Flying in to West Berlin

[Less Hair]

I seem to remember Air Berlin USA had mid range 720s? At Tempelhof there was a tiny regional airline commuting for the Nixdorf computer company to Paderborn with the Rockwell aero commander and doing medevac flights and such followed by Tempelhof Airways, Omniflight, Conti Flug and Berlin Regional finally.

[SpringHeeledJack]

I flew into Tempelhof from Paris on a propellor job belonging to Lufthansa/sub group in 1990 probably September. A beautiful evening and probably still more or less the airways in use during the post-blockade time period. Exiting the aircraft on the apron in front of the terminal and hangars and then walking the 150m to the entry door was sublime in terms of atmosphere and visual impression, Ol' Albert's architecture was both impressive and imposing in equal measure and the arrivals hall still working back then was like a movie set. Sadly these days Tempelhof is now the largest Refugee camp in Germany https://www.firstpost.com/world/refu...n-3908469.html

I remember that the team I was working with moved between the 4 sectors of the city daily during the course of the time I was there and it was fascinating to see all the Russian vehicles and signs and people in the Russian sector, then the same in the French sector and so on with the British and American sectors. Everything was somehow the same as before, yet 'different' as there was now no legal restriction stopping movement and yet old habits die hard :-)

I went up in the Fernsehturm(Onion) and it had that distinct smell that was evident in many East German/Soviet buildings and aircraft for that matter. Perhaps some plastic or bonding chemical odour ? A decade later I was driven in a taxi at 2am in a snowstorm through the Brandenburg Gate with not another vehicle or person to be seen, another unplanned magical moment where 'if only' a smartphone camera had been available to capture the essence of the moment, or at least a slither thereof. Sadly soon after the Brandenburg gate was closed to traffic and even pedestrians due to 'security concerns'.

[Discorde]

Before the German reunification Britannia Airways was contracted to operate MoD trooping flights from LTN to Berlin Gatow. Routing was Centre Corridor FL095 eastbound and FL085 westbound. Here's the briefing, which also required the Interception Procedures in the Jeppesen manuals to be 'immediately available to both pilots'. The comment that 'bad weather is not likely to be lethal' was perhaps not as reassuring as intended by the compiler.







Here's a potted history of the corridors.

Berlin's Air Corridors

[WHBM]

Contrary to some descriptions, Schonefeld airport, to the south of the city, was not in East Berlin, but just outside it in the mainstream GDR, and thus the whole additional panoply of restrictions for the country were applied to those using it. At least the runways were parallel to Tempelhof/Tegel. There was a special regular GDR bus which left from by the Zoo station in West Berlin, direct to the airport, on which documents and tickets were substantially checked at boarding, then again at the southern zone boundary, then again on alighting at the airport. It appeared to operate mostly empty.

The comments about Britannia 737s operating into Gatow are interesting, this was part of the longstanding contract they had for the UK military bases in West Germany, into other points as well like Wildenrath. Onetime university colleague became a translator for the MOD in Whitehall, and regularly travelled to Germany; if with the Minister it was BA from Heathrow, but sometimes Ministry parsimony prevailed and he was on a Britannia charter from Luton, just him in his meeting suit for a discussion on arrival, among the squaddies, squealing babies in bassinets hung from the overheads which swung in turbulence, etc. His descriptions of such flights entertained several of our later get-togethers.

[Hew Jampton]

What was the origin of the 'rule' that you couldn't go to Berlin unless you'd been before?

[barry lloyd]

Contrary to some descriptions, Schonefeld airport, to the south of the city, was not in East Berlin, but just outside it in the mainstream GDR, and thus the whole additional panoply of restrictions for the country were applied to those using it. At least the runways were parallel to Tempelhof/Tegel. There was a special regular GDR bus which left from by the Zoo station in West Berlin, direct to the airport, on which documents and tickets were substantially checked at boarding, then again at the southern zone boundary, then again on alighting at the airport. It appeared to operate mostly empty.

I flew out of Schönefeld a few times in the 70s. It sat in the state of Brandenburg. Possibly the most miserable and underused airport in Eastern Europe in those days. Since I was already in East Berlin, I would take the train to the airport, but it seemed to take forever to get there. Then through the dimly-lit terminal to an Interflug IL-18 to Sofia or Bucharest. Oh, the joys of travelling in the GDR!

