The Volcano thread - (Merged)
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People booked on the flight are first ones. All others left over from cancelled flights are booked in as the airline has ruled in a Passenger Handling Manual, e.g. gold frequent flyers first and so on.
I hope that airlines, till the backlog is over, will stop with keeping in the C-Class empty seats in the C-Class. I am 1000% sure all C-Class pax will have full understanding.
I hope that airlines, till the backlog is over, will stop with keeping in the C-Class empty seats in the C-Class. I am 1000% sure all C-Class pax will have full understanding.
Paxing All Over The World
It is the pax booked on that day. I had this when stranded at JFK in August 2003 by a power blackout that affected most of the North East of USA. I was due out on Friday morning and some flights resumed Saturday but I could not get out until the Monday from EWR (same carrier BA).
However, when this is over, flights will not necessarily start at the sched time but simply just when the heck they can get crew and a full load to coincide with a slot!
However, when this is over, flights will not necessarily start at the sched time but simply just when the heck they can get crew and a full load to coincide with a slot!
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Math Fox,
Thank you for the update. Its nice to see the wheels spinning in that direction. I am from the US where I worked at a firestation for 10 years and I know if MEM was closed, our doors would be open as well as delivering supplies and even setting up decon tents at the airport just so travelers could get a good shower ( wouldn't offer the scrub down lol ). There are companies in the US that respond with FEMA just to take care of the responders. When I worked Hurricane Katrina this company was there and it was amazing to see how well they took care of us. 3500 responders +1200 truck drivers ( stuck there with nowhere to store refrigerated goods) and we put our laundry in a bag, dropped it off and less than 24 hours later, we had OUR laundry back, even folded ! We had 3 good meals and wonderful portable showers and awesome air con tents with comfortable cots. These pax could sure use that right now!
Thank you for the update. Its nice to see the wheels spinning in that direction. I am from the US where I worked at a firestation for 10 years and I know if MEM was closed, our doors would be open as well as delivering supplies and even setting up decon tents at the airport just so travelers could get a good shower ( wouldn't offer the scrub down lol ). There are companies in the US that respond with FEMA just to take care of the responders. When I worked Hurricane Katrina this company was there and it was amazing to see how well they took care of us. 3500 responders +1200 truck drivers ( stuck there with nowhere to store refrigerated goods) and we put our laundry in a bag, dropped it off and less than 24 hours later, we had OUR laundry back, even folded ! We had 3 good meals and wonderful portable showers and awesome air con tents with comfortable cots. These pax could sure use that right now!
Paxing All Over The World
We are in uncharted territory. Not many carriers and airports will have contingency plans to look after pax for the best part of a week. The supplies of water and food will be constrained by the local country and their ability to supply - without advance warning, without formal purchase orders to guarantee payment (local and nattional govts may have to step in to assure suppliers that they will be paid) and many more issues.
As to receiving help, I recall being trapped in JFK by: Northeast Blackout of 2003 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia "The blackout affected an estimated 10 million people in Ontario and 45 million people in eight U.S. states."
Fortunately, I was airside - in fact I was in the coach en route Manhattan / JFK when the power failed on Thursday afternoon - so I could get in an hotel for the first night. The airport had no power (of course) and there was no mobile phone service (of course) so, as soon as I got to the room (still daylight) I had a shower as I knew the water would soon be gone. I rearranged my gear to be ready for nightfall. The hotel were taking physical imprints of credit cards and hoping no one was going to cheat! I saw people using the light of their cell phone displays as torches, so they would have been in more trouble when they wanted to make a call. The hotel payphones were working (powered from the exchange) and long queues but everyone patient.
I could not get a flight out until Monday from EWR (BA did good) and I managed to get back into Manhattan on Friday very late afternoon. As the coach stop is right by Grand Central station, I went in looking for a working cash dispenser and to try and buy food.
Imagine my surprise at being met by Red Cross people who gave me a sandwich pack and a pint bottle of mineral water!! I did not see myself as being in a disaster zone but that was because I had not seen TV to know that 45 million were affected! I could not find a working cash dispenser but found a power point in the station that was on and recharged my cell and laptop. Then found a hotel that had power and they could swipe my AmEx card! I then made phone calls to the UK to rearrange business I had for the Saturday and called the friends I had been staying with.
