SECURITY - Revised Uk Rules (14 Aug 2006)
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: N51:37:39 W1:19:16 Feel free to use as a waypoint.
Posts: 844
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Can it be squeezed down to 16 cm deep?
I still cant see what was wrong with the old size limits of properly enforced.
Psychophysiological entity
Mmm...before 9/11 I was asked if I thought that the small amount of lithium in a battery constituted dangerous goods. I asked the appropriate man in ops...delegating is handy sometimes...and he said no go.
The dangerous substance was in the battery of a life-jacket.
The dangerous substance was in the battery of a life-jacket.
Riding the Euro Gravy Plane
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Strasbourg
Posts: 455
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
172driver
That's easy to explain. Smaller bags mean shorter search times for security, larger bags mean longer search times. At the moment longer search times would mean BAA would have to provide more staff which will cost them money.
You can just imagine the phone conversation between man from DfT and the exec at BAA.
Man from DfT says to BAA exec "we have to start letting people bring on hand luggage, can you handle it ?
BAA exec says "only if the bags are small, very small. We suggest 45 by 35 by 16"
Man from DfT says "thanks"
Exec puts down the phone, lights another cuban cigar and goes back to reading the latest Mercedes brochure
BEagle, I don't really get yours. Can you explain what difference it makes to take a normal size carry-on or the DfT/BAA invented size? While I'd agree that the rules were abused in the past, the good ol' 115cm rule made and makes perfect sense - not every bag can be squeezed down to 16cm high! And please don't start any 'security' argument - we all know that 'security' is used to cover all and any abuse of power these days.
You can just imagine the phone conversation between man from DfT and the exec at BAA.
Man from DfT says to BAA exec "we have to start letting people bring on hand luggage, can you handle it ?
BAA exec says "only if the bags are small, very small. We suggest 45 by 35 by 16"
Man from DfT says "thanks"
Exec puts down the phone, lights another cuban cigar and goes back to reading the latest Mercedes brochure
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: KT6
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BEagle
Originally Posted by BEagle
172driver, I am somewhat perplexed by your arguments. For far too long passengers have abused the carry-on luggage rules and I, for one, will be very glad to see the 'briefcase' ruling continue. Those damned wheelie-bin wardrobes should go in the hold.
BAA will soon start squealing when no-one buys their expensive duty-free perfumes and spirits, so I imagine things will change again soon.
BAA will soon start squealing when no-one buys their expensive duty-free perfumes and spirits, so I imagine things will change again soon.
There has always been regulations on the size of cabin baggage - in effect the size was regulated by the maximum size permitted by the xray machine!! If the passenger has two of these, I agree - but I see no issue with roll alongs per se. They give the one or two night traveller at least one hour per flight of time saving, and I for one would rather avoid dealing with baggage handlers in any country.
BAA are bound to have had a say in the new sizes - it has all of their hallmarks - a non-standard size, an over zealous inefficient response - as usual.
Thread Starter
If only the 115cm limit was observed (with or without wheels), then I would agree that 115cm would be fine.
Since 4 Jul 06, I have flown some 18 sectors. All have been in rows 1 or 2, so I have been able to watch a procession of bags which would be more appropriate for mountaineers than short sector airline passengers being dragged down the aisle. Quite ridiculous.
It is true indeed that many airlines have a very generous limit for C- and D- class passengers. But I regret to say that many break the rules, from what I have seen, as do countless Economy Class passengers.
Time for a sensible revision of the rules. Due to the scale of theft and damage to hold luggage, I concede that the DfT 96cm limit is unreasonably restrictive. So why not something simple such as:
"You may take one item of hand baggage of maximum dimensions of 55x40x20cm and weighing no more than 10kg on board the aircraft with you. You should be able to lift this yourself into overhead storage compartments."
(Modified from bmi baby's website)
Since 4 Jul 06, I have flown some 18 sectors. All have been in rows 1 or 2, so I have been able to watch a procession of bags which would be more appropriate for mountaineers than short sector airline passengers being dragged down the aisle. Quite ridiculous.
