BA Baggage Allowance Cuts
 

Not sure if this has come up in the last week (whilst I was away), but it appears that BA is changing its baggage policy - which can mean an upto 18kg cut in checked luggage allowance, and difficulties for ensuring luggage is under limits.

Changes are summarised at http://www.britishairways.com/travel...y/public/en_gb

Comments...?
Jordan

18 kg been the biggest cut. What about the +23 kg increase for WT+ pax traveling towards the east? or the +16kg increase for F or J pax traveling to the east? And club europe pax have had the same increase in baggage allowence. Its only west bound travel that has suffered a 18 kg cut.

email from BA

We're making a few changes to our hand baggage and checked baggage allowances.

The new baggage policy is easy to follow and will reduce airport queues, making your journey quicker and hassle-free. The policy changes include hand, checked and excess baggage allowances and will be phased in over the next five months. I’ve included a quick guide below, and a link to the complete policy if you'd like to read more.

HAND BAGGAGE
From 5 July 2006, all customers will be able to take one standard-sized bag (maximum size of 56cm x 45cm x 25cm), plus one briefcase, laptop bag or equivalent into the cabin as hand baggage. You must be able to lift your hand baggage into the overhead locker unaided and the briefcase or laptop computer bag or equivalent must fit under the seat in front of you.

CHECKED BAGGAGE
From 11 October, we will be making changes to the number of bags that you can check in. This will vary according to your class of travel and route. The maximum weight per bag will be reduced to 23kgs to comply with health and safety recommendations.

EXCESS BAGGAGE
Excess baggage charges will also be standardised from 11 October. A fixed fee, dependent on the journey length, will be charged for each bag in excess of the free checked baggage allowance. In the majority of cases the new charges will be less than those currently levied and a further 20% discount will be available by pre-paying on line at ba.com

Is current health and safety guidelines not 32kg then? BA have always been more generous for economy pax with a 23kg limit, but what if you've paid for a club or first ticket? What if you're flying to the US where according to IATA allowances are 2pieces at 32kg? (Although a lot of the US airlines are now ignoring this!):confused:

Flying is getting more confusing by the chopping and changing of things like this it is more hassle for the average pax to understand easily.

So BA think all passengers will put one piece under the seat and the other in the locker? dream on. Thos onboard early will fill all the lockers up. Pity the poor CC trying to sort this out and the Pax who are going to find their hand luggage chucked into the baggage hold.
It might work up front with fewer passengers per locker but not a chance in the back.

Some discussion was kicked off about this here in this thread over on Airlines, Airports and Routes.

FWIW, I'm not a "kitchen sink" person, but my problems with this are the reduction in flexibility with the new approach, and the fact that too many people will now bring too much cabin baggage for the economy cabin, with all the associated problems that are well known.

I think it's getting simpler, the differentiation in service levels between carriers is becoming less and less. BA is just following the leads set by Easyjet (take what you like on board as long as you can lift it) and Ryanair (checked baggage is a profit centre). It's getting to be the only difference between the carriers is how much you pay (Ryanair < Easyjet < BA), and whether they are late/cancelled or not (Ryanair better than Easy better than BA).

Having now read the regs:
1 Bag per Economy passenger checked in?. Guess WW has made it clear where he wants to position BA in the market.

32Kg is defined as a two man lift. 25 Kg is a one man lift.

Whether the numbers are better or not is arguable, what is clear is that it is long overdue to have a policy and stick to it.
Most of us will have found ourselves waiting in the check in queue whilst the couple at the front load their 8 various packages and parcels on the belt, including TV sets, fridges etc. (you know the sort), then start to argue whilst the check in agent tells them that they are X kgs. overweight and that will cost Y dollars or whatever, whilst all those behind them get more and more frustrated.
If the agent now says that two bags are free and the others cost Y$ per bag, with no haggling, then that would be quicker for everyone.
I am a bit dubious about a hand baggage limit controlled by size rather than weight because I suspect many will just try it on, with bigger and bigger bags.
On a recent flight from Nice some economy passengers were coming on with 2 large wheely-bags and expecting to stow them overhead, meaning others couldn't even find room for their coats.
Provided they make it clear that anything over the size limit goes in the hold with the appropriate charge, and no arguments then it might just work.

