paying to sit together
I presume it was before the kids/strangers rules (which I have to tell you I find insulting) were introduced, but I once returned on BA Berlin to London and was put next to the two UMs (unrelated) on board.
On climbout I unwisely suggested to the 8-year old boy next to me that maybe a visit to the flight deck (I told you it was a while ago) could be arranged. Oh my, that was a mistake ! "Oh wow! Can I go now can I go now can I go now ???". I said I would ask the crew. "Look, here she comes, ask this lady ask this lady". And so on for the rest of the flight !
On climbout I unwisely suggested to the 8-year old boy next to me that maybe a visit to the flight deck (I told you it was a while ago) could be arranged. Oh my, that was a mistake ! "Oh wow! Can I go now can I go now can I go now ???". I said I would ask the crew. "Look, here she comes, ask this lady ask this lady". And so on for the rest of the flight !
WHBM,
I agree that in a way the kids/strangers rule is insulting. On the other hand, in today's litigious society, combined with a 'believe anything a kid alleges' attitude, I don't want anybody's kid sitting next to me. That's for my protection. (Note that radeng has no kids that he knows of...)
I agree that in a way the kids/strangers rule is insulting. On the other hand, in today's litigious society, combined with a 'believe anything a kid alleges' attitude, I don't want anybody's kid sitting next to me. That's for my protection. (Note that radeng has no kids that he knows of...)
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Just to stir the pot a little - this tactic is sometimes used, as well as the backup version of shouting, crying and screaming abuse, by families checking in late when they are split.
So what about the alleged CAA view that families should not be split, due to safety reasons?
So what about the alleged CAA view that families should not be split, due to safety reasons?
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I find the issue of seat allocation perhaps one of the most fascinating areas of the airline industry from a passenger perspective, which perhaps says something about what years in the industry does to one's imagination! For airlines that operate open seating policies, passengers are usually all to ready to say that they'd be willing to pay a bit extra to sit together and know where those seats are. Yet for those who charge for such a service, there seems to be a lot of griping that this isn't free, yet I would consider arriving at the airport in the knowledge of where your party is seated as a frill. There has been a rumour on another aviation forum that easyJet are considering allocated seating, and doing what bmibaby & Thomsonfly do, by charging passengers a nominal fee to reserve your seats as part of the booking process. For families or picky passengers, it seems a popular option, and an excellent revenue stream for airlines who need to find as many ways as possible to get some extra cash.
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To me it just seems like a marketing scam thought up by the faceless accountants that dont ever have to deal with irate pax. It is just playing on the fears that many people who dont travel very often and getting a seat together is something that people think/worry about in advance. Strangely you dont get charged to sit together in a restaurant, they welcome your custom, which includes the LO CO equivalent Mcdonalds.
Besides families with small children are not allowed to be split up for safety reasons as said earlier in this thread.
6
Besides families with small children are not allowed to be split up for safety reasons as said earlier in this thread.
6
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Experiences:
As a "staff standby" on a US carrier, getting my seat after all of the fare-paying pax have theirs and there's a few left, I often find that I get an empty seat beside me, even when the flight is almost full. I can only assume this is because check-in staff try to hold a few "side-by-side" seats for "couples" late check-in fare-paying pax!
Flying (full fare economy on GF) London-Bahrain a few days ago, I was politely asked by the CC if I wouldn't mind giving up "my half" of a 4-seat row so that the guy in 22c could have his family in 22c thru 22f. No, they didn't offer me a seat in First (!) but a perfectly acceptable pair of seats in 22a and b (flight was about half full) No problem! (I guess these guys either checked-in late, or left hubby checkin with the bags and the rest of the family checked in later - who'd a known!!??!)
I frequently fly with a "companion", either business or social (!) and have never had a problem getting seats together (as long as you don't leave your check-in until almost too late!)
In the Middle-East, I never have the embarrassing experience of being sat next to a black-shrouded "local" lady (equivalent to being sat beside a female UM in the Western World!) as check-in staff must have some "demographic data" on the seating computer! (and I'd be more than embarrassed if the said black-shroud started chatting me up!)
One complaint though is that I fequently get either seated beside the 22-stone Egyptian who cannot eat his meal without sticking his elbow in my ear, or behind the guy who folds his seat to full recline before the meal service gets under way
Oh well, if we really want leg-room, we'd pay for First or Business - pity my company won't spring for it!
