|
Flying GA in to Mildura
Hi all,
I'm looking to fly up to Mildura for the weekend and was wondering what it's like flying in to there now? I've read all the stuff in ERSA and on the website and seen a couple of older threads tending to recommend against it, even to fly in to Wentworth instead, but just wondered what it's like now. I'd be flying up on Friday with a passenger and back out again on Sunday, so will need to park, refuel etc. Any thoughts? |
0730-0830 the flying school will have 3-4 C172’s the circuit 0900 the flying school planes will go to wentworth to do circuits for the day generally, but with common ctaf frequency with Mildura it can be confusing. 0930 normally an air ambulance will come in, a rexy from Adelaide & Melbourne. QLink from melb. 1000 GAM aerocommander in 1030 Virgin 737 in It probably needs its own tower, but that’s the traffic you would get on a normal weekday. |
Thanks Tulsami; I'll likely be coming in mid-afternoon and then actually out again on Sunday morning-noonish. A quick check suggested that I'd miss most RPT traffic then (not that that's the reason for those times.)
|
Personally I'd give MIA a wide birth, costs money to operate there. I've been to WTO several times of late, great place no hassle, not seen or heard of a single training plane there in the mornings or any other time for that matter, the place is virtually deserted during the week. Aeroclub very friendly. Fuel avail although has gone up in price recently. Privately I avoid Ldg fee dromes where possible! |
If you really have to go to Mildura (rather than Wentworth which is much more user friendly) make sure you refuel when you get there on the Friday. If you want fuel on the Sunday you'll cop a 'call out' fee (even though there's a good chance they'll be there anyway!). You'll also cop landing & parking charges. Oh and make sure you wear your ASIC.
Other than that, enjoy the trip! Mildura is a nice place to visit. |
I'll check with my passenger, they were organising the ground transport part of it, I'm not quite sure where we're meant to be ending up but it shouldn't make too much difference? So long as I take my passport for crossing the border ;-)
|
Make sure you ask them where to park. Last time I was there I was the only one on the tarmac for a quick toilet break for less than 5 minutes and they told me off for parking in the wrong place. |
Swan Hill is a friendly place to visit for fuel and a cup of tea at the Mid Murray Aero Club. |
Originally Posted by Squawk7700
(Post 10584532)
Make sure you ask them where to park. Last time I was there I was the only one on the tarmac for a quick toilet break for less than 5 minutes and they told me off for parking in the wrong place. |
Mildura is becoming a Canberra ‘Mini Me’. Slowly but steadily making it more and more inconvenient and costly for GA. Just ask any of the locals who’ve been around for a while. I agree with Sunny. Swan Hill is my preference these days (but check ahead to confirm fuel arrangements). If you have to go to Mildura? IFEZ nailed it. |
Thanks all! I've chatted with my passenger who is arranging ground transport and she seemed confident that Wentworth would be fine so if that pans out then I'll head there instead; pretty sure I can extend the flight plan by the extra 3 minutes! Just have to hope I don't get held in by low cloud in the Melbourne Basin Friday morning...
|
Go to Wentworth, but not on a 43 degree day if you need fuel, the pump struggles in the heat!
MIA = rip off! |
Should be safe with the 1mm of rain forecast for Melbourne on Friday.
|
Originally Posted by The name is Porter
(Post 10584680)
Go to Wentworth, but not on a 43 degree day if you need fuel, the pump struggles in the heat!
Originally Posted by Squawk7700
(Post 10584701)
Should be safe with the 1mm of rain forecast for Melbourne on Friday.
|
MIA is fine, have been issues in the past but I wouldn't hesitate to use it and frequently do.
