7 trolley dollies, one packet of crisps!
Gonzo, by the time you've driven to the LHR long term airport car park, waited for the bus to the terminal, queued up to check-in, queued up to get through airside secuirty, waited for the flight to be called, queued up for a further security check, waited for the flight to board and then flown half-way to Geneva, it could well have been quite a while since the last decent meal. Unless, that is, you're prepared to allow even more time to include a meal at the airports less-than-delightful restaurants.
Mainline airlines damn well should provide a reasonable quality of in-flight catering to all classes of passengers!
Mainline airlines damn well should provide a reasonable quality of in-flight catering to all classes of passengers!
BEagle why??
The higher cost of a full fare standard ticket is for services such as interline acceptance should a flight be delayed or your business meeting finish early giving you the opportunity to travel on another carrier; change of date of travel and/or flight when needed; better options if delayed etc
The provision of food is not a high part of any ticket price be it sched or charter.
I happen to like the idea of the crew being in the cabin more to bring me drinks rather than stuck behind a food cart throwing poor quality food at me. I am old enough to have travelled back in the 70's and I don't remember the food being of a quality that was applauded by anyone, so what is it some are hankering after??
The higher cost of a full fare standard ticket is for services such as interline acceptance should a flight be delayed or your business meeting finish early giving you the opportunity to travel on another carrier; change of date of travel and/or flight when needed; better options if delayed etc
The provision of food is not a high part of any ticket price be it sched or charter.
I happen to like the idea of the crew being in the cabin more to bring me drinks rather than stuck behind a food cart throwing poor quality food at me. I am old enough to have travelled back in the 70's and I don't remember the food being of a quality that was applauded by anyone, so what is it some are hankering after??
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Flew MAN LHR MAN (757s both ways) with BA a few days back. On the first sector got a hot ham and cheese panini and no bar. Panini was rather like the ones we give out on our ski flights and was ok. Purser explaned that this reduced service was a result of the Gate Gormet dispute. I had no idea that it was still causing problems but there you are. On the return all we got was a cup of tea and a biscuit. The sort of catering that Dan Air was handing out just prior to its demise. By way of compensation all passengers were offered the chance to enter a competition for a free holiday. (Second prize, two free holidays! etc.) This time I spoke to the Purser as I was a bit put out that we had not been warned and therefor had not got a sandwich in the terminal. She explained that the paninis were loaded at MAN and LHR was still unable to cater short haul flights. She understood that the staffing problem with Gate Gourmet was now due to the hold up of security/disclosure clearences for the new staff. When I asked why she needed a full crew to serve tea she replied that the unions insited on it. (There were 7 crew, my lot uses 5.)
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I think the £5 voucher on Shorhaul while the GG strike was on was the best catering I've had on BA shorthaul in a long time -with that I bought a decent cup of coffee and sandwich and could enjoy it whist soaking up the 20 min boarding delay. The days of decent meals on shorthaul are gone and I see little point in pretending you are serving a 'quality' product with a couple of biscuits and a cup of tetley. Having said that I rate their longhaul product highly.
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I thought BA's in-flight meals service was back to normal. Am I mistaken?
Is everyone forgetting the fact that ALCOHOL IS STILL FREE????? You could easily drink the cost of your ticket on BA if you wanted!
I tend to like having something in my stomach considering the long hike to airport, through airport and the one facing from airport to final destination though. I can't understand this obsession with free alcohol - personally, I'd be happy with a free sandwich/snack, free soft drink and I'd quite happily pay for an alchoholic drink if I wanted one - especially in Y.
At least, as pointed out by others, some airlines make a point of not providing food for free, but offering you a range to buy. EI's buy-on-board is actually quite reasonable for example. BA, with their packet of crisp offering, falls short of either standard and does it badly while it's at it.
Too mean to buy a long personal title
Gonzo: I cannot understand why people would want to eat airline food anyway. LHR-GVA...can we not go without food for that long now?