It is true indeed that many airlines have a very generous limit for C- and D- class passengers. But I regret to say that many break the rules, from what I have seen, as do countless Economy Class passengers.
Time for a sensible revision of the rules. Due to the scale of theft and damage to hold luggage, I concede that the DfT 96cm limit is unreasonably restrictive. So why not something simple such as:
"You may take one item of hand baggage of maximum dimensions of 55x40x20cm and weighing no more than 10kg on board the aircraft with you. You should be able to lift this yourself into overhead storage compartments."
(Modified from bmi baby's website)
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,929
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BEagle's found religion, hallelujah 
! Again, I agree re the Mt. Everest packs some pax schlep on board (and then are too daft to get them into the bins 
), but I really think the recent BA policy change was a step in the right direction. 115cms and 'if you can lift it you can bring it'. Enforce this strictly and peace shall reign in the air (ok, wishful thinking here, but still.....). This leaves scope for the two-night road warriors and/or guys like myself who have to bring all sort of fancy (and expensive/fragile/sensitive) electronics to do their job.
Coming to think of the recet BA policy change: doesn't this whole BAA waffle start to sound a bit like an anti-BA effort? I'm not very prone to conspiracy theories, but a couple of weeks after BA announce a major shift in carry-on policy, BAA trot out 16 cms
....makes you wonder......
! Again, I agree re the Mt. Everest packs some pax schlep on board (and then are too daft to get them into the bins ), but I really think the recent BA policy change was a step in the right direction. 115cms and 'if you can lift it you can bring it'. Enforce this strictly and peace shall reign in the air (ok, wishful thinking here, but still.....). This leaves scope for the two-night road warriors and/or guys like myself who have to bring all sort of fancy (and expensive/fragile/sensitive) electronics to do their job.Coming to think of the recet BA policy change: doesn't this whole BAA waffle start to sound a bit like an anti-BA effort? I'm not very prone to conspiracy theories, but a couple of weeks after BA announce a major shift in carry-on policy, BAA trot out 16 cms
....makes you wonder......
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This whole thread is starting to sound a bit like a BAA bashing thread by those with an interest in seeing the demise of BAA?
It does make me wonder what the staff at check-in and customer service departments are advising pax. I can understand that intially there would be delays as regulations about carry on were changed at short notice. But following the initial changes why shouild there still be huge queues at security? Is it that pax are still trying to carry on restricted items and have not been advised at check-in or on contact with their carrier that these items are restricted. If pax had been advised accordingly we would find much shorter queues at security as everyone would be prepared and could repacked luggage accordingly BEFORE reaching security.
As for the reduction in the size of carry on luggage...bring it on. The amount of carry on luggage going on a/c prior to recent events is ridculous and the vast majority of it not required during the flight. The carriers who are actively encouraging increased weights/amounts of carry are on dangerous ground as it will only take one person to suffer life changing injuries from falling carry on luggage in the event of an accident/incident to see that policy swiftly reverse following a hefty court settlement.
It does make me wonder what the staff at check-in and customer service departments are advising pax. I can understand that intially there would be delays as regulations about carry on were changed at short notice. But following the initial changes why shouild there still be huge queues at security? Is it that pax are still trying to carry on restricted items and have not been advised at check-in or on contact with their carrier that these items are restricted. If pax had been advised accordingly we would find much shorter queues at security as everyone would be prepared and could repacked luggage accordingly BEFORE reaching security.
As for the reduction in the size of carry on luggage...bring it on. The amount of carry on luggage going on a/c prior to recent events is ridculous and the vast majority of it not required during the flight. The carriers who are actively encouraging increased weights/amounts of carry are on dangerous ground as it will only take one person to suffer life changing injuries from falling carry on luggage in the event of an accident/incident to see that policy swiftly reverse following a hefty court settlement.
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: London
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A little bit of help please for a nervous flyer
Hi all
I have a few issues that you professionals may be able to solve. Despite surfing and browsing I cannot find any definitive information on what I can or cannot do about a couple of things.
firstly, I am an extremely nervous flyer, but I do not want to be spaced out on valium. So, I use rescue remedy as a kind of placebo to get me through the stresses and strains of flying. Am I right to assume that I won't be able to take this through? I suppose if I was chilled out on a prescribed, addictive tablet that would be OK?(!