Fuel is as per stated organize to avoid a crippling call out fee. Good grass tie down area 100m from GA terminal/aero club, tie down cables provided, ignore the sign stating automatic sprinklers, they are manual so shouldn't be a case of a free wash. No landing/parking fees for private ops at least of a month ago. Good aircraft security. If you wanted to avail yourself of a taxi through aircraft hangar to avoid leaving your aircraft in the sun contact the airport manager (not the ARO) and he might be able to organize a short term rate. Much shorter drive into town than Wentworth. Longer sealed runways as opposed to gravel/natural surface, less prop damage. Not trying to dis Wentworth, just offering a balanced view. |
As at today, AvData says, with my bolding: YMIA Mildura Airport VIC Landing $21.89 per tonne. Parking $5.00 per tonne per day, <5,700kg and privately registered $11.00 flat per day. I should note that I do not object to the principle of the imposition of a landing or parking fee or both. What I object to is the increasing costs charged for increasing marginalisation. GA is now effectively banished to ‘the grass’. Ask any aircraft owner who used park at YSCB what happens slowly over the next few years. |
Pretty obvious light aircraft are not wanted at Mildura. There is a certain redeveloped cove in a harbor surrounded by four or five very pricey restaurants. The local council made it very, very difficult to arrive and tie up at this nautical destination. They fitted lots of “faux” marine bollards and cutesy stuff for the rubes to marvel at, but the place was basically unusable as a destination for large power boats. They added parking restrictions too. I was one of the few who worked out how to tie up there. ‘’I had several conversations with restaurant owners as we watched sixty foot power boats with half a dozen suits on them try to tie up during weekday lunchtimes only to leave in disgust after a couple of attempts. We reckoned each boat that left was good for at least a thousand dollar lunch bill. |
Originally Posted by youngmic
(Post 10585262)
MIA is fine, have been issues in the past but I wouldn't hesitate to use it and frequently do.
Fuel is as per stated organize to avoid a crippling call out fee. No landing/parking fees for private ops at least of a month ago. |
Mildura is a great place. I used to fly into Mildura monthly and loved it. But the current airport management are anti GA and I suspect are price gouging to benefit their own salary bonuses.
the landing fee is extortion the fuel is expensive the ASIC requirements and entry / exit from the tarmac is tedious. the GA parking is an absolute scandal. the surface is just plain dangerous to props. I won’t park our twin in the GA area and I make arrangements to park it privately. the staff are snooty By contrast, the fuel at Wentworth is cheaper and the people friendly with no landing fees. The only reason you’d land at Mildura is if you needed the instrument approach or needed a hire car. But for our twin, landing & fuelling at Mildura will cost more than Essendon it really pains me to say that because Mildura has a nice flying club and some really good local GA businesses. It’s a shame that they are collateral damage. |
Well I wasn't able to get up there today, as the plan was to stop by YBLT to pick up my passenger. Ceilings of 800ft around the hour or so that I'd have needed to get in to make timings work put paid to that idea! But thanks for all your replies, I'm sure I'll get up there some time.