[Less Hair]

Schönefeld was inside the Berlin Control Zone but just outside the four sector city. (You can see the "border" line between (East)-Berlin and Brandenburg (not the former "wall") inside the LAT sim center marked on the sim hall floor next to the 737-800 sim. Back then it was DDR-Bezirk Cottbus, not Bundesland Brandenburg.
There is another interesting airport almost forgotten: Werneuchen. Former soviet military, inside the control zone. Having had Mig-25 based there that crossed the control zone (by allied permission) including inner city, sometimes supersonic, on their way to the baltic sea SR-71 "interceptions".

[F-flyer]

Originally Posted by WHBM

Contrary to some descriptions, Schonefeld airport, to the south of the city, was not in East Berlin, but just outside it in the mainstream GDR

Flughafen Schönefeld from 1970's DDR map

The entirely white area behind the purple line is West Berlin. On the other side of the area behind the purple line is 'Berlin Hauptstadt der DDR' (Grünbergallee S-Bahn is still the last S-Bahn stop within Berlin city limits). The south side of the purple line is 'das Land Brandenburg'

Which is why the current airport is named Berlin Brandenberg Airport ('Flughafen Berlin Brandenburg') as it serves both the city state of Berlin and the state of Brandenburg.

It never occurred to me, until reading this thread, that Schönefeld was located outside the four allied-powers sectors of Berlin, which of course it was.

East Germany was seeking 'hard currency' and flights were much cheaper from Schönefeld. I remember KLM, Austrian and Swiss also ran a few flights to Schönefeld, as the four allies held something of a monopoly on flights operating from within the four sectors.

I remember catching a transit bus service to West Berlin having flown from Budapest to Schönefeld on Malév. The plane was a Tupolev Tu-154 which was built like a tank.

I sat towards the very back of the plane and enjoyed the sound of the Kuznetsov jets attached to either side of the rear fusalage. Like a Boeing 727 but much, much louder!

[Less Hair]

At the very left end of the map right north of the border to West Berlin at the green "park" there was a famous wallside spotters hill where Westeners could listen to the sound of the eastern engines and see them approach and go. They would mostly climb and descent at very shallow angles to be seen for miles and miles. Airband receivers worked well too but officially were verboten. The other green "park" was a comms int site...

[F-flyer]

Originally Posted by Less Hair

At the very left end of the map right north of the border to West Berlin at the green "park" there was a famous wallside spotters hill where Westeners could listen to the sound of the eastern engines and see them approach and go

You are referring to Dörferblick in Rudow, the man-made rubble hill from WWII debris. It's meant to rise 85.6 metres above sea level which, for Berlin is a mountain!

This from a 1980's West Berlin map which fills in the details on the 'other' side of the divide. The green triangle at the point of the border.

[WHBM]

Originally Posted by F-flyer

East Germany was seeking 'hard currency' and flights were much cheaper from Schönefeld. I remember KLM, Austrian and Swiss also ran a few flights to Schönefeld, as the four allies held something of a monopoly on flights operating from within the four sectors.

I remember catching a transit bus service to West Berlin having flown from Budapest to Schönefeld on Malév. The plane was a Tupolev Tu-154 which was built like a tank.

I sat towards the very back of the plane and enjoyed the sound of the Kuznetsov jets attached to either side of the rear fusalage. Like a Boeing 727 but much, much louder!

The GDR holiday flights were not hugely cheaper, just sufficiently. The GDR authorities may have been exceptionally tedious, but they weren't stupid. One destination that developed was the Bulgarian Black Sea coast, served through Varna and Burgas. Families who had been divided would commonly go there for a holiday together, from East and West, and occasionally would exchange passports, the GDR family would return to Dusseldorf etc, and once arrived the Western family would present at the BRD consulate and say they had been drunk and all their possessions (but not their BRD ID cards) stolen ...

The Tu154 was actually quite a straightforward design, one impressive feature was every landing with them seemed a greaser, something much of Eastern Europe regularly commented on once Boeings and Airbus arrived there. I don't quite know how they did it.

Strangely, the last Caravelle, of all types, I ever saw airborne was approaching Schonefeld, post-reunification. I had noticed in the timetable that Syrian Arab were still running one once weekly on Saturdays on Copenhagen - Berlin - Istanbul - Damascus. Forgot about this, was in.an S-Bahn train going out eastwards to Erkner, and there passing right in front of the train was the Caravelle, on finals. Ran across the train to see it from both sides.Last one I saw.

[Less Hair]

I remember the Caravelle operated by Air France to Tegel only before AF switched to the then brand new A320. Syrian Arab Airlines had 727 IIRC? I have never seen any Caravelle at SXF ever. However they were quite a few Tu-134 including the "glass nose" versions with navigator seats. One of the noisiest aircraft around.