Whats also cr*p about this policy, is that say I am travelling and want to split my 23kg allowance from one large bag into two smaller bags (for convience, or for any other reason, because I am the traveller, I've paid for the ticket and I can pack how I want), I am now no longer allowed to do this.

Why? Surely if I turn up with 23kg of checked luggage, and my allowance is 23kg, thats all that should matter. Not how many bags I've chosen to put said luggage into.

Its a bloody disgrace.

Jordan

I agree with a previous comment, this is a bloody disgrace, but especially to Club and First passengers who pay so much more. I've a keen interest as I'm flying out to the States on the day policy comes into effect. I've booked a ringside seat for the Passengers v Check In fight, likely to go over a hundred or more bouts!! I'm now trying to change my flight to avoid the riot.:eek: :ouch:
I booked Club partly because of extra hand luggage allowance, checked luggage was never in question. In so doing paid £1,000 more than economy seat. Why did I bother? I can now travel with the same luggage as if I pay £400 on a sale fare (travel allowance is same whether F, C, WT+ or WT on US routes). Scandalous!:mad:
Despite paying more I'll still get clobbered by excess fees should I dare to bring the amount of luggage BA's contract says I can have. This is outrageous.
Cabin baggage is now unlimited in weight so I look forward to mini fridges, car engines, and other wonderful items on board - if they fit in the size of bag who cares how much it weighs. This will alleviate any savings BA hope to make on fuel, and could raise a safety issue if weight is not determined for items. I personally would be interested to see how BA react when a fridge falls out of an overhead and lands on a passenger!
BA say its down to health & safety but other baggage handlers at Heathrow are still able to manage to deal with 32kg limits. I am a 5'2" 51 year old lady and if I can manage to lift my bags, then I'm sure a strapping baggage handler can do the same. If not, perhaps they should be in a different role.
Or perhaps BA are trying to cut out the baggage handlers altogether??!! :hmm:
Note VS still allow 3 pieces up to 32kg each. Despite my strong preference for BA, I will have no hesitation in changing my carrier next time round. I'd do it this year, but realistically would be "cutting off my nose to spite my face".

Ah, but what if I was travelling elsewhere?

Jordan

There are things about this policy which are not good, and about which I've vented elsewhere. But we also have to keep this in perspective.

Current North Atlantic (broadly speaking) allowances:
First: 2 bags x 32 kg each
Club: 2 bags x 32 kg each
WT+: 2 bags x 32 kg each
WT: 2 bags x 32 kg each

New North Atlantic allowances:
First: 2 bags x 23 kg each
Club: 2 bags x 23 kg each
WT+: 2 bags x 23 kg each
WT: 2 bags x 23 kg each

So for current piece count routes, First and Club pax currently have the same baggage allowance as WT+ and WT. There isn't really a valid complaint on these routes that because you've paid more, therefore you should have more baggage allowance - it's already the current position that everyone gets the same.

The real complaint should be that 2 x 23 kg isn't enough for First and Club.

Current rest-of-world allowances:
First: 40 kg
Club: 30 kg
WT+: 23 kg
WT: 23 kg

New rest-of-world allowances:
First: 2 bags x 23 kg each = 46 kg (increase of 6 kg over current limit)
Club: 2 bags x 23 kg each = 46 kg (increase of 16 kg over current limit)
WT+: 2 bags x 23 kg each = 46 kg (increase of 23 kg over current limit)
WT: 1 bags x 23 kg each = same weight as current limit

So nobody is allowed less weight than before, and all the premium classes are allowed more weight than currently.

As I say, there are other problems with this, with which I'm not happy. But let's make sure that criticism is directed where it belongs.

Hi Globaliser - put it that way it doesn't sound so bad!! But I booked in good faith without any forewarning they were planning this, and am now having to pay even more. Most people I've spoken to agree they'd be p....d off! Yes I can put more items into my hand luggage, but the 1,000 metre sprint to Immigration in the US is bad enough with light hand luggage, let alone heavy stuff.:D
The decent thing to do would be for BA to honour their commitment of 32kg to those pax who booked before the change was announced, but travelling on or after implementation date. Provided of course that those pax do not exceed the old TOTAL checked limit of 64kg, ie. instead of 2 bags at 32kg, 3 bags at 21 or 22kg each. That would be a fair compromise for all.;)
Another quick thought - the overhead bins on the upstairs of 747's are often smaller than others on the a/c, so that will place a further, albeit slight, limit on pax seated up there. The side bins are handy, but not very roomy being so slim.
Does anyone know if VS are planning to follow suit with this? Their allowance is better and they offer more to premium pax, ie. limo transfer, etc. I just happen to prefer BA because of my history with them and their professionalism on board.

