Travelling with a Minor - A Question on proving I'm her parent
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Travelling with a Minor - A Question on proving I'm her parent
Hello, hope I've posted to the right place, if not, apologies - genuine mistake.
I (UK father) will be travelling from Stansted to Milan return with my 5 yo UK daughter who has a different surname to mine. How can I avoid any problems at checkin/security - will they want to see proof I am her father - what documents might I need? I was thinking of taking along a full birth certificate and a marriage certificate. Should I aslo take my wifes passport with me ? Please advise if you really know or direct me to a dept who I can call. (I rang the budget airline - they didnt seem to know what they are talking about Thank you
I (UK father) will be travelling from Stansted to Milan return with my 5 yo UK daughter who has a different surname to mine. How can I avoid any problems at checkin/security - will they want to see proof I am her father - what documents might I need? I was thinking of taking along a full birth certificate and a marriage certificate. Should I aslo take my wifes passport with me ? Please advise if you really know or direct me to a dept who I can call. (I rang the budget airline - they didnt seem to know what they are talking about Thank you
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Just checked booking conditions on two airlines. If your daughter has her own passport and you are travelling with her, you should not have a problem as the requirement is that children must be accompanied by AN ADULT OVER THE AGE OF 18 YEARS.
There is no stipulation of the relationship of child to accompanying adult and the situation where children travel with grandparents of differing surnames must be quite common.
Suggest you check the booking conditions of the airline you intend to use.
There is no stipulation of the relationship of child to accompanying adult and the situation where children travel with grandparents of differing surnames must be quite common.
Suggest you check the booking conditions of the airline you intend to use.
LUXury is a 13,000 ft runway
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Just checked booking conditions on two airlines. If your daughter has her own passport and you are travelling with her, you should not have a problem as the requirement is that children must be accompanied by AN ADULT OVER THE AGE OF 18 YEARS.
There is no stipulation of the relationship of child to accompanying adult and the situation where children travel with grandparents of differing surnames must be quite common.
Suggest you check the booking conditions of the airline you intend to use.
There is no stipulation of the relationship of child to accompanying adult and the situation where children travel with grandparents of differing surnames must be quite common.
Suggest you check the booking conditions of the airline you intend to use.
NWA have the following to say:
International Travel With Minors (including Canada & Mexico)
Due to international concern over child abduction, many governments have initiated additional requirements at arrival and departure points when children under 18 years old are not traveling with both parents. Many countries require documentary evidence of the adults' relationship and permission of the parent(s) or legal guardian before they will allow the child to cross the border. Single parents, grandparents or guardians traveling with children often need proof of custody or notarized letters from the other parent authorizing travel. These requirements are in addition to passport or proof of citizenship requirements.
Due to international concern over child abduction, many governments have initiated additional requirements at arrival and departure points when children under 18 years old are not traveling with both parents. Many countries require documentary evidence of the adults' relationship and permission of the parent(s) or legal guardian before they will allow the child to cross the border. Single parents, grandparents or guardians traveling with children often need proof of custody or notarized letters from the other parent authorizing travel. These requirements are in addition to passport or proof of citizenship requirements.
- Minor traveling with one parent: If a minor child is traveling with only one parent, the absent parent is expected to provide notarized consent. If only one parent has legal custody, that parent should be prepared to provide a court order of child custody to airlines and international authorities.
- Minor traveling alone: If a minor child is traveling alone or in someone else's company, both parents (or the sole, documented custodial parent) must provide notarized consent.
- Minor with a different last name: If a child traveling has a different last name from the mother and/or father, the parents should be prepared to provide evidence to airlines and official authorities, such as a birth certificate or adoption decree, to prove that they are the parents.
- Minor has one deceased parent: If one parent is deceased, a death certificate is required.
- Minor has one parent: If the birth certificate shows that the minor only has one parent, it will be sufficient to hold only a notarized copy of the birth certificate.
'nough said
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My parents took my daughter to Venice at the beginning of the year and got me to write a letter to "authorise her travel" which I thought was completely pointless as it wasn't an official document as such and hence could have easily been forged.
Of course no-one asked them any questions and the transition through the borders were uneventful, as you would expect within the EU (freedom if movement of people and all that).
So I wouldn't worry - your daughter will vouch for you
Of course no-one asked them any questions and the transition through the borders were uneventful, as you would expect within the EU (freedom if movement of people and all that).