|
Last time I was at Mildura we couldn’t even access toilets so we went in the bushes, fuelled and left. |
Mildura has a nice flying club and some really good local GA businesses. It’s a shame that they are collateral damage. It’s sadly the same outcome at many if not all privatised airports. Some ex-CASA arseclown apparently has expressed the view that the woes of GA are caused by ‘competition’. In relation to airport infrastructure, the problem is LACK of competition. Monopolies delivered into private hands! |
t
he landing fee is extortion =left the fuel is expensive=left the ASIC requirements and entry / exit from the tarmac is tedious.=left the GA parking is an absolute scandal. the surface is just plain dangerous to props. I won’t park our twin in the GA area and I make arrangements to park it privately. =left the staff are snooty Fuel is par for course. ASIC requirements are zero, just have one on you. Exiting from the apron, not overly tedious unless you normally have a minion open the gate for you, otherwise simply push the green button near the gate and it opens all by it self, you still have to walk through it though. GA parking is on grass, you wouldn't damage your prop even if you mowed the stuff with it, not a stone in sight. The last airport ARO I met was a super friendly bloke, even after a jammed curtis valve during DI leaving a huge stain on the bitumen (old GA parking area) he shrugged it off. And I can assure you the GM is pro GA and from a GA background, sadly there has (since gone) been a ramp official that has been anything but an appropriate ambassador for a regional airport. He was good sport to get a rise out of though. Old Akro, you're not related to Marven the manically depressed robot from the The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy by chance are you? |
ASIC card aside, at least they aren’t (or don’t appear to be) demanding you wear a reflective vest. There are a few small airports with stuff all flights who require it, aided by the little tinpot dictator pilots who strut around the place yelling at those who aren’t wearing one. They wouldn’t get the irony that they can see you while you are not wearing one....... There’s a couple of airports in Northern Tasmania who are guilty of this. Silly really because they are perfectly located for visiting pilots to or from the big island. |
Old Akro’s not Robinson Crusoe, youngmic. Tell me: Why was it operationally necessary to banish GA to the grass at YMIA? At YSCB, the tarmac area that used to be packed with GA aircraft is now mostly empty, due to the cost of parking on the tarmac versus the grass. There is obviously no operational imperative to not have GA aircraft on the tarmac area, as nobody or anything has replaced them. Next nail in the coffin in unnecessary insurance requirements. Are you sure there are no fees for GA at YMIA? |
The Airport Manager of the past few (tragic) years is leaving. There is some hope that some things might now improve? Mildura is an attractive place to visit and it does not need the aerodrome to be difficult for those in GA that choose to fly there. The grass parking area is but one example that could be improved.
|
Maybe he was the bright spark who decided to amend the ERSA entry for YMIA so as to purport to ban glider flights above the airport and ballooning and aerobatics within 5 nm? Any insights, youngmic? |
Maybe he was the bright spark who decided to amend the ERSA entry for YMIA so as to purport to ban glider flights above the airport and ballooning and aerobatics within 5 nm? Any insights, youngmic? |
[QUOTE=youngmic;10586442]t
No landing fee. Fuel is par for course. ASIC requirements are zero, just have one on you. Exiting from the apron, not overly tedious unless you normally have a minion open the gate for you, otherwise simply push the green button near the gate and it opens all by it self, you still have to walk through it though. GA parking is on grass, you wouldn't damage your prop even if you mowed the stuff with it, not a stone in sight. The last airport ARO I met was a super friendly bloke Youngmic I get billed $49 & some cents for landing at Mildura plus $11 per day parking. Want to see the invoice? It’s a privately owned, private category light twin. Fuel currently is $2.35 at Mildura. Moorabbin is $2.00 and Tyabb $2.05. I used to divert to Mildura to buy fuel because it was cheaper than Melbourne. I used to park directly outside the GA gate at the Aero Club. Now the airport won’t even allow it for Angel Flight pick ups You might have found a nice ARO, but have you met the CEO? When I took him to show him the GA parking area surface, even he admitted it was poor and allowed me to park in the run up bay. Since then I make arrangements to use a private hangar. However, the last 3 times I’ve just required fuel, I go to Wentworth. There used to be a toilet airside - its been removed. I used to love the coffee and carrot cake at the shop. Now you need to go through the full x-ray screening and chemical swab treatment. If I want coffee, its easier to take your own coffee bag and use the hot water in the aero club. It used to be that pretty much every time I stopped for fuel there would be another aircraft getting fuel. Earlier this year when my aircraft was there for 10 days, I never saw another GA aircraft on the apron during the period. Speaking of the aero club, they are seriously being persecuted by the airport. The club has lost its visiting aircraft parking, the ability to park and aeroplane out the front to load passengers - its even lost its car parking adjacent to the club. |
I have never been charged a landing fee and I was there as recently as a month ago, I did however once get charged a parking fee for parking in the old GA parking area which is now reserved for class B aircraft. I contacted the MIA airport management and pointed out the fee was not listed in the ERSA as per normal convention to do so and regardless of where I was still a private aircraft. They reversed the charge and I haven't had one since, perhaps this might be attributed to the last few trips arriving in the afternoon and leaving within 24 hours.