I agree with this. It's one of the wrinkles that they ought to have sorted out in the policy before they announced it. They had long enough to think about things like that, especially during the delays in the announcement.

We have got some new bag size gauges to put at check in and at the gates. They are like the scales BA had a few years ago. The bin is about 3ft off the floor and if you can lift your bag in it is OK.
Lets see how they are used.

I've seen it posted elsewhere today (another BB) that if you had a confirmed reservation made before the policy announcement for travel after the new checked baggage policy comes into effect (11 October 2006), and your reservation is ticketed by 10 October 2006, you will have 2 x 32 kg as it currently is now.

This is sensible (as I've already said). You may want to confirm this with BA. I hope they'll make this clear on their website.

Ticketed means exactly that; a confirmed reservation with a PNR locator is not itself enough. If you have a BA locator, use it on www.checkmytrip.com to see whether there is a ticket number showing in your PNR.

Hi Globaliser - thanks for this, I do hope you're right. As I said before, this would be honourable thing to do.
I have e-ticket, and ticket number's shown in the res with all the pricing details, etc. Manage my Booking still shows 2 x 32kg, but BA Res said they were working to change this. BA web site still doesn't say anything about those already booked. We wait and see. :confused:
Meanwhile, I've decided might be best all round to try and change flt to day or two before so as to avoid chaos at check-in on first day of new policy. Now just have to wait for right class of service to come up to allow me to do it!!
Thanks again - much appreciated. :)

Florida as you have ticket numbers on your e-reservation that means that your flights have already been ticketed so the old baggage allowance will apply. Which will be 2x32kgs for your transatlantic sectors.

Hi Globaliser and Lexxity - just wondered where your info came from. Just spoken to BA res and they advise that what you say is NOT the case, I will only be able to take 2 x 23kg NOT 2 x32kg. :mad:
Are you ground staff - have you been told differently? Would love to know where you heard this.

Hi Florida I've been searching the BA website for their terms and conditions and here is what it says in their general terms and conditions of carriage


It also states on ba.com

It also states:

So from what I can make out your allowance is 2x32kgs. Time for Flying Lawer to take a look at this I think.

(BTW, I don't work for BA, but I do work in the industry.)


Link here.

Hi Lexxity - thanks your response. I'd already looked into the T&C's but you know BA with their heavy legal team would never let a man on the street get away with suing them for something like this. Even in the terms you sent, the phrase "and will depend on our baggage regulations applying at the time of your flight" will no doubt cover them if they want to change the rules. :mad:
Whilst at Sir Freddie Laker's memorial last week one of the things that made everyone laugh was the way Sir F always used to say "sue the B.....ds" when anything went wrong - believe me I'd love to do it, but know I don't have a leg to stand on.:ugh:
Fairly new to PPrune - who is Flying Lawer? If it's someone with the forums who can give any legal advice, would be greatly appreciated.

Meant to add this to previous message - the attached was taken from BA's website
Customers booked to travel should arrive at the airport two hours before the scheduled departure time, as normal. However, we advise customers to minimise the amount of hand baggage they carry with them and allow sufficient time to clear central security searches.[/I]
It seems like the left hand doesn't know what the right's doing at BA. Sure a lot will agree with me there. Either that or total hypocrisy.:ugh: :=
I look forward to getting as familiar with the VS product as I have BA over the years. World's Favourite Airline? Not for much longer.:uhoh:

I was only passing on what I'd seen on another BB. I'm sorry that BA are denying it.

