Originally Posted by LeadSled
(Post 10356545)
Sunfish,
PS: As many people are now just starting to find out ----- the "economy" of their Prius or Tesla did not include the cost of replacement batteries, nor the real cost of disposal of the exhausted batteries How many Tesla owners do you know that need new batteries LeadSled? Tesla batteries hold 90% after over 200,000 kms and will likely last for 600,000 kms or more! Nobody buys a Tesla for the “economy,” you should know that. They are a performance car. |
Prius or Tesla |
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....9eef47fc73.png
Originally Posted by LeadSled
(Post 10356545)
Sunfish,
One supportable analysis (meaning reasonably neutral or unbiased numbers) shows that the only state where an electric car would be "more green" in Australia would be Tasmania, because the recharge source is mostly hydro power. Did you realise that when the 240v power / life line broke from the mainland a couple of years back, that some hundred large generators were shipped to Tasmania to generate enough power for them to survive? One site alone had more than 25 shipping container sized generators. This in turn created a diesel shortage in Tasmania and in response the government brought over a ship full of diesel and parked it off Hobart for months. One site alone in the hills near Hobart used some 3 B-Doubles of diesel fuel every day! Not very green eh? Don’t believe everything you hear or read!!! |
Originally Posted by Squawk7700
(Post 10356573)
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....9eef47fc73.png Mostly? Did you realise that when the 240v power / life line broke from the mainland a couple of years back, that some hundred large generators were shipped to Tasmania to generate enough power for them to survive? One site alone had more than 25 shipping container sized generators. This in turn created a diesel shortage in Tasmania and in response the government brought over a ship full of diesel and parked it off Hobart for months. One site alone in the hills near Hobart used some 3 B-Doubles of diesel fuel every day! Not very green eh? Don’t believe everything you hear or read!!! No, of course I k now nothing about that, or anything else, for that matter, in your view. Why don't you grow up, and read what is written, in the spirit it is written, rather than looking fro something, with which to disagree. A hopefully one-off problem with the Tasmania to the big island inter connector did not invalidate the premise of the study --- which showed that, for a long time in the future, the source of power for overnight charging of electric car batteries will be from coal, so only shifting the "pollution" somewhere else, compared to petrol/diesel vehicles. My original post was about the real cost of some "green" technology --- and how inconvenient facts are often omitted ---- it is known as "proponent bias". As to Prius batteries, two close friends have both had problems with the battery pack, their dealer has said that their "problems" are not "problems", and seem as much age related as distance traveled, about five years. In each case the common usage has been short distance commuting, not country travel, so the batteries get worked. Neither is a proponent of "global warming" caused by "CO2 pollution", that is not why they bought the cars, they bought them in expectation of very low costs per km. for a daily commute. They have been disappointed. I gather that a number of taxi operators in Sydney have had similar experiences. So, does a Tesla add to or subtract from transport's contribution to "global warming". Tootle pip!! PS: Most of those diesel generators, and many more, are now in SA, the "green" state. |
Ok, so you’re now changing your earlier statement to exclude Tesla batteries as being no good / uneconomical. If you don’t like being flagged as talking BS LS, then refrain from the use of motherhood statements about something you clearly know little about! I have no issue with you or your alleged knowledge or your opinion, except for when seeeping motherhood statements are made when they are clearly incorrect. |
How long would the batteries last on a Prius or Tesla if every journey they made, both long and short, was at near max continuous power? Not long at all.
I'm not sure if a drone can do translational lift, especially the ducted fan variety. On the other hand, a teleporter can do translational lift quite well. Then there's the dreaded vortex-ring-state - the nerds designing this thing should be very afraid of VRS and any attributions made by forum posters. |
I'm sure the nerds designing these things are fully aware of all the issues raised by random internet users...
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Yeah, right Andy. I'll believe it when one of the nerds is happy to wave "Bon Voyage" to his family on the short hop to the airport in the sparkly new Uber unmanned electric drone.