)
Secondly, given the fact that my rescue remedy is likely to be confiscated what do I do with the 40 fags that I am likely to consume before departure? I presume they (along with the liquid filled lighter) are a no no?
Thirdly, what IS the ruling on aerosols? Can they be packed in my suitcase?
And finally (for now!) does anyone now what the restrictions are coming INTO the UK from Tunisia?
Thanks a lot, hope someone can help ....
I have a few issues that you professionals may be able to solve. Despite surfing and browsing I cannot find any definitive information on what I can or cannot do about a couple of things.
firstly, I am an extremely nervous flyer, but I do not want to be spaced out on valium. So, I use rescue remedy as a kind of placebo to get me through the stresses and strains of flying. Am I right to assume that I won't be able to take this through? I suppose if I was chilled out on a prescribed, addictive tablet that would be OK?(!
)Secondly, given the fact that my rescue remedy is likely to be confiscated what do I do with the 40 fags that I am likely to consume before departure? I presume they (along with the liquid filled lighter) are a no no?
Thirdly, what IS the ruling on aerosols? Can they be packed in my suitcase?
And finally (for now!) does anyone now what the restrictions are coming INTO the UK from Tunisia?
Thanks a lot, hope someone can help ....
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Up in the air
Posts: 196
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by liquid sunshine
This whole thread is starting to sound a bit like a BAA bashing thread by those with an interest in seeing the demise of BAA?
It does make me wonder what the staff at check-in and customer service departments are advising pax. I can understand that intially there would be delays as regulations about carry on were changed at short notice. But following the initial changes why shouild there still be huge queues at security? Is it that pax are still trying to carry on restricted items and have not been advised at check-in or on contact with their carrier that these items are restricted. If pax had been advised accordingly we would find much shorter queues at security as everyone would be prepared and could repacked luggage accordingly BEFORE reaching security.
As for the reduction in the size of carry on luggage...bring it on. The amount of carry on luggage going on a/c prior to recent events is ridculous and the vast majority of it not required during the flight. The carriers who are actively encouraging increased weights/amounts of carry are on dangerous ground as it will only take one person to suffer life changing injuries from falling carry on luggage in the event of an accident/incident to see that policy swiftly reverse following a hefty court settlement.
It does make me wonder what the staff at check-in and customer service departments are advising pax. I can understand that intially there would be delays as regulations about carry on were changed at short notice. But following the initial changes why shouild there still be huge queues at security? Is it that pax are still trying to carry on restricted items and have not been advised at check-in or on contact with their carrier that these items are restricted. If pax had been advised accordingly we would find much shorter queues at security as everyone would be prepared and could repacked luggage accordingly BEFORE reaching security.
As for the reduction in the size of carry on luggage...bring it on. The amount of carry on luggage going on a/c prior to recent events is ridculous and the vast majority of it not required during the flight. The carriers who are actively encouraging increased weights/amounts of carry are on dangerous ground as it will only take one person to suffer life changing injuries from falling carry on luggage in the event of an accident/incident to see that policy swiftly reverse following a hefty court settlement.
I have gotten hit by it, as have the rest of my crew and flight attendents. I always pack all my flight kit and at least one uniform in my carryon bag, so that in case my main bag, which is always checked when deadheading to pick up my flight, is lost enroute. Sorry but when everyone cleans up their mess, and makes it safe to check bags, then you will find people not lugging so many things up the jetway.
Other than this aspect I totally agree and these idiots carrying a massive backpack or full sized roll aboard suitcases need to be given the heave ho.
CD
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: NY
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Now there saying on the news that some of the crazy bastard were gonna use their own childeren and wive to perpatrate this crime....absolutely unspeakable
more delay 'cuz there checking kids and babies now... I definitely want my OWN plane someday soon for one reason or another
rhov
more delay 'cuz there checking kids and babies now... I definitely want my OWN plane someday soon for one reason or another
rhov
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Gap in security
I'm sorry I couldn't be arsed reading the whole thing but my Dad just flew back from France and brought up something....