So I wouldn't worry - your daughter will vouch for you
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Thank you
Thank you to all who have replied. It has reassured me. I have also again spoken to Ryanair, this time I was confidently informed that a passport alone is sufficient - but for peace of mind, I could carry a full birth certificate if I wanted to.
So thank you everyone and happy hols to all
So thank you everyone and happy hols to all
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tom de luxe
You are perfectly correct in that certain countries do have requirements for children not travelling with both parents. However, Psychedelic Goat did specify that both he and his daughter were UK citizens and they would be travelling within Europe. My search therefore was conducted on these grounds.
Many thanks however for pointing out NWA's policy.
Many thanks however for pointing out NWA's policy.
Can anyone explain how any such check might be enforced, and where ?
With OLCI you don't actually see anybody, and security are not looking for anything other than on-the-spot prohibited items. Likewise the gate check only does boarding passes and passport validity.
My feeling is that any regulations about "proof of parentage" are only ones that could be activated in a particular situation which has already come to the attention of the authorities, and they are watching out for somebody. There appears no standard check at all and I would guess the majority of those travelling with small children have no such evidence on them anyway.
In the US in particular there is a whole raft of publicity about carrying "certified documents" for such situations, the publicity appears to be a marketing effort by the notaries who do the certifying, and charge significant fees for their completely unwanted services.
With OLCI you don't actually see anybody, and security are not looking for anything other than on-the-spot prohibited items. Likewise the gate check only does boarding passes and passport validity.
My feeling is that any regulations about "proof of parentage" are only ones that could be activated in a particular situation which has already come to the attention of the authorities, and they are watching out for somebody. There appears no standard check at all and I would guess the majority of those travelling with small children have no such evidence on them anyway.
In the US in particular there is a whole raft of publicity about carrying "certified documents" for such situations, the publicity appears to be a marketing effort by the notaries who do the certifying, and charge significant fees for their completely unwanted services.
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Well we ran into this problem last weekend when my wife flew BHX-ZRH-ATH with our two sons (she has a different surname). Fortunately, my wife always carries copies of the birth certificates + Greek transliterations with her.
That said, it could just have been the clueless agent manning the C class check-in: having accepted the documents she then proceeded to sit mother and infant together in row 1 and the 4 year old in row 2, the other side of the aisle
This may, of course, be due to differing regulations regarding EU-CH connections...?
That said, it could just have been the clueless agent manning the C class check-in: having accepted the documents she then proceeded to sit mother and infant together in row 1 and the 4 year old in row 2, the other side of the aisle
This may, of course, be due to differing regulations regarding EU-CH connections...?
Last edited by Jetdriver; 16th Jun 2012 at 01:20.
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Potential problem would be when leaving Italy ...
My stepson is Italian and has a different surname from mine, and when I travel with him according to Italian law I need a "delega" from my Italian wife who is his mother, when passing passport control flying out of Italy. Now he's 11 and quite tall (155cm), this is rarely requested, but when he was 6, 7, 8 etc I always had to show the piece of paper. The official document is obtained from the Italian consulate but for a foreign national, a signed attestation "to whom it may concern" is enough.
The rules were introduced after some high-profile cases of people abducting children out of Italy to I think the Middle East.
In your case it would be enough to prove that you're her father, assuming you are (i.e. not her stepfather). I would certainly suggest taking her birth certificate in that case. Nine times out of ten it isn't needed but you never know.
The rules were introduced after some high-profile cases of people abducting children out of Italy to I think the Middle East.
In your case it would be enough to prove that you're her father, assuming you are (i.e. not her stepfather). I would certainly suggest taking her birth certificate in that case. Nine times out of ten it isn't needed but you never know.
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Hi there, interesting discussion.
I have a kind of opposite problem, as I am a British national living in Italy but my kids are Italian citizens. When I came back to the UK for Easter the official at passport control in Stansted airport asked me to prove I was the mother of my daughter!! I couldn't obviously (and my kids are 11 and 9, we have been back to the Uk at least onece a year since they were born and I've never been asked for a birth certificate until now!!). He let us enter the country (I could understand his attitude more if we were trying to LEAVE the country, but we were entering the UK), but told me always to have a birth certificate on me.
