RPM. New engine as well though.
Last edited by eharding; 8th Dec 2003 at 20:30.
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IMC one would happily criuise at 110kts none of the others did much over 100kts
Cheers
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I'd be very inclined to read the POH for the one you're flying, in conjunction with your W&B calculation.
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Talking of different shaped wings............................
Cherokees have the slab wing and are slower and better at load hauling. That goes for the PA28 Cherokees but also the Arrow and Lance.
The Arrow 3, Saratoga, Archer and Warriors are all tapered wing aircraft.
HTH
FD
Spoon PPRuNerist & Mad Inistrator
All the Warriors @ Fairoaks (PA28 161 warrior IIs) do 100 knots @ around 2450 RPM in the cruise. Supposed to be 105, but that was for perhaps rather younger aircraft. 
As a student I was told to plan for 105 knots, but found that 100 was actually much nearer the mark - and also easier to do mental calcs with.
I've flown a 180 HP Cherokee that did a rather brisk 120 knots (oo-er missus) at 2400.
tonyhalsall - yes, it is a generality! It seems that if the PA 28 1xy designator ends in 1 (e.g. 161) it has the tapered wing.
The PA28 Cherokee family originally included the Warrior as a variant along with the Archer and Dakota, although the Cherokee prefix was subsequently dropped for the Archer and the Warrior! The Cherokee 140, 150, 160 and 180 have the slab wing and the tapered wing with washout started with the Warrior 151 and is also on the PA-28-161 Warrior II and III, the PA-28-181 Cherokee Archer II and PA-28-236 Dakota, PA-28-201T Turbo Dakota and PA-28-161 Cadet (similar to the Warrior, but stripped down as a dedicated trainer).
But it isn't even as simple as that, as there are other PA28 variations to consider (eg retractables) that I don't know wot of. I'm sure that you can find a website or two with lots of info.
And I'm also sure that others will correct what I've written!
Cheers
SD
As a student I was told to plan for 105 knots, but found that 100 was actually much nearer the mark - and also easier to do mental calcs with.
I've flown a 180 HP Cherokee that did a rather brisk 120 knots (oo-er missus) at 2400.
tonyhalsall - yes, it is a generality! It seems that if the PA 28 1xy designator ends in 1 (e.g. 161) it has the tapered wing.
The PA28 Cherokee family originally included the Warrior as a variant along with the Archer and Dakota, although the Cherokee prefix was subsequently dropped for the Archer and the Warrior! The Cherokee 140, 150, 160 and 180 have the slab wing and the tapered wing with washout started with the Warrior 151 and is also on the PA-28-161 Warrior II and III, the PA-28-181 Cherokee Archer II and PA-28-236 Dakota, PA-28-201T Turbo Dakota and PA-28-161 Cadet (similar to the Warrior, but stripped down as a dedicated trainer).
But it isn't even as simple as that, as there are other PA28 variations to consider (eg retractables) that I don't know wot of. I'm sure that you can find a website or two with lots of info.
And I'm also sure that others will correct what I've written!
Cheers
SD
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The PA28XXX1 designator for the tapered wing applies also to the Arrow. The PA28R200 is the Arrow 2 with the "Hershey bar" wing, the -201 is the Arrow 3 with the taper.
The Arrow 200 is a few knots faster than the 201. I recall the MTWA is less, though (not got the books here so can't check).
The Warrior 151 I used for my FAA training in Florida last year would cruise at 110 knots at 2400RPM (when trimmed right). Quite an impressive little beast, it was!
I'd previously flown a PA28-180 that could just manage 95 knots at 2400 (but that was in Detroit, so someone may have nicked one of the pots).
The Arrow 200 is a few knots faster than the 201. I recall the MTWA is less, though (not got the books here so can't check).
The Warrior 151 I used for my FAA training in Florida last year would cruise at 110 knots at 2400RPM (when trimmed right). Quite an impressive little beast, it was!
I'd previously flown a PA28-180 that could just manage 95 knots at 2400 (but that was in Detroit, so someone may have nicked one of the pots).