What I'd read did have the ring of truth about it: It looked like it was a carefully-crafted policy that got around the potential contract problems that BA would have if they strictly applied the new allowances to bookings made before the announcement. Some other airlines in a similar situation have adopted a grandfathering attitude towards existing bookings, which is why I thought that it was sensible. It was also too carefully-crafted to have been something dreamt up on the spot by a res/sales agent on a frolic of their own.Unfortunately, history suggests that VS will not be far behind; they often lag BA in unpopular changes, sliding them in quietly. Of course, VS' better relationship with the media also means that the media conveniently ignore the changes that VS make first and hit BA when BA comes second (eg the last round of fuel surcharge increases, and the reduction for Y trans-Atlantic pax from 2 piece x 32 kg to 2 pieces x 23 kg).

I agree, though, with your point about minimising cabin baggage. This whole thing is a policy shambles.

Thanks Globaliser. I'm still hoping they will do the honourable thing - guess there's time to do so - I'm saying my nightly prayers!
When I made the comments about VS, I admit I was wrong in reading their info and hadn't realised VS was already down to 2 x 23kg in Economy. :O
However, their premium cabins have allowance of 2 x 32kg for PE and 3 x 32kg for Upper Class, which is equivalent to BA Club. That's recognition of extra they've paid. Let's not forget VS provide limo for UC pax within 50 miles of M25 (I am!) - that's another plus BA don't offer.
A further point, BA Res said how would check in staff be able to cope with some at 32kg and some at 23kg. Quite easy really if the PNR was flagged appropriately, even easier for those in premium cabins who check in at separate desks!

Hi Florida, Flying Lawer is a very nice chap on this site who is a lawyer. He would be able to advise you in clear terms where you stand. He is great at putting legal jargon into plain english.

Confused pax
 

I am trying to understand how these new baggage rules apply to the whole BA empire. Most of my sectors start with what is now BA Connect from the Isle of Man. Now as they are not BA Mainline I guess there's a bit missing at the moment from the policy to warn those pax flying subsidiaries that the new policy does not apply to them.....?
So I anticipate those wonderful people who crew G-MABR (the BAe146-100 which unfortunately replaced the much missed and possibly sold in error 146-200 G-MIMA on the IOM-LGW route) to be confronted with over burdened pax fighting for a slice of the totally inadequate locker space on this aircraft in the mistaken belief that their BA ticket entitles them to carry their two huge bags on board. Of course I will be arguing equally strongly since I am connecting with another BA service which offers to carry my overweight carry-ons, provided I can lift one of them into the locker (which of course I can, 'cos I've been training for this moment..!)
Perhaps the bigger driver for this new policy is the realisation by BA management that allowing the customer to print out his own boarding pass permits him/her to bypass all the human checks including an assessment of carry-on baggage until he/she is almost on board the aircraft, so what the hell - if he/she can carry it, let it on board.
Oh and I'll have to pack some scales to check the weight of my checked luggage on its return journey to ensure I don't exceed the new maxima (which incidently we did on our return from our family holiday last month).
As a Gold card holder and a BA shareholder I have to wonder what is really going on here.

According to the BBC, Heathrow are now going to be imposing their own limits on the amount of hand luggage that passengers can carry through security. I'm not sure how this works with BA's new policy. It would appear that not only are different parts of BA not speaking to each other but also that no one is speaking to BAA!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/5097328.stm

As I understand it, the gauges will be sized to match exactly the new BA limit. Or maybe it's the other way around.

I am flying to SAfrica next Feb, tickets booked 8 weeks ago for the 2 of us. BA have confirmed today that the new limits apply (they have even 'kindly' changed the allowance limits on my exec club ebooking page), and not the ones in the T&Cs when I purchased the ticket for which I have a written copy. Pathetic and probably not lawful

edited to add: And further after a long discussion with BA Customer Services, they were exceptionally careful not to answer my question 'will you honour the T&Cs of my booking' repeated a number of times. Good politicians I will grant them that.

Hi ManintheBack - I'm in same situation. No matter what you ask them - they won't say anything except the new policy will apply to all passengers.:ugh:
I agree it may not be legal with those holding ticketed reservations, but if you look further back in this thread you will see something which is along the lines of carrying your baggage free of charge, subject to the terms and conditions which exist at the time of travel. Something like that. As others have said on this and other sites, this has not been worded the best and may or may not be a get out clause for them. It'd be interesting to hear if any legal bods have any viewpoint.

hey maninthe back.
for you it should not really make a difference (assuming you fly from italy to south africa. baggage limit on that route has always been 23kg per person on that route. the only difference is, that now you only have 1 bag per person.
actually you ar winning, as you are allowed to take more handluggage.
if flying from the US it is a bit different, but overall (including handluggage) you are still allowed to take about the same amount of luggage.
if flying business class it 2*23kg, so more than you were allowed to.
only passengers really loosing is pax flying from america. but there it seems it is not a standard to have only 2*23 (instead of 2*32) kg (saw the same limits on CO).