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Globaliser has the same point as me. I rush to the airport, no time to eat the rubbish they serve there. I want to eat the rubbish you used to serve BA! I want the 90 mins on board to be relaxing and provide some refreshment. I then get off the plane and rush to where I'm going. The price doesn't matter, often someone else is paying, you have to try and remain a full service airline.
Yes BEagle I can count up to 7, they all stood up and blocked the aisles with 4 trollies in Y and one in J. The crisps were rushed out and then they all sat down again curtain drawn.
And yes Genghis I did feel safe but that's not my point, you can't deny that much as some of them seem to hate it they are also there to provide cabin service. It is a large part of BA's image and that isn't good at the moment.
Yes BEagle I can count up to 7, they all stood up and blocked the aisles with 4 trollies in Y and one in J. The crisps were rushed out and then they all sat down again curtain drawn.
And yes Genghis I did feel safe but that's not my point, you can't deny that much as some of them seem to hate it they are also there to provide cabin service. It is a large part of BA's image and that isn't good at the moment.
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What free booze? There was no bar. There was only tea or coffee. (Note to the Mod. I would have thought that BA not catering on a "full service" flight was due a slightly larger audience than this forum. )
No, doubledolphins, unless it's some boring people-tube co-pilot hiring debate, a post won't last longer than 5 minutes on R&N these days, it seems.
How any union can dictate that 7 cabin crew should be the standard ba A321 crewing level is quite beyond me....
How any union can dictate that 7 cabin crew should be the standard ba A321 crewing level is quite beyond me....
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Rumours & News is a forum for those issues and is in a group of "Flight Deck" forums. The main target audience (professional pilots) mainly derived from that group. A number of other forums are also provided to target people who are interested in topics that relate to those headings. Hence This one, and the relevance of your topic.
It is not about the size of the audience it is about the relative interest a topic has to the main target audience within a forum. This is an issue that will no doubt be of greater interest to the passengers it affects than the pilots it doesn't.
It is not about the size of the audience it is about the relative interest a topic has to the main target audience within a forum. This is an issue that will no doubt be of greater interest to the passengers it affects than the pilots it doesn't.
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Jetdriver, I wrote the initial post as a pilot and passenger surprised at how bad BA had become. If you think it doesn't affect pilots then you've had the flight deck door locked too long.
If BA pilots were at all concerned about their job security, and many are, then this thread may well be news to them.
If BA pilots were at all concerned about their job security, and many are, then this thread may well be news to them.
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Yes, well that is unlikely, but in any event many BA pilots and others of us come to this forum to find those issues that affect passengers. That is why this forum exists and why your thread is in it. I may have had the door closed for too long during the last 25 years but my other half who works as cabin crew for BA would have clued me in by now, I am sure.
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I have just retruned from Geneva on a BA flight and was also amused at small bag of Burts chips. Also I noticed the drinks trolley was loaded on top with soft drinks and water giving the impression that it was only soft drinks and tea and coffee available. The steward seemed surprised when I asked for Gin and tonic. I am sure passengers new to flying were unaware that alcoholic drinks were available.
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Re: 7 trolley dollies, one packet of crisps!
Originally Posted by Docfly
By the way, why not try giving a service so you keep the distinction between you and low cost - just an idea!
That and the airfares aren't that much more in cost.
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Re: 7 trolley dollies, one packet of crisps!
That and the service that you get is FAR more professional with BA than the silly little "low-fares" airliners that dump you at some mickey-mouse airport in the middle of no-where.
I always used to laugh at the people who flew from Stanstead to Girona with Ryanair. They advertise it as Girona-Barcelona, when it is like an hour and a half drive away.....
The bus from the airport to Barcelona City Centre costs double the extra they would have paid for a BA ticket into the cities proper airport.
FE
I always used to laugh at the people who flew from Stanstead to Girona with Ryanair. They advertise it as Girona-Barcelona, when it is like an hour and a half drive away.....
The bus from the airport to Barcelona City Centre costs double the extra they would have paid for a BA ticket into the cities proper airport.
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Re: 7 trolley dollies, one packet of crisps!