As a "staff standby" on a US carrier, getting my seat after all of the fare-paying pax have theirs and there's a few left, I often find that I get an empty seat beside me, even when the flight is almost full. I can only assume this is because check-in staff try to hold a few "side-by-side" seats for "couples" late check-in fare-paying pax!
Flying (full fare economy on GF) London-Bahrain a few days ago, I was politely asked by the CC if I wouldn't mind giving up "my half" of a 4-seat row so that the guy in 22c could have his family in 22c thru 22f. No, they didn't offer me a seat in First (!) but a perfectly acceptable pair of seats in 22a and b (flight was about half full) No problem! (I guess these guys either checked-in late, or left hubby checkin with the bags and the rest of the family checked in later - who'd a known!!??!)
I frequently fly with a "companion", either business or social (!) and have never had a problem getting seats together (as long as you don't leave your check-in until almost too late!)
In the Middle-East, I never have the embarrassing experience of being sat next to a black-shrouded "local" lady (equivalent to being sat beside a female UM in the Western World!) as check-in staff must have some "demographic data" on the seating computer! (and I'd be more than embarrassed if the said black-shroud started chatting me up!)
One complaint though is that I fequently get either seated beside the 22-stone Egyptian who cannot eat his meal without sticking his elbow in my ear, or behind the guy who folds his seat to full recline before the meal service gets under way
Oh well, if we really want leg-room, we'd pay for First or Business - pity my company won't spring for it!
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It is,I believe, the scottish motto; I will not be attacked with impunity (or similar). but I might be completely wrong also... you see it on the edge of Scottish pound coins.
It is,I believe, the scottish motto; I will not be attacked with impunity (or similar). but I might be completely wrong also... you see it on the edge of Scottish pound coins.
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Originally Posted by Final 3 Greens
So what about the alleged CAA view that families should not be split, due to safety reasons?
Originally Posted by 6chimes
Besides families with small children are not allowed to be split up for safety reasons as said earlier in this thread
Charter flights tend to be full, more so than scheduled. On a full aircraft, one person's requirement for a specific seating can only be accomodated at the expense of somebody else's requirement - everybody can't win. Given that we offer families the choice to pre-book seats together to prevent their being split up, it strikes me as unreasonable that a family should choose not to pre-book, turn up late and then insist that they be sat together at the expense of others that have pre-booked. It is unfair on the other passengers, and on the arline staff, and on the children involved - this usually matters not a wit to the pikey parents that are involved, but such is the rich tapestry of life.
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From the CAA website
Seating – family
CAA guidelines ask airlines to develop procedures for the seat allocation of family groups, particularly when a group includes children. It is probable that family group members would seek each other out should an emergency evacuation be required, an action that could adversely affect the rapid evacuation of the aircraft. Children should be seated where they can be adequately supervised by an accompanying adult in the event of turbulence or a decompression in the cabin.
Children, accompanied by adults, should ideally be seated in the same seat row as the adult.
In wide-bodied aircraft, children and accompanying adults should not be separated by more than one aisle. Where this is not possible, children should be separated by no more than one seat row from accompanying adults.
Seating – family
CAA guidelines ask airlines to develop procedures for the seat allocation of family groups, particularly when a group includes children. It is probable that family group members would seek each other out should an emergency evacuation be required, an action that could adversely affect the rapid evacuation of the aircraft. Children should be seated where they can be adequately supervised by an accompanying adult in the event of turbulence or a decompression in the cabin.
Children, accompanied by adults, should ideally be seated in the same seat row as the adult.
In wide-bodied aircraft, children and accompanying adults should not be separated by more than one aisle. Where this is not possible, children should be separated by no more than one seat row from accompanying adults.
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As the holiday companies presumably advise the charter airline of who is booked to fly with them well in advance, it shouldn't be beyond the wit of man to allocate pre booked seats together to people who booked in the same group. Those who book seperately or at the very last minute might have to take their chances, but 90+ % of travellers would probably get to be together -before they reach the airport.