The next day dispensers were working and I got to New Jersey and friends for two nights, they dropped me at EWR on Monday morning. (I even got the Sunday afternoon on Gunnison beach in great sunshine!) If you want to talk about being prepared for the emergency, I was almost fully prepared. When I was stranded I had the following in my back pack:
The folks this week are lucky that they can use plastic to pay for everything, although airport cash dispenser will have run out quickly. If I had been trapped, I would like to think that I would have been at the top of the cash queue to get at least 100 of the local currency. Then you can get a taxi and (in some countries) bribe locals.
My AmEx Platinum insurance paid out the maximum that the policy stated without quibble (hence, with the hotel that said 'That will do nicely' my continuing support for AmEx) I was still out of pocket but I was safe and that is all that matters. I was VERY lucky but still not prepared enough
As to receiving help, I recall being trapped in JFK by: Northeast Blackout of 2003 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia "The blackout affected an estimated 10 million people in Ontario and 45 million people in eight U.S. states."
Fortunately, I was airside - in fact I was in the coach en route Manhattan / JFK when the power failed on Thursday afternoon - so I could get in an hotel for the first night. The airport had no power (of course) and there was no mobile phone service (of course) so, as soon as I got to the room (still daylight) I had a shower as I knew the water would soon be gone. I rearranged my gear to be ready for nightfall. The hotel were taking physical imprints of credit cards and hoping no one was going to cheat! I saw people using the light of their cell phone displays as torches, so they would have been in more trouble when they wanted to make a call. The hotel payphones were working (powered from the exchange) and long queues but everyone patient.
I could not get a flight out until Monday from EWR (BA did good) and I managed to get back into Manhattan on Friday very late afternoon. As the coach stop is right by Grand Central station, I went in looking for a working cash dispenser and to try and buy food.
Imagine my surprise at being met by Red Cross people who gave me a sandwich pack and a pint bottle of mineral water!! I did not see myself as being in a disaster zone but that was because I had not seen TV to know that 45 million were affected! I could not find a working cash dispenser but found a power point in the station that was on and recharged my cell and laptop. Then found a hotel that had power and they could swipe my AmEx card! I then made phone calls to the UK to rearrange business I had for the Saturday and called the friends I had been staying with.
The next day dispensers were working and I got to New Jersey and friends for two nights, they dropped me at EWR on Monday morning. (I even got the Sunday afternoon on Gunnison beach in great sunshine!) If you want to talk about being prepared for the emergency, I was almost fully prepared. When I was stranded I had the following in my back pack:
- Sandwich and chocolate
- bottle of water
- torch with good battery
- cell phone fully charged and spare battery fully charged
The folks this week are lucky that they can use plastic to pay for everything, although airport cash dispenser will have run out quickly. If I had been trapped, I would like to think that I would have been at the top of the cash queue to get at least 100 of the local currency. Then you can get a taxi and (in some countries) bribe locals.
My AmEx Platinum insurance paid out the maximum that the policy stated without quibble (hence, with the hotel that said 'That will do nicely' my continuing support for AmEx) I was still out of pocket but I was safe and that is all that matters. I was VERY lucky but still not prepared enough
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A big thank you to all who replied to my post and offered help and advice.
We've decided to sit tight for the time being, but might bite the bullet and head to Southern Europe for the long haul home if there's no forecast of an improvement in time for the flight KLM has booked us on for Saturday.
As I'm a bit of cheapskate we were already staying in a budget hostel that costs next to nothing, and food prices here in downtown Cairo are hardly going to break the bank. One way or another we'll be OK.
We've decided to sit tight for the time being, but might bite the bullet and head to Southern Europe for the long haul home if there's no forecast of an improvement in time for the flight KLM has booked us on for Saturday.
As I'm a bit of cheapskate we were already staying in a budget hostel that costs next to nothing, and food prices here in downtown Cairo are hardly going to break the bank. One way or another we'll be OK.
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sassy, I don't know what rights you have if you are travelling on a US carrier in terms of reimbursement etc.
As for being on US soil I can only speak from experience on this. A few years ago me and my daughter were delayed for nearly 24 hours in Orlando as the VS flight to LGW had a technical issue.