On short-haul, the number of Cabin Crew rostered per flight varies. This depends on the aircraft type, flight length, and Club class load. Basically the more passengers booked in Club (on one sector or both ways), the higher the complement of Cabin Crew.
Long-haul BA flights always have a standard number of cabin crew (with the exception of a couple 'demanding' routes) with the only varying factor being aircraft type and configuration.
Although there may appear to be few Club passengers on the sector you are flying, the returning sector may have a very high Club load.
Mind you though, this matrix was formulated 'pre crisp service'. So with the new 'service' perhaps you won't find 7 crew on your next flight!
As for the service itself: The 'crisp' service applies to all domestic, 'band 1' and 'band 2' short-haul flights - the shortest intra european sectors. These include Paris, Amsterdam, Frankfurt, Brussels, Zurich, Geneva etc. Morning departures still serve a hot breakfast panini. Mid-morning flights are complimentary soft/alcoholic/hot drinks and a slice of cake. And from then on the cake is substitued with a packet of crisps.
This service was of course adpoted to save money and also in reaction to our competitors. Bmi, Iberia, Swiss charge for food and drink. The other airlines give very little.
Wastage was also a massive issue, especially on the short paris/amsterdam/brussels/manchester/newcastle routes. Approx 47% of the sandwich boxes distributed were being collected in un-eaten and thrown in the bin.
A sandwich and dessert is still served in eurotraveller (economy) on mid length european flights (scandinavia, italy, spain, portugal etc) and a full 3 course hot meal continues to be served on longer european routes (Russia/CIS/Turkey/Greece and a few others).
Personally, I would have liked to see BA adopt a system similar to that of SAS.
- Club (as is current).
- An 'Economy Flex' section at the front of the economy cabin with free food/drinks/papers etc for frequent flyers and those on more expensive economy tickets.
- And 'Economy Basic' for those paying the lowest fares (which can be lower than £10 - plus tax - each way on some routes on ba.com).
Keeps
Long-haul BA flights always have a standard number of cabin crew (with the exception of a couple 'demanding' routes) with the only varying factor being aircraft type and configuration.
Although there may appear to be few Club passengers on the sector you are flying, the returning sector may have a very high Club load.
Mind you though, this matrix was formulated 'pre crisp service'. So with the new 'service' perhaps you won't find 7 crew on your next flight!
As for the service itself: The 'crisp' service applies to all domestic, 'band 1' and 'band 2' short-haul flights - the shortest intra european sectors. These include Paris, Amsterdam, Frankfurt, Brussels, Zurich, Geneva etc. Morning departures still serve a hot breakfast panini. Mid-morning flights are complimentary soft/alcoholic/hot drinks and a slice of cake. And from then on the cake is substitued with a packet of crisps.
This service was of course adpoted to save money and also in reaction to our competitors. Bmi, Iberia, Swiss charge for food and drink. The other airlines give very little.
Wastage was also a massive issue, especially on the short paris/amsterdam/brussels/manchester/newcastle routes. Approx 47% of the sandwich boxes distributed were being collected in un-eaten and thrown in the bin.
A sandwich and dessert is still served in eurotraveller (economy) on mid length european flights (scandinavia, italy, spain, portugal etc) and a full 3 course hot meal continues to be served on longer european routes (Russia/CIS/Turkey/Greece and a few others).
Personally, I would have liked to see BA adopt a system similar to that of SAS.
- Club (as is current).
- An 'Economy Flex' section at the front of the economy cabin with free food/drinks/papers etc for frequent flyers and those on more expensive economy tickets.
- And 'Economy Basic' for those paying the lowest fares (which can be lower than £10 - plus tax - each way on some routes on ba.com).
Keeps
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Re: 7 trolley dollies, one packet of crisps!
Originally Posted by wanderin_star
I have just retruned from Geneva on a BA flight and was also amused at small bag of Burts chips. Also I noticed the drinks trolley was loaded on top with soft drinks and water giving the impression that it was only soft drinks and tea and coffee available. The steward seemed surprised when I asked for Gin and tonic. I am sure passengers new to flying were unaware that alcoholic drinks were available.