Now I'm coming to the UK again for August and this time I'll be prepared. But I'll be returning to Italy alone and my kids are going to follow one week later with my parents (their granparents). Any ideas as to what I might need to let my mum take my kids out of the UK and bring them to Italy? I have documents allowing my mum to travelwith them from the police station/passport office here in Italy - but it's all written in Italian. I contacted the British Consulate in Milan and I got an automatic reply telling me to check teh website - very useful!!
I have a kind of opposite problem, as I am a British national living in Italy but my kids are Italian citizens. When I came back to the UK for Easter the official at passport control in Stansted airport asked me to prove I was the mother of my daughter!! I couldn't obviously (and my kids are 11 and 9, we have been back to the Uk at least onece a year since they were born and I've never been asked for a birth certificate until now!!). He let us enter the country (I could understand his attitude more if we were trying to LEAVE the country, but we were entering the UK), but told me always to have a birth certificate on me.
Now I'm coming to the UK again for August and this time I'll be prepared. But I'll be returning to Italy alone and my kids are going to follow one week later with my parents (their granparents). Any ideas as to what I might need to let my mum take my kids out of the UK and bring them to Italy? I have documents allowing my mum to travelwith them from the police station/passport office here in Italy - but it's all written in Italian. I contacted the British Consulate in Milan and I got an automatic reply telling me to check teh website - very useful!!
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Any border official who accepts a birth certificate as proof of identity or parentage should be sent to some under-developed third world country for an education upgrade. ANYONE can buy a copy of the registration record any legitimately registered child and the possession of such a document proves nothing except that the holder may have thought about being challenged about their relationship to the person concerned.
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You are right to be concerned but in practice you don't need to worry.
My partner, our son, and I all have different surnames (his being mine + the first part of hers). We have never had a problem anywhere, it was only once queried going into South Africa but more as a matter of curiosity than anything else.
We have also travelled sometimes with children not related to us and even then not had a problem, but we always get a letter from the parents and a copy of the parent's passport and child's birth certificate just in case, but it's never been needed.
I understand that the the only country where there is potential for a problem is France, where an adult leaving France with a child which has French nationality needs a 'permission de sortie de territoire' from the other parent or legal guardian.
My partner, our son, and I all have different surnames (his being mine + the first part of hers). We have never had a problem anywhere, it was only once queried going into South Africa but more as a matter of curiosity than anything else.
We have also travelled sometimes with children not related to us and even then not had a problem, but we always get a letter from the parents and a copy of the parent's passport and child's birth certificate just in case, but it's never been needed.
I understand that the the only country where there is potential for a problem is France, where an adult leaving France with a child which has French nationality needs a 'permission de sortie de territoire' from the other parent or legal guardian.
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He let us enter the country (I could understand his attitude more if we were trying to LEAVE the country, but we were entering the UK), but told me always to have a birth certificate on me.
I find the fact that people do manage to get away with traveling with minors with inadequate documentation a bit scary, considering that children from time to time do get moved to a different country without the consent of all persons concerned.
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Last year I took my grandchildren to Rotterdam from Hull on the ferry. At checking we were asked for proof that the kids could travel with us, we didn't have this and we're given the e mail address of the check in desk so my daughter could send an e mail giving permission. We were told that problems generally didn't occurr but occasionally immigration at Rotterdam refused entry until permission to travel was received.
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Many years ago when travelling back from France with my uncle (different surname), we were refused travel on the Eurotunnel as I didn't have a 'permission letter' from my parents for him to take me out of the country (we were trying to come back in...). When my uncle questioned this, stating that he himself could write the letter, the gentlemen just shrugged his shoulders and rang my parents to 'get permission'.
While I understand they're doing their job, and quite rightly too, the system seems very flawed.
While I understand they're doing their job, and quite rightly too, the system seems very flawed.
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we're given the e mail address of the check in desk so my daughter could send an e mail giving permission.
Two weeks ago I flew from the UK to Spain with my 7 year old god-daughter (a very pretty little blonde girl) absolutely no questions asked at either end. Of course I had a notarised letter from her parents, in English and in Spanish, but nothing was asked for.
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I sometimes wonder if, when the eurocrats granted us "free movement" within the EEC/EC/EU, they didn't think we'd bring all our ideas, prejudices, private battles and emotional baggage with us.
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Another pitfall exists when you and your child/children are not travelling on passports from the same country. Had to bribe an immigration official at Tan Son Nhat when departing a few years back who insisted that my two sons could not be my offspring, as their passports were issued by another country than my own.