We were put up in that nice atrium hotel at MCO airport and very well looked after by Virgin. I don't know if this was because I was travelling on a G reg aircraft, had an ABTA booking etc but we seemed to have the same rights even though we were the other side of the pond.
With regard to medication I understand your concerns being a registered nurse. All I know on this is that most major airports have some sort of medical facility with access to a Doctor who can prescribe medication. If you are in the resort the company rep/hotel management will be able to recomend a Doctor/pharmacist.
In the EU the cost of these I think would be covered by the E111 regs. Outside of here I'm not sure what insurance would cover for a pre-existing condition.
For those travelling without insurance......
! I guess you would probably have to bear the cost yourself.
As for being on US soil I can only speak from experience on this. A few years ago me and my daughter were delayed for nearly 24 hours in Orlando as the VS flight to LGW had a technical issue.
We were put up in that nice atrium hotel at MCO airport and very well looked after by Virgin. I don't know if this was because I was travelling on a G reg aircraft, had an ABTA booking etc but we seemed to have the same rights even though we were the other side of the pond.
With regard to medication I understand your concerns being a registered nurse. All I know on this is that most major airports have some sort of medical facility with access to a Doctor who can prescribe medication. If you are in the resort the company rep/hotel management will be able to recomend a Doctor/pharmacist.
In the EU the cost of these I think would be covered by the E111 regs. Outside of here I'm not sure what insurance would cover for a pre-existing condition.
For those travelling without insurance......
! I guess you would probably have to bear the cost yourself.
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Rethink boarding priorities - this is exceptional
Firstly as a newbie SLF, many thanks to this forum for providing a darned sight more information and intelligent comment on this crisis than anywhere on the MSM. Especially to the pilots on Rumours and News.
Like many others I am stranded, in this case in India. I am a lot better off than most, on business, in a decent hotel. Rebooking after a cancelled Saturday flight: Thursday, and that was the last seat - in First ( I will wing it with company management somehow). If Mt Unpronounceable is still blowing, and the winds still perverse, then the next available is the week after - and that is at the front of the plane. One is already hearing horror stories of those at the back not being able to get rebookings until into May.
The current system - honour existing reservations, for legal as well as computer/communication reasons, and fit in the victims of cancellations in any spare seats, might work for a 1-2 day max local delay because of snow, fog etc. Not however on this unprecedented scale. In addition because of the financial situation of the airlines, many have cut back flights to maintain their loadings, and there is little spare margin.
Humanitarian as well as economic considerations dictate that the backlog should be cleared first, in date order, and existing bookings told that they are subject to a delay of a few days - and a way round the legal issues found. Otherwise we have a major problem which could take a month to clear. Unless those mothballed planes are recalled to clear the backlog on special flights? cannot see it somehow.
Like many others I am stranded, in this case in India. I am a lot better off than most, on business, in a decent hotel. Rebooking after a cancelled Saturday flight: Thursday, and that was the last seat - in First ( I will wing it with company management somehow). If Mt Unpronounceable is still blowing, and the winds still perverse, then the next available is the week after - and that is at the front of the plane. One is already hearing horror stories of those at the back not being able to get rebookings until into May.
The current system - honour existing reservations, for legal as well as computer/communication reasons, and fit in the victims of cancellations in any spare seats, might work for a 1-2 day max local delay because of snow, fog etc. Not however on this unprecedented scale. In addition because of the financial situation of the airlines, many have cut back flights to maintain their loadings, and there is little spare margin.
Humanitarian as well as economic considerations dictate that the backlog should be cleared first, in date order, and existing bookings told that they are subject to a delay of a few days - and a way round the legal issues found. Otherwise we have a major problem which could take a month to clear. Unless those mothballed planes are recalled to clear the backlog on special flights? cannot see it somehow.
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Hi, Torchwood - and welcome to the 3rd Division ... the SLF Threads! 
Yup, R&M is awash with people with big egos and salaries slagging each other off, and not actually contributing a great deal to the sum of human knowledge
Good luck on getting home ... an infinitely worse situation than ours, where we're at home and NOT going on a long holiday.
Yup, R&M is awash with people with big egos and salaries slagging each other off, and not actually contributing a great deal to the sum of human knowledge
Good luck on getting home ... an infinitely worse situation than ours, where we're at home and NOT going on a long holiday.
