Using handheld GPS on commercial flight
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2007
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From: york
Using handheld GPS on commercial flight
On a resent flight with Ryan Air I was asked to turn off my handheld GPS I asked why! but the cabin crew just said you couldn't use on the aircraft or near the airport. I do understand that 737 800s have more intricate avionics than the PA28 I use the unit in but I can't see that the gps could cause any problems to the aircraft! The cabin crew said laptops and handheld gaming systems could be used after take off so I just thought that GPS wasn't a problem!
Can anybody tell me the reason why I couldn't use the unit (Garmin 196) or is this just Cabin Crew not understanding what GPS is or even just a Ryan Air thing thanks in advance!
Can anybody tell me the reason why I couldn't use the unit (Garmin 196) or is this just Cabin Crew not understanding what GPS is or even just a Ryan Air thing thanks in advance!
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2007
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From: york
Handheld GPS
I answering my own post because I have received a reply from RyanAir stating that GPS can not be used because they can interfere with the navigation equipment on the aircraft thanks RyanAir for your reply!
Joined: Apr 2005
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From: Above 5L
All airlines require devices which transmit or receive data be switched off or be turned to Flight Safe Mode. It would be impossible to list every single device, or train cabin crew about each device.
A cabin crew member asks you to do something.
Why?
Because they said so!
A cabin crew member asks you to do something.
Why?
Because they said so!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,199
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From: Hunched over a keyboard
Given that GPS receivers are entirely passive, and that the signals from the satellites are in and around the aeroplane already, this is clearly nonsense.
Bluetooth, wireless LAN etc are different - they transmit - but if your GPS was not usung bluetooth or wireless LAN, then it could not have caused any harm.
Bluetooth, wireless LAN etc are different - they transmit - but if your GPS was not usung bluetooth or wireless LAN, then it could not have caused any harm.
Joined: May 2001
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From: south of Cirencester, north of Lyneham
moggiee,
What about receiver local oscillator radiation? And intermodulation products caused by differing receivers having different frequency plans? LO radiation is limited if we're talking about a receiver that really meets FCC or European regulations, but where a CE mark can mean 'Chinese Export', who knows? And if you count a GPS as a broadcast receiver meeting EN55013, it can legally emit a VERY big signal.
What about receiver local oscillator radiation? And intermodulation products caused by differing receivers having different frequency plans? LO radiation is limited if we're talking about a receiver that really meets FCC or European regulations, but where a CE mark can mean 'Chinese Export', who knows? And if you count a GPS as a broadcast receiver meeting EN55013, it can legally emit a VERY big signal.
Joined: Aug 2002
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
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From: South of France
Oh God no, please,please no...not another GPS in the cabin thread.
"Is the safety briefing really necessary?" thread can't be far away, followed quickly by " Why can't I use my mobile phone immediately after landing?" and then all topped off with a nice "Where are the cabin crew after dinner/first drink/10 minutes etc?"
"Is the safety briefing really necessary?" thread can't be far away, followed quickly by " Why can't I use my mobile phone immediately after landing?" and then all topped off with a nice "Where are the cabin crew after dinner/first drink/10 minutes etc?"
Paxing All Over The World
Joined: May 2001
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From: Hertfordshire, UK.
strake, you should know by now that the topics in this cabin come around as frequently as that forlorn back-pack on the carousel, whose strap is loose and flapping along - just waiting to get caught and rip the bag right open.
One of the reasons that this forum is so quick to read is that there is so little new to read.
One of the reasons that this forum is so quick to read is that there is so little new to read.
Fly Conventional Gear
Joined: May 2007
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From: Winchester
Done to death over the years....
Not really a problem considering we are talking about the Gamin 196 which is designed and approved for use in aircraft. If I remember correctly from the last thread Aer Lingus for example do allow the use of GPS units so this
is not really true.
LO radiation is limited if we're talking about a receiver that really meets FCC or European regulations
All airlines require devices which transmit or receive data be switched off or be turned to Flight Safe Mode
Joined: Aug 2002
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 1,033
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From: South of France
And it's you, me, and a few others who fumed and foamed and fought the original fights who come back again to shake our heads wearily.
Maybe it's time to retire gracefully and leave it all to Tightslot, whom, I'm beginning to realise, has the patience of a saint....
Maybe it's time to retire gracefully and leave it all to Tightslot, whom, I'm beginning to realise, has the patience of a saint....
Fly Conventional Gear
Joined: May 2007
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From: Winchester
Tightslot, whom, I'm beginning to realise, has the patience of a saint....
Although to be fair to those who do ask questions that have been 'done to death' the PPRuNe search function could be a lot better...I mean for an industry that uses so many TLAs having a four word minimum length for search terms is so irritating
.
Flying High
Joined: Jan 2008
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From: Here
Fair points above.
But if someone sees someone with a GPS going.. they will think "oh goody... I can use my X device...."
And so on.
thus everyone thinks it is ok!
Just don't do it and don't argue with the CC.
Whats the point? I certainly don't think you need it to navigate...
But if someone sees someone with a GPS going.. they will think "oh goody... I can use my X device...."
And so on.
thus everyone thinks it is ok!
Just don't do it and don't argue with the CC.
Whats the point? I certainly don't think you need it to navigate...
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,267
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From: south of Cirencester, north of Lyneham
Now, Now, you people are forgetting that we get the same safety briefing every flight. In the same way, we get the same topics re-appearing here!
How do the CC know which GPS are good and which aren't? They DON'T! For that matter, if something is marked 'Garmin', is it really, and not a Chinese rip off?
How do the CC know which GPS are good and which aren't? They DON'T! For that matter, if something is marked 'Garmin', is it really, and not a Chinese rip off?
Fly Conventional Gear
Joined: May 2007
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From: Winchester
How do the CC know which GPS are good and which aren't? They DON'T! For that matter, if something is marked 'Garmin', is it really, and not a Chinese rip off?
Would a decent GPS system made by the main brands, designed and certified for use in aircraft interfere with other avionics?
Answer, No.
Should GPS systems be allowed on board?
Well arguably not...for exactly the reasons the last two posts have cited.
Everything is under control.
Joined: Jul 2001
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From: Washington, D.C.
Radeng is right. In the process of receiving, receivers "transmit" a low-level RF signal that can cause interference. I understand the BBC uses this phenomenon to detect if a television is on in a home, for tax purposes.
Fly Conventional Gear
Joined: May 2007
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From: Winchester
Radeng is right. In the process of receiving, receivers "transmit" a low-level RF signal that can cause interference. I understand the BBC uses this phenomenon to detect if a television is on in a home, for tax purposes.
). Rather than actually bothering to check whether an address actually has a TV or not 
.
Joined: Oct 2003
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From: USA
The idea that a hand-held GPS can cause interference with the airplane or it's instruments is absurd.
Of course, it must be off because the airline's policy says so.
But you must have to think....
If portable GPS devices can legally be used to navigate airplanes in the cockpit (and they are), then how much of a problem can they cause?????
Of course, it must be off because the airline's policy says so.
But you must have to think....
If portable GPS devices can legally be used to navigate airplanes in the cockpit (and they are), then how much of a problem can they cause?????
Everything is under control.
Joined: Jul 2001
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From: Washington, D.C.
I generally agree. The RF emitted by such devices, however, adds up. The more portable GPS devices in operation, the greater the level of unwanted radiation. At some point the level is reached when objectionable interference is caused. What is that point? I don't know.
Joined: Feb 2000
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From: UK
The idea that a hand-held GPS can cause interference with the airplane or it's instruments is absurd.