Scheduled airlines seem to have no problem in allocating me a pre booked seat several days in advance. Which I can then check (and change) on their websites
Scheduled airlines seem to have no problem in allocating me a pre booked seat several days in advance. Which I can then check (and change) on their websites
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Charter airlines on the whole don't get pax lists until 24hrs prior to departure and they do preallocate seats to those who've paid to sit together. Then everyone else takes pot luck.
Originally Posted by lexxity
Charter airlines .... do preallocate seats to those who've paid to sit together. Then everyone else takes pot luck.
The low-costs (free seating) seem at have accommodated this requirement by asking family groups with children to board first.
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I don't know whether or not this rule exists: I do know that if it does, it is not trained as policy to Cabin Crew, either at Tfly or any other UK company where I know crew.
It is taught at my airline. But as each airline agrees its own procedures with the CAA it may not be at yours. However as a crew member I dont think I would be doing my job properly if I didnt consider that a child split from his parents might not be able to put on an O2 mask in a decompression regardless of who paid for what.
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It is taught at my airline. But as each airline agrees its own procedures with the CAA it may not be at yours. However as a crew member I dont think I would be doing my job properly if I didnt consider that a child split from his parents might not be able to put on an O2 mask in a decompression regardless of who paid for what.
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Most airlines will try their very best to accommodate a child with at least one of its parents or guardians, but sometimes it is just not possible. It is very rare that a UK airline will seperate a child from one of it's guardians, but they will split the family group up.
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It reminds me of the time when a family unit could not be accomodated together on a long sector from Kinshasa to Brussels ...
The seat next to me had been allocated to the child and the mother decided to take that seat for herself and made the child sit with her father.
The child? Oh, she was 16 or 17 and ripening beautifully. So I took this as a compliment
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The seat next to me had been allocated to the child and the mother decided to take that seat for herself and made the child sit with her father.
The child? Oh, she was 16 or 17 and ripening beautifully. So I took this as a compliment
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First off - let's get one thing crystal clear! The CAA "asks" airlines is not the same thing as a "rule" or a "guideline" at all. It is only a suggestion!
Secondly, the CAA has no balls - otherwise Ryanair would have been grounded within weeks of commencing its UK operations over the breaches of safety regarding "utterance of false statements to obtain ATC clearance". (In their early days, their pilots routinely reported falsely that they were "low on fuel" in order to jump the queue for landing - a serious safety offence as it could make Air Traffic Controllers disbelieve a genuine "low fuel" alert!) Ryanair, EasyJet and all US carriers operating out of the UK would have been grounded for overloading cabin baggage lockers sometimes to twice or three times their CAA plated weights etc etc etc
For your information, NorthWest is to introduce a fixed charge for seating together, or for an Emergency Exit seat, or for a Window or Aisle seat. The only seat free of any charge will be a middle one!
Secondly, the CAA has no balls - otherwise Ryanair would have been grounded within weeks of commencing its UK operations over the breaches of safety regarding "utterance of false statements to obtain ATC clearance". (In their early days, their pilots routinely reported falsely that they were "low on fuel" in order to jump the queue for landing - a serious safety offence as it could make Air Traffic Controllers disbelieve a genuine "low fuel" alert!) Ryanair, EasyJet and all US carriers operating out of the UK would have been grounded for overloading cabin baggage lockers sometimes to twice or three times their CAA plated weights etc etc etc
For your information, NorthWest is to introduce a fixed charge for seating together, or for an Emergency Exit seat, or for a Window or Aisle seat. The only seat free of any charge will be a middle one!
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So, theoretically, what would happen if the seats were all pre-allocated and paid for? Some with families of 5 or 7 or 3 or 6 or 8? If someone has paid their money, but cannot be accommodated, do they get a refund?
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Presumably they would know from their departure control system once the maximum allocation had been reached.
From the airline's point of view, I can appreciate their position - the passenger part of me says "How disgusting, to charge for something that has always been part of the service and free before", but then the airline part of me says that US carriers are still very much in financial dire straits and any management "initiatives" to pump a few more shekels into the coffers will surely help!
From the airline's point of view, I can appreciate their position - the passenger part of me says "How disgusting, to charge for something that has always been part of the service and free before", but then the airline part of me says that US carriers are still very much in financial dire straits and any management "initiatives" to pump a few more shekels into the coffers will surely help!