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Ryanair are now reporting on their website that they will not resume flights until at least Wednesday at 13.00.
News : Flight Cancelations Extended to 1300hrs Wed 21 Apr
I find it odd that while the likes of KLM, Lufthansa et all are spitting their dummies out over the continued restrictions, the man who usually shouts the loudest (MOL) seems to be gritting his teeth and bearing it. Why I wonder? Are they maybe hoping to ride things out while one or two other airlines go bust?
News : Flight Cancelations Extended to 1300hrs Wed 21 Apr
I find it odd that while the likes of KLM, Lufthansa et all are spitting their dummies out over the continued restrictions, the man who usually shouts the loudest (MOL) seems to be gritting his teeth and bearing it. Why I wonder? Are they maybe hoping to ride things out while one or two other airlines go bust?
Anansis - if MOL right now was making a lot of noise about getting aircraft back in the air, he would be much more vulnerable to the perception of putting profits before safety, compared to airlines with a more "caring" image, at least in the eyes of Joe Public.
Paxing All Over The World
Anansis
Am I correct in recalling that FR pay for their a/c by the operational hour? If so, then it is not costing him as much as folks who are paying for their a/c 24x365. I sit to be corrected.
Torchwood Welcome aboard our (mostly) friendly cabin where we easily embrace everyone from First to stowaways ... you used the word of the event unprecedented. As we can see, the accountants are now getting very fidgety and the whole world is beginning to see what it will be like when the oil runs out.
I find it odd that while the likes of KLM, Lufthansa et all are spitting their dummies out over the continued restrictions, the man who usually shouts the loudest (MOL) seems to be gritting his teeth and bearing it. Why I wonder? Are they maybe hoping to ride things out while one or two other airlines go bust?
Torchwood Welcome aboard our (mostly) friendly cabin where we easily embrace everyone from First to stowaways ... you used the word of the event unprecedented. As we can see, the accountants are now getting very fidgety and the whole world is beginning to see what it will be like when the oil runs out.
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Paxboy:
If this thread is anything to go by then yes; http://www.pprune.org/terms-endearme...-layoff-2.html. Furthermore, as many as half of FR pilots are Brookfield subcontractors, meaning that when they are paid nothing whatsoever when they are not flying. It seems that it might be cheaper for FR to keep the planes on the ground for a while than it is to fly them.
I think Captainplaystation raises a very interesting point in the above thread;
Plus, I suppose they will have plenty of empty airframes to wet lease to other airlines help clear the backlog (yes I am a cynic!).
If any of the above is true (time will tell) then FR are pushing the 'beyond the control of the airlines' exemptions under Art 261 and the EU Air Passenger Charter to their very limits. Can an airline justify cancelling a flight on the grounds of 'act of God' when it could have technically operated it? I'm sure we will see a legal challenge or two over tne next few months.
I await the backlash...
If this thread is anything to go by then yes; http://www.pprune.org/terms-endearme...-layoff-2.html. Furthermore, as many as half of FR pilots are Brookfield subcontractors, meaning that when they are paid nothing whatsoever when they are not flying. It seems that it might be cheaper for FR to keep the planes on the ground for a while than it is to fly them.
I think Captainplaystation raises a very interesting point in the above thread;
Okay all you cynics 
what is your take on MOL cancelling everything except Southern European domestic and Southern European originating Southbound flights till 1300 on Wed 21st ,even as Eurocontrol are making half promises that they expect 50% of flights to operate tomorrow , with airspace being opened all the time.
Official line "to give our passengers as much opportunity to apply for refunds
Yeah right ! and make rebookings" Ah he does have a heart after all.
It seems they mean it too, of 18 parked airframes at GRO, where normally one would find 10, more than half of them had engines wrapped in big polythene bags (the lo-cost version of these nice red Boeing engine covers) with static/pitots also securely put to bed, with some cobbled together masking tape/polythene condom, by 16L.
Seems a bit little bit OTT (since I haven't seen a whiff of falling ash this far South) , if one was truly proposing to start flying all again as soon as Wed ? ?
Guess parking is cheap (read free) in GRO.