Why can you not bring stuff through security that you can still quite blatantly buy in departures?!
If its been brought up before I'm sorry but it seems ridiculous to assume that screenig processes for pilots and CC are not sufficient while letting folk sell whatever they want over (potentially under) the counter in duty free.
I'm genuinely glad that nothing serious happened as I'm sure everyone else is but I think the security measures should be more sensible/relevant. It sometimes seems like its just an elaborate PR exercise when such glaring gaps occur. I hope not.
Geezajob
Why can you not bring stuff through security that you can still quite blatantly buy in departures?!
If its been brought up before I'm sorry but it seems ridiculous to assume that screenig processes for pilots and CC are not sufficient while letting folk sell whatever they want over (potentially under) the counter in duty free.
I'm genuinely glad that nothing serious happened as I'm sure everyone else is but I think the security measures should be more sensible/relevant. It sometimes seems like its just an elaborate PR exercise when such glaring gaps occur. I hope not.
Geezajob
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: BAH HUMBUG
Age: 63
Posts: 89
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Chandlers Dad, you seem to be one of the few crew members who do check ANY
bags.
Most of the deadheading crews I have come across, particularly in the US I have to say, take about 3 large bags on board dump them in the front luggage bins and happily disappear down the back so that passengers who turn up with their single cabin bag end up having to check it. American and ExpressJet crews appear to be the worst.
The gate agents appear unwilling to apply the rules to anyone which has always been the problem. If they were to stop the people with huge rucksacks etc or 2 rollaboards at the gate lounge everyone would be happy.
bags.
Most of the deadheading crews I have come across, particularly in the US I have to say, take about 3 large bags on board dump them in the front luggage bins and happily disappear down the back so that passengers who turn up with their single cabin bag end up having to check it. American and ExpressJet crews appear to be the worst.
The gate agents appear unwilling to apply the rules to anyone which has always been the problem. If they were to stop the people with huge rucksacks etc or 2 rollaboards at the gate lounge everyone would be happy.
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Up in the air
Posts: 196
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by flybhx
Chandlers Dad, you seem to be one of the few crew members who do check ANY
bags.
Most of the deadheading crews I have come across, particularly in the US I have to say, take about 3 large bags on board dump them in the front luggage bins and happily disappear down the back so that passengers who turn up with their single cabin bag end up having to check it. American and ExpressJet crews appear to be the worst.
The gate agents appear unwilling to apply the rules to anyone which has always been the problem. If they were to stop the people with huge rucksacks etc or 2 rollaboards at the gate lounge everyone would be happy.
bags.
Most of the deadheading crews I have come across, particularly in the US I have to say, take about 3 large bags on board dump them in the front luggage bins and happily disappear down the back so that passengers who turn up with their single cabin bag end up having to check it. American and ExpressJet crews appear to be the worst.
The gate agents appear unwilling to apply the rules to anyone which has always been the problem. If they were to stop the people with huge rucksacks etc or 2 rollaboards at the gate lounge everyone would be happy.
Next trip is in a week, on the 22nd to Heathrow, then to Luton to pick up the jet. I stay out until the 5th of Sept then return home. Do not have much choice in checking or not considering the current security situation.
I will just be happy to be able to take my laptop, professional paperwork (passport and licenses), keys and phone with me to keep it safe.
Agree with you regarding the excess or large items. They need to be controlled and hopefully now will be.
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: West Country
Posts: 1,271
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have to say that the BAA are coming out of this looking dumber by the minute.
Now that they have allowed carry-on bags back on the aircraft, but not normal size ones the situation is just getting bonkers.
The sight on the news yesterday of the Senior BAA Manager of Heathrow holding up a bag and saying that that would be the largest allowed on the aircraft! - why? - do terrorists only use large bags?
Paddy O'Leary was rightly fuming - holding up in one hand one of the BAA's new 'allowable' bag and in the other a normal, 'banned', carry-on that has been in use, and is still in use, around the world for years.
Bizarre
Now that they have allowed carry-on bags back on the aircraft, but not normal size ones the situation is just getting bonkers.