Haven't met the CEO, just the GM. Toilets and tea/coffee facilities snacks and airconditioned lounge are available on the western side of the aeroclub building and have always been open when I have been there. $2.35/L is par for course for regional airports the lower price at Moorabbin likely reflects turn over and lower transport costs. The security requirements at the main terminal are to be expected at airports with high capacity RPT, as I mentioned the aeroclub facilities are more than adequate. The parking area you refer to was an interim while the new GA grass parking area was being established, this new area is fine, having said that my aircraft is restricted to hard surface operations and whilst I will park on the lawn area and use the tie down cables if there is a likelihood of strong winds/thermals, other times I simply park in the class B area if a space is available. My understanding is that the change to parking location for GA was due to the proximity of heavy jet maneuvering and the risk of jet blast damage. I am not sure what was the initiator of this change, a claim by a GA aircraft owner for damage perhaps or more likely a CASA aerodrome audit that found it didn't meet the MOSP requirements, I don't know but suspect it was not on the wish list of MIA airport corporation. Whilst Wentworth is a good alternative airfield for many (no good for me due no bitumen) to my thinking we need a strong GA presence at MIA and should be encouraging everyone to use it otherwise if there is no presence then there is a sound case for MIA airport corp not to invest in or encourage GA ops. I flew to Bacchus Marsh recently, now there's an airport that one could truly grizzle about, some clown even parked, bunged and chocked their twin right near the bowser meaning unless you could push your aircraft back out or had reverse thrust you were buggered, no one seem to bat an eye at this, just bizarre. |
“Class B”? Is that B for “Bull****”? Either it’s OK for aircraft to park there or it isn’t. If there’s a risk of jetblast from manoeuvring jet aircraft, there’s a risk from jetblast from manoeuvring jet aircraft. If there’s a MOS requirement, there’s a MOS requirement. How can it be OK for GA aircraft to nonetheless continue to park there “if space is available”? I’ve seen it all before and heard it all before. |
LB,
I have no doubt to the veracity of the reason given for the relocation of GA parking and the reason for allowing class B aircraft there is likely around the assumption of increased weight of a class B aircraft and less likelihood of being blown over, (yes there were tie down rings, now since removed). LB your point is not lost on me, and as I stated to the MIA management fellow that explained this to me at the time,...how then due you mitigate the risk of a class B aircraft with gust lock left out or no rudder gust lock as is typical of many types not suffering control circuit damage if left parked aft facing to the jet blast? I could see he understood but was in a position of little choice. Oh, and it's not ok for GA to park there unless class B, I do it at their wroth and only because the safe operation of my aircraft takes precedence, I just make sure I face west, there is still a huge distance between the jet aircraft refuel maneuvering area and the parking area. |
Mildura is last on my list, I don’t need the potential complications. Been there twice, both times unfriendly and everything closed. My wife was abused by the ARO(? ) When she tried to get into the terminal to find a toilet. Pity, I wanted to stay overnight and eat at Stefanos. I now plan through Swan hill, stay overnight and eat at the pub in town. |
Oh, and it's not ok for GA to park there unless class B, My understanding is that the change to parking location for GA was due to the proximity of heavy jet maneuvering and the risk of jet blast damage. Mildura seem to be the only airport in Australia having this trouble integrating GA & RPT. |
MIA is like AY, both unfriendly for Pvt GA, they simply don't want you there! I used to fly into both (commercially) over many years, when the goons bought in the ASIC and high security they killed it, Wentworth (for MIA) is the only choice, avoid these inhospitable Nazi dromes at all costs! |
Originally Posted by Old Akro
(Post 10587674)
Mildura don't mean "Class B" They mean "High Status". There are about 4 different definitions of class B. Not only does Mildura not define which they mean, they don't make any mention of this in ERSA, you just find out on the ground. I've seen a variety of aircraft that are class A for IAP parked there with the CEO's blessing - but they had high status appearance.