EXPECT DELAYS....

....when this fully comes into effect. As crew for BA we have been instructed by the company (and totally backed up by our union) not to touch any bag in any circumstances as a result of the revised weight limit. Many of us even have little cards in our pockets to back this up should we develope any grievences with customers.
So make sure you can lift your heavy bag into the lockers by yourself (keeping in mind some lockers are smaller/higher than others and lets not even get into a discussion about the 767) or you will be asked by the crew to wheel it up to the door and have it placed in the hold, even if your a little old lady.
Sounds harsh I know but unfortunately why should we risk injuring our own backs (which is very easy to do even with a light bag) for the sake of this new baggage policy especially when the company wont pay for any treatment.

My bolding applies
Your post is not 100% clear. If you are referring to flying business class to the US, luggage allowance is NOT more than you were allowed, but rather 18kg (or 20lbs) less over the 2 bags. A BIG difference.:*
You add "there it seems it is not a standard to have only 2*23 ..." - again this doesn't make sense and not sure what you mean - whether it is standard or not.
Most, if not all, US carriers now only allow 2 x 23kg, though they will allow passengers to have bags up to 32kg, provided excess is paid.
Furthermore, VS continues to allow 2 x 32kg for PE pax and 3 x 32kg for Upper Class - equivalent to BA's Club. It is only Economy that is restricted to 23kg with VS.
Yet BA will charge their WT+, Club and First passengers for anything over 23kg. :=
This is why it's so unfair on the transatlantic routes and has the potential to lose them a lot of high end business.

apaddyinuk
What is the policy for a disabled passengers cabin baggage if BA’s policy is “not to touch any bag in any circumstances”?

Without wishing to detract from all the factual information given by others, my view of this is a tad cynical - particularly with BA. When it comes down to it, their preferred customers (the big-ticket, silver/gold club members) will be allowed to bring on board what they please, just as now.
Who hasn't had to struggle to find overhead space anywhere near their seat because of this, or watch others bring cabin luggage on board that beggars the rules when one has been denied modest items?

If BA try to enforce rules that were not in force and not advised at the time of booking they will, at least in the UK, come under the Unfair Contract Terms Act, which will hold them to be unreasonable and therefore unenforceable.

Why?

It's unlikely everyone would, but if every passenger on a Jumbo split their allowance into 2 bags, it would take twice as long to load the bags! Twice as long to offload them and twice as long for a bag to be found if a passenger fails to make the flight they've checked in for. BA are trying to improve punctuality, because this is one of the most important factors discovered in results from customer feedback.

BA have been fairly laid back until now. Many passengers have taken advantage. This has been recognised and it has spoilt it for everyone.

Previous to this new policy, review any of the flights during boarding. You would regularly see the Cabin Crew fighting with overhead lockers, lifting overweight bags about the cabin themselves just to get all the bags in to approved places so that the flight can leave on time (Gents, would you expect a female on a train to help you with a heavy bag and risk injury?).

I have sat and witnessed people turning up on a plane with a large wheelie bag, a laptop bag, a cabin bag and a jacket, as well as duty free shopping and whatever else they've collected from various other airport shops. Well above the allowance. Then expect the crew to help or put their heavy bags into the wardrobe, which it is not stressed for to be safe. (And Leclairage, its not the cardholders who are the guilty party as they have already paid extra for the privelege, but on European routes tend to be on businees for a day or two, whereas the majority in Economy are leisure and carry more in the cabin as they are going fopr longer).

I know that for one night away, I can fit all of my belongings and clothes into a bag twice the size of my laptop. For 5 days everything fits into a small trolley bag. If i'm away for longer I have my laptop bag for the cabin, and a suitcase for the hold but I don't go overweight.

Passengers know the rules and have relied on BA's discretion and goodwill for so long. Now they are changing it no-ones happy!!

And as large companies like BA know, the man in the street isnt going to sue them.