Re: 7 trolley dollies, one packet of crisps!
I still consider that the sadly-departed buzz was perhaps the best all-round airline I ever flew with..
A lo-co, but one which flew from STN-FRA which was perfect for my needs. And at just the right time of day as well. There was a buzz lounge you could pay a little extra for at STN, you had a numbered seat (I always got there early and asked for 1D on the 146), the cabin crew were delightfully friendly. In-flight catering didn't cost the earth - and a cafetiere of fresh coffee with a miniature Bailey's tipped in was delicious.
But then the wooden-footed wooden-headed idiots at KLM sold out to Ryanair just as the airline had announced extra routes. However, Ryanair (who couldn't believe their luck) wouldn't accept the FRA turn-round times and flew to where-the-hell-is-Hahn instead, far too far from FRA and thus totally unacceptable for my needs. So it was back to Lufthansa, initially from LHR, then later BHX. After a while, the company for whom I work started flying me in Biz class, so I had a splendid time right up until LH dumbed down its service in April 2004. Before then it was: refreshment towel pre-start, free magazine, aperitif with some nuts early in the flight, then a 3 course meal with hot entree, plenty of wine followed by coffee and "would you like a cognac?". And there were always 4 cabin crew on the 737.
After April 2004, they only put 3 cabin crew on the 737. No refreshment towel on boarding, no aperitif or nuts a 2 course cold meal (pretty awful on many occasions), 2 drink services if you're lucky and coffee offered whilst you're still eating.... A lot of cheap little changes, the cumulative effect of which is to annnoy previously loyal customers. They've had thousands of complaints, but have yet to make any changes back towards their previously high standards - but the tickets are still just as expensive.
Airlines which dumb down like LH have done are just driving customers away. But do they care? Clearly not - they don't give a stuff about European business travel but bend over backwards to attract super premium long haul passengers as their sole priority, it would seem.
A lo-co, but one which flew from STN-FRA which was perfect for my needs. And at just the right time of day as well. There was a buzz lounge you could pay a little extra for at STN, you had a numbered seat (I always got there early and asked for 1D on the 146), the cabin crew were delightfully friendly. In-flight catering didn't cost the earth - and a cafetiere of fresh coffee with a miniature Bailey's tipped in was delicious.
But then the wooden-footed wooden-headed idiots at KLM sold out to Ryanair just as the airline had announced extra routes. However, Ryanair (who couldn't believe their luck) wouldn't accept the FRA turn-round times and flew to where-the-hell-is-Hahn instead, far too far from FRA and thus totally unacceptable for my needs. So it was back to Lufthansa, initially from LHR, then later BHX. After a while, the company for whom I work started flying me in Biz class, so I had a splendid time right up until LH dumbed down its service in April 2004. Before then it was: refreshment towel pre-start, free magazine, aperitif with some nuts early in the flight, then a 3 course meal with hot entree, plenty of wine followed by coffee and "would you like a cognac?". And there were always 4 cabin crew on the 737.
After April 2004, they only put 3 cabin crew on the 737. No refreshment towel on boarding, no aperitif or nuts a 2 course cold meal (pretty awful on many occasions), 2 drink services if you're lucky and coffee offered whilst you're still eating.... A lot of cheap little changes, the cumulative effect of which is to annnoy previously loyal customers. They've had thousands of complaints, but have yet to make any changes back towards their previously high standards - but the tickets are still just as expensive.
Airlines which dumb down like LH have done are just driving customers away. But do they care? Clearly not - they don't give a stuff about European business travel but bend over backwards to attract super premium long haul passengers as their sole priority, it would seem.
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Re: 7 trolley dollies, one packet of crisps!
Originally Posted by doubledolphins
What free booze? There was no bar. There was only tea or coffee. (Note to the Mod. I would have thought that BA not catering on a "full service" flight was due a slightly larger audience than this forum. )
Remember, this new catering affects only the shortest european flights - under 1:30 flight time. If you are flying to Rome, Barcelona, Athens etc etc etc you will still be served something substantial.