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Originally Posted by Andy_RR
(Post 10356829)
I'm sure the nerds designing these things are fully aware of all the issues raised by random internet users...
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I think they know a f%$&-load more than the nay-sayers on this thread about designing aircraft and VTOLs and FAR23 and all that stuff and more. Not only that, they know enough about finding the financial backing to do something which is the stumbling block here in Australia before CASA ever is!
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Folks,
For something really interesting, look up BlackFly, by Opener Inc., on YouTube. And it is real, not a bunch of gunnah's. VTOL for the novice. With the pace of modern development, never say never. Tootle pip!! PS: 601 ---- Coal fired cars ---- love it, and correct for the foreseeable future in AU. |
Yeah Blackfly, more like Blowfly, ridiculous hover attitude, rounded bottom (no landing gear) single seat, and each prop makes an amazing amount of noise.
"Never be a success in Oz". |
Well, Andy turns out I've had interesting discussions with people such as engineers at Ausnet and others who are VERY sceptical about the current infatuation with lithium batteries. They are a mature technology and are about at their theoretical limits already. Large scale batteries for dispatchable power are especially problematic. Huge cost for tiny amounts of energy. Look up the specs. for Musks battery in S.A. A joke.
Oh, and best not to make too many assumptions about the people you are talking to. Some of us have qualifications outside aviation. Sometimes "nay-saying" is just a touch of realism. Why dont you put your money where your mouth is and stump up some cash for one of these miraculous endeavours and see how you go? |
Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie
(Post 10357538)
Yeah Blackfly, more like Blowfly, ridiculous hover attitude, rounded bottom (no landing gear) single seat, and each prop makes an amazing amount of noise.
"Never be a success in Oz". Of course, I understand completely, what you saw was the one, the only, without any prospect of development, change, improvement, etc. Let's face it, the Wright Flyer was just an impractical toy, clearly as a starting point for something called "aviation" it was a dead end with no future. "A Charlie" --- how appropriate. Tootle pip!! PS: If I had the spare change, I would buy a BlackFly V3 just for the shear fun of it. |
Originally Posted by George Glass
(Post 10357547)
Well, Andy ...
Why dont you put your money where your mouth is and stump up some cash for one of these miraculous endeavours and see how you go? |
Just in case you think that Li-ion battery technology isn't going anywhere, have a look at this: (I don't think you need any translation from the Czech to figure out what he's on about
https://www.he3da.com/ |
Originally Posted by Andy_RR
(Post 10357578)
Just in case you think that Li-ion battery technology isn't going anywhere, have a look at this: (I don't think you need any translation from the Czech to figure out what he's on about
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qe4FJBDfhOM https://www.he3da.com/ |
In the motor vehicle industry we are now getting traditional V8 power out of small 4-pot internal combustion engines, and all it took was some tightening of the emission regs. There is a lot of energy stored in liquid based fuels, and the technology to convert every last Joule from that fuel into useful power is expanding rapidly. I'm sure similar efficiencies can be had with turbine engines. It's just a matter of where you apply the best talent to the most realistic outcomes. If you set them playing with toys then that's all they'll ever produce.
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Cattle truck, that is a wrong reading of the automotive world. The GM and Ford engineers told me in 1985 when I was consulting, that their response to fuel prices would be to use little engines and turbo the hell out of them. The technology has been around for a long time, it’s just that the market didn’t want to pay for it at the time. If we have a battery chemistry breakthrough then drones. Otherwise forget them as people movers. |
Originally Posted by Sunfish
(Post 10358306)
Cattle truck, that is a wrong reading of the automotive world. The GM and Ford engineers told me in 1985 when I was consulting, that their response to fuel prices would be to use little engines and turbo the hell out of them. The technology has been around for a long time, it’s just that the market didn’t want to pay for it at the time. If we have a battery chemistry breakthrough then drones. Otherwise forget them as people movers. The future is exciting but we are nowhere near it yet!🙂 |
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