Hmnn, "I have a cunning plan melord"
"Yes MOL/Baldrick pray tell me
"
what is your take on MOL cancelling everything except Southern European domestic and Southern European originating Southbound flights till 1300 on Wed 21st ,even as Eurocontrol are making half promises that they expect 50% of flights to operate tomorrow , with airspace being opened all the time.Official line "to give our passengers as much opportunity to apply for refunds
Yeah right ! and make rebookings" Ah he does have a heart after all.It seems they mean it too, of 18 parked airframes at GRO, where normally one would find 10, more than half of them had engines wrapped in big polythene bags (the lo-cost version of these nice red Boeing engine covers) with static/pitots also securely put to bed, with some cobbled together masking tape/polythene condom, by 16L.
Seems a bit little bit OTT (since I haven't seen a whiff of falling ash this far South) , if one was truly proposing to start flying all again as soon as Wed ? ?
Guess parking is cheap (read free) in GRO.Hmnn, "I have a cunning plan melord"
"Yes MOL/Baldrick pray tell me
"If any of the above is true (time will tell) then FR are pushing the 'beyond the control of the airlines' exemptions under Art 261 and the EU Air Passenger Charter to their very limits. Can an airline justify cancelling a flight on the grounds of 'act of God' when it could have technically operated it? I'm sure we will see a legal challenge or two over tne next few months.
I await the backlash...
Paxing All Over The World
An Icelandic friend of mine sent me a link to local English language news and, on the web site is a company advertising:
Let us hope it is once in a lifetime, now I only have to get to Iceland ...
Helicopter Volcano Tours
Enjoy the Eruption in Full View
A Once In A Lifetime Experience
Enjoy the Eruption in Full View
A Once In A Lifetime Experience
Let us hope it is once in a lifetime, now I only have to get to Iceland ...
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Opodo or BA liability
My Son and his new wife having just got married in the US are now stranded. Opodo say there is nothing they or BA can do given the unusual nature of the problem. Opodo did rebook them on the same flight 9 days later, 26th April.
They have no money to speak of and I have had to pay for their hotel and food etc. If I weren't well into my overdraft i wouldn't mind so much. Who if anyone is liable to give them assistance? Opodo, BA.
Their insurance policy seems to prelude them from compensation
I know sounds a bit like a consumer question but I would appreciate any advice.
They have no money to speak of and I have had to pay for their hotel and food etc. If I weren't well into my overdraft i wouldn't mind so much. Who if anyone is liable to give them assistance? Opodo, BA.
Their insurance policy seems to prelude them from compensation
I know sounds a bit like a consumer question but I would appreciate any advice.
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I know sounds a bit like a consumer question but I would appreciate any advice.
However, if fails to make any sense to me why the airline should be responsible for your son's costs in these circumstances. It would make as much sense for you to sue the Iceland government, (for sending ash) or the European Parliament (for writing stupid rules).
Paxing All Over The World
Machers1 Welcome aboard. I suggest that all bets are off. Keep all the paperwork and expect a long wait. The sums are so extreme and the circumstances so uncharted that everyone will claim from everyone else and no one will want (or be able) to pay. The claims will run on for a year, at least. Expect carriers, insurance companies and others to go bankrupt.
This may sound harsh but, may I invite you and yours to be glad that you are alive and safe and in a country with electricity and running water. Yes, you may lose money and be hideously inconvenienced (a member of my extended family is trapped in Italy and is due to be married this Saturday in Cape Town) but you have your health.
This may sound harsh but, may I invite you and yours to be glad that you are alive and safe and in a country with electricity and running water. Yes, you may lose money and be hideously inconvenienced (a member of my extended family is trapped in Italy and is due to be married this Saturday in Cape Town) but you have your health.
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Our experience.....
My wife, son and I are stranded in the USA - when I called the BA helpline yesterday, I got a recorded message saying that waiting time was 299 minutes (needless to say, I hung up). I finally got through last night (the holding time was a far more reasonable 76 minutes....)
I was initially offered a rebooking on the 29th, despite the fact that ba.com was offering availability on the 25th. When I mentioned this, I was told "oh, sorry, I hadn't noticed. I'm not that familiar with flights from (that particular airport) and I've mainly been booking flights from LAX and New York." We were then booked onto the flight on the 25th. I wasn't asked if we needed any help, but that would have been irrelevant in any case - happily we're staying with relatives.