The sight on the news yesterday of the Senior BAA Manager of Heathrow holding up a bag and saying that that would be the largest allowed on the aircraft! - why? - do terrorists only use large bags?
Paddy O'Leary was rightly fuming - holding up in one hand one of the BAA's new 'allowable' bag and in the other a normal, 'banned', carry-on that has been in use, and is still in use, around the world for years.
Bizarre
The Analog Kid
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Brecon Beacons National Park
Age: 57
Posts: 239
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by chandlers dad
Remember the UPS DC-8 cargo bird that caught fire recently? Believe that they have narrowed it down to a shipment of Lithium batteries that caught fire and brought the entire airplane down.
"The world's largest manufacturer of personal computers, Dell, is to recall 4.1 million of its notebook computer batteries because of a fire risk."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/business/4793143.stm
Cheers,
Rich.
(Edited to say that http://www.theregister.co.uk is a good place to go if you want to find out more about these or other technology issues. Just make sure you also take your sense of humour - with an obligatory 'u' - with you.)
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London
Age: 58
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Jet II
I have to say that the BAA are coming out of this looking dumber by the minute.
Now that they have allowed carry-on bags back on the aircraft, but not normal size ones the situation is just getting bonkers.
The sight on the news yesterday of the Senior BAA Manager of Heathrow holding up a bag and saying that that would be the largest allowed on the aircraft! - why? - do terrorists only use large bags?
Paddy O'Leary was rightly fuming - holding up in one hand one of the BAA's new 'allowable' bag and in the other a normal, 'banned', carry-on that has been in use, and is still in use, around the world for years.
Bizarre
Now that they have allowed carry-on bags back on the aircraft, but not normal size ones the situation is just getting bonkers.
The sight on the news yesterday of the Senior BAA Manager of Heathrow holding up a bag and saying that that would be the largest allowed on the aircraft! - why? - do terrorists only use large bags?
Paddy O'Leary was rightly fuming - holding up in one hand one of the BAA's new 'allowable' bag and in the other a normal, 'banned', carry-on that has been in use, and is still in use, around the world for years.
Bizarre
This is one of the few things I support BAA on. Although in fact I think these are actually the DFT's rules, not BAA?
Pilot of the Airwaves
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Close to the Med
Age: 74
Posts: 812
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A friend of ours flew LGW-AGP on Exel yesterday and along with 27 other people was a bag missing on arrival at Malaga. The bag contained all her childrens clothes
Servisair advised this morning that most flights are leaving without all passengers bags, as a result of the extra number of hold bags that they have had to process at LGW. There is a large backlog and it is not expected that the missing bags from that AGP flight, will get flown today. They are blaiming BAA.
What a surprise!
Servisair advised this morning that most flights are leaving without all passengers bags, as a result of the extra number of hold bags that they have had to process at LGW. There is a large backlog and it is not expected that the missing bags from that AGP flight, will get flown today. They are blaiming BAA.
What a surprise!
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A friend of ours flew LGW-AGP on Exel yesterday and along with 27 other people was a bag missing on arrival at Malaga. The bag contained all her childrens clothes
Why not do what we are doing. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. There are three of us flying on Thursday to the US, and we are distributing enough clothes, toiletries etc between 3 bags.
Why not do what we are doing. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. There are three of us flying on Thursday to the US, and we are distributing enough clothes, toiletries etc between 3 bags.
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: the old shed next to the runway...
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quote: - Mr Walsh said the resulting queues resembled a "bad dream at Disneyland". 
Maybe the BAA could install "average waiting time displays" i.e.: "you have 10hours til you get to the front of the queue then find the flight was cancelled 11 hours ago!".
Maybe the BAA could install "average waiting time displays" i.e.: "you have 10hours til you get to the front of the queue then find the flight was cancelled 11 hours ago!".
Pilot of the Airwaves
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Close to the Med
Age: 74
Posts: 812
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I knew some clever ***** would post that reply!
Totally misses the point, which is:.............what the hell are BAA up to......these delays are unacceptable, even with this hair brained increased security directive.
Totally misses the point, which is:.............what the hell are BAA up to......these delays are unacceptable, even with this hair brained increased security directive.