If you believe this, I've got a bridge you might like to buy. Firstly, the only regular jet aircraft are the 2 movements per day by the Virgin 737. Secondly, point to another airport that requires similar demarcation. I don't have this trouble flying into Adelaide, Avalon, Wagga, Essendon, Sunshine Coast, Alice Springs and i'm sure there are more. Mildura seem to be the only airport in Australia having this trouble integrating GA & RPT. I would imagine it relates to all airports with high capacity RPT, the specifics of MIA as described to me relate not to the main terminal parking area but the adjacent area designated for high capacity jet refueling and the requirement for a jet blast protection zone when maneuvering from this area. The existence of such an area and buffer doesn't sound unreasonable at face value and they probably still remember when a C172 was blown over by a Dash 8. I don't spend much time delving into the riveting world of airfield design but from the little I do l know I am aware that many airports don't meet all the requirements of MOS 139 and typically they work there way toward compliance over time. The fact that this is what may have happened at MIA is not beyond reasonable belief. There is substantial separation between RPT jets and GA at Adelaide and Alice (can't speak for the others) so not quite sure how you're drawing a direct comparison there with MIA?? If MIA despised GA operations to the extent you allude to likely they would not have spent so much time and money establishing the large grassed area for GA to park and simply just left it as bare rocky limestone strewn area. The fact there is now a fairly active flying training school operating out of there should give some indication they are prepared to accept the mix of student pilots mixing it with RPT operations. |
Don’t go to Mildura, period. |
Hi I may of missed your weekend away... I have been speaking with Bill BURKE, Chief Exec of Mildura Airport. And made some comments to him about ‘the lack of enthusiasm for GA at the airport.. I’m sure he won’t mind me putting some of his comments, in context to the forum. Mildura Airport is not operated by Mildura Rural City Council. It is a Corporate entity acting on behalf of the Council. Fuel is Available via World Fuel Services who took over from Mobil some time ago. There have been changes to aspects of service delivery with WFS and a new fuel facility is in the process of being delivered. With regards aircraft parking, the negative comments reflect a small window in time when we will admit, parking facilities were far from perfect. We now offer a substantial grassed apron with cable tie down. The larger areas of bitumen pavement have, by necessity, been reserved for RPT and heavier aircraft I then replied to to him and he is keen to address the negative comments.... he went onto say. I am a Commercial Pilot myself and if I look objectively at Mildura, I see a Regional Airport with facilities that are second to none. We have great tie down facilities, a well equipped GA lounge with free coffee and tea facilities and soon to be a new relocated Avgas fuelling facility with credit card capability that gets around the old canate card system. Further to that, the price at pump will be pegged to an index that reflects fuel price at several other capital city locations and increased only to reflect transport cost. Additionally, avgas will be available from truck delivery if required. The airport has a comprehensive cafe in the main terminal that is open during hours of RPT departures From my brief conversation he is he is keen to set the record straight.... and keen to have GA visit.... re costs, that’s a conversation for another time. maybe worth a new look |
Originally Posted by youngmic
(Post 10586956)
Haven't met the CEO, just the GM. . Sunfish, advocating for private pilots not to use MIA is about as anti GA as it gets, GA needs positive encouragement across the board, nothing positive can come from a vision whereby we remove our presence. |
Originally Posted by youngmic
(Post 10589110)
My error, I have, and a great bloke, he has a genuine interest in promoting MIA for all users.
Sunfish, advocating for private pilots not to use MIA is about as anti GA as it gets, GA needs positive encouragement across the board, nothing positive can come from a vision whereby we remove our presence. The real answer in this thread should have been, hey, here are a few things to watch out for, but enjoy your flight, isn't flying GA great. |
| All times are GMT. The time now is 15:02. |
Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.