Okay, there were a few hiccups, but I'm pretty happy with the way I was treated.
57A
My wife, son and I are stranded in the USA - when I called the BA helpline yesterday, I got a recorded message saying that waiting time was 299 minutes (needless to say, I hung up). I finally got through last night (the holding time was a far more reasonable 76 minutes....)
I was initially offered a rebooking on the 29th, despite the fact that ba.com was offering availability on the 25th. When I mentioned this, I was told "oh, sorry, I hadn't noticed. I'm not that familiar with flights from (that particular airport) and I've mainly been booking flights from LAX and New York." We were then booked onto the flight on the 25th. I wasn't asked if we needed any help, but that would have been irrelevant in any case - happily we're staying with relatives.
Okay, there were a few hiccups, but I'm pretty happy with the way I was treated.
57A
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Future outlook
My wife and I are booked BA PHX to LHR June 18th returning July 04th. Flights 288 and 289 for a combined, vacation, delayed honeymoon and family reunion. We are not able to change this booking for various reasons as too many things had to fall into place for us to visit England at this time.
I'm really worried about losing out on our trip and not even being re-imbursed as we have already bought our tickets. But I have to say as nervous as I am about that it can't be nearly as bad as the situation of so many stranded around the globe at present. I really hope those affected are able to get a resolution to their predicament before that becomes a real crisis as it might in some instances.
We've only been flying airilners with turbofans for what forty years? That's nothing on a geological time scale.
- Peter.
I'm really worried about losing out on our trip and not even being re-imbursed as we have already bought our tickets. But I have to say as nervous as I am about that it can't be nearly as bad as the situation of so many stranded around the globe at present. I really hope those affected are able to get a resolution to their predicament before that becomes a real crisis as it might in some instances.
We've only been flying airilners with turbofans for what forty years? That's nothing on a geological time scale.
- Peter.
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Machers1 Just out of interest has your son contacted British Airways directly re his predicament? You mention he has gone through Opodo and is relying on them it seems to communicate with BA.
BA do have a duty of care to all of their customers stranded in terms of accomodation and food. To my knowledge they have not shirked this in any way. However if they do not know they cannot help and I wonder what Opodo has actually done to communicate other than rebooking the flight
Contact BA directly. If they have no joy (which I would be surprised at) then the British Consulate is always available to help brits abroad in financial/humanitarian need.
Paxboy is right in his post but you do have to be able to afford the amenities the first world provides at the time. Your son may be at his limit on his credit cards......
BA do have a duty of care to all of their customers stranded in terms of accomodation and food. To my knowledge they have not shirked this in any way. However if they do not know they cannot help and I wonder what Opodo has actually done to communicate other than rebooking the flight
Contact BA directly. If they have no joy (which I would be surprised at) then the British Consulate is always available to help brits abroad in financial/humanitarian need.
Paxboy is right in his post but you do have to be able to afford the amenities the first world provides at the time. Your son may be at his limit on his credit cards......
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Compensation/Reimbursement
We have just had to cnx our USA holiday [due to start travelling with BA today at 1315].
So ... we started cancelling all the peripherals, including our pre-paid car rental through Virgin Holidays. Called their call centre, where they had a long pre-recorded message - and then the line was answered almost immediately.
Their normal cancellation charges are:
Day of Departure - 100% cancellation fee.
1-14 days before - 90% cancellation fee.
etc etc.
The helpful lady went and checked with someone else, and then advised us that we would get a 100% refund in a couple of weeks 'due to the exceptional circumstances"
It would seem that some organisations are taking a very customer-oriented position at the moment.
So ... we started cancelling all the peripherals, including our pre-paid car rental through Virgin Holidays. Called their call centre, where they had a long pre-recorded message - and then the line was answered almost immediately.
Their normal cancellation charges are:
Day of Departure - 100% cancellation fee.
1-14 days before - 90% cancellation fee.
etc etc.
The helpful lady went and checked with someone else, and then advised us that we would get a 100% refund in a couple of weeks 'due to the exceptional circumstances"
It would seem that some organisations are taking a very customer-oriented position at the moment.
Last edited by MPN11; 20th Apr 2010 at 10:55.