Emirates allegedly let passenger die.
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Emirates allegedly let passenger die.
If this turns out to be accurate, it points to either a significant lack of training or a significant cultural cabin crew problem:
Emirates airline sued over Carol Wilson's death | News.com.au
Emirates airline sued over Carol Wilson's death | News.com.au
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the plane was landing at the time
It would appear from the news reports that the plane was landing, ie this was not mid-atlantic. Given that landing would mean that the full resources of ground paramedics would be available then the decision may have been made by the flight deck, based on verbal information from the cabin crew, to get the plane down ASAP.
Since the cabin would need to be secure for landing then if the crew decided to start CPR and the defib then the plane would need to circle whilst this was going on. It had been a long flight from the Middle East to the USA so obviously remaining fuel may have been an issue. And the cabin crew who aren't trained Doctors would have been forced to make the decision as to how ill this person was, Given they could be on the ground in say ten minutes or less then I suspect this was a large element in their decision making.
Letting the other passengers off first is a bit bizarre though, I would have expected the paramedics stood at the gate with their gear would have been making a huge fuss about getting onboard and not sitting there watching an entire plane unload with assorted carry on, strollers, duty free..
Also people these days think terrorism, you know, a plane from the Middle East, distracting the pilots and crew etc on approach to the homeland, sounds silly but it is uppermost in a lot of people's minds..
Condolences to the lady and her family
G
Since the cabin would need to be secure for landing then if the crew decided to start CPR and the defib then the plane would need to circle whilst this was going on. It had been a long flight from the Middle East to the USA so obviously remaining fuel may have been an issue. And the cabin crew who aren't trained Doctors would have been forced to make the decision as to how ill this person was, Given they could be on the ground in say ten minutes or less then I suspect this was a large element in their decision making.
Letting the other passengers off first is a bit bizarre though, I would have expected the paramedics stood at the gate with their gear would have been making a huge fuss about getting onboard and not sitting there watching an entire plane unload with assorted carry on, strollers, duty free..
Also people these days think terrorism, you know, a plane from the Middle East, distracting the pilots and crew etc on approach to the homeland, sounds silly but it is uppermost in a lot of people's minds..
Condolences to the lady and her family
G
Paxing All Over The World
I note the liberal use of 'allegedly' in the newspaper article, as this will go to court.
groundbum Has a very good round up the key points. This must have been horrible but, as I have 20 years experience in dealing with recently bereaved people (not medical experience) then I can say that what happened is very normal. I support the view that TV medical dramas have led people to believe that more can be done than is possible. There are countless shows where 'they brought him back'. In truth, the majority of those who suffer a major heart attack - die from it, irrespective of treatment and even when they are already IN hospital.
A defibrillator is only for treating a hear that is fibrillating. If the heart has suffered a full arrest - defib unit will not necessarily help. There is no telling what her situation was, as only a medical person could do that. None was available, just is they are not available in the greatest majority of cases.
Cardiac arrests that come 'out of the blue, with no previous hint of trouble' are so common that no medic thinks it unusual. Of course - to the family it is and they are, of course, totally aghast at it. Just last month, I saw a family where the woman who had died 'out of the blue' was 39 years old and NOT on an aeroplane after a long journey with any complications that might or might not have given her.
Many times I have heard people say, "As soon as he/she fell over, I knew they were gone" and that includes my step-mother of my own father's fatal heart attack.
I have often heard of hospital doctors thinking that someone is stable and telling the family to go home and rest and - within an hour the person is dead. I won't bore with many other examples but death does happen VERY fast and this family will naturally think that the airline was negligent. They may have been, or they may not have been - since the only information is the post mortem and the inquest, we do not yet know. The family wish to sue, so they can call the flight crew and the paramedics and learn of the decisions and timing.
They may well find that the time scale that they thought was 20 miuntes was actually 2. When we are in crisis, the brain does strange things with memory. Which is why, as we all know, three 'eye witness' reports of the same incident can produce three separate incidents.
Their lawyer is whipping it up with statements about all pax should be worried by this. Tell that to the family of the 39 year old, who died at home with no one around to call an ambulance until she was found an hour later. Every person should be worried about that. My sympathies are with the family, because I meet newly bereaved people every week. But they do not yet have all the information.
When a death occurs many people look for some one to blame in the short term as they start to adjust and learn what actually happened. I have known families baying for their day in court but, once they have the post mortem explained and they read what the doctors said before and after the death - they go home and grieve because they then understand.
For this family, they have yet to understand. I hope that they will be able to gain enough information for them to understand what happened to their mother. Taking the airline to court may not bring them any more information or anything else at all.
groundbum Has a very good round up the key points. This must have been horrible but, as I have 20 years experience in dealing with recently bereaved people (not medical experience) then I can say that what happened is very normal. I support the view that TV medical dramas have led people to believe that more can be done than is possible. There are countless shows where 'they brought him back'. In truth, the majority of those who suffer a major heart attack - die from it, irrespective of treatment and even when they are already IN hospital.
A defibrillator is only for treating a hear that is fibrillating. If the heart has suffered a full arrest - defib unit will not necessarily help. There is no telling what her situation was, as only a medical person could do that. None was available, just is they are not available in the greatest majority of cases.
Cardiac arrests that come 'out of the blue, with no previous hint of trouble' are so common that no medic thinks it unusual. Of course - to the family it is and they are, of course, totally aghast at it. Just last month, I saw a family where the woman who had died 'out of the blue' was 39 years old and NOT on an aeroplane after a long journey with any complications that might or might not have given her.
Many times I have heard people say, "As soon as he/she fell over, I knew they were gone" and that includes my step-mother of my own father's fatal heart attack.
I have often heard of hospital doctors thinking that someone is stable and telling the family to go home and rest and - within an hour the person is dead. I won't bore with many other examples but death does happen VERY fast and this family will naturally think that the airline was negligent. They may have been, or they may not have been - since the only information is the post mortem and the inquest, we do not yet know. The family wish to sue, so they can call the flight crew and the paramedics and learn of the decisions and timing.
They may well find that the time scale that they thought was 20 miuntes was actually 2. When we are in crisis, the brain does strange things with memory. Which is why, as we all know, three 'eye witness' reports of the same incident can produce three separate incidents.
Their lawyer is whipping it up with statements about all pax should be worried by this. Tell that to the family of the 39 year old, who died at home with no one around to call an ambulance until she was found an hour later. Every person should be worried about that. My sympathies are with the family, because I meet newly bereaved people every week. But they do not yet have all the information.
When a death occurs many people look for some one to blame in the short term as they start to adjust and learn what actually happened. I have known families baying for their day in court but, once they have the post mortem explained and they read what the doctors said before and after the death - they go home and grieve because they then understand.
For this family, they have yet to understand. I hope that they will be able to gain enough information for them to understand what happened to their mother. Taking the airline to court may not bring them any more information or anything else at all.
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Since the cabin would need to be secure for landing then if the crew decided to start CPR and the defib then the plane would need to circle whilst this was going on.
But that is all I can do. And as PAXboy has said, that is probably not enough as the patient will have probably have died by then anyway. As for legal action, if I was incorporated in the UAE, I'd tell a US court to eff-off. Annoy me further and I'll see my friends and neighbours about your oil supply. Your move!
PM
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Almost entirely agree Piltdown, except that telling US court to eff off is ok so long as the airline does not fly to the US or any other country that will enforce US court judgements. In that case the aircraft is seized, and if damages are not coughed up it is sold to cover the debt. It happens - more to ships than planes though.
