Part 61 questions
 

Hi y'all

Would I be correct that IRTA will not be auto with GD 1 anymore and separate flight test will be required? I assume my META will be carried over as with other endos and ratings.

Will it be a possibility for the test to be done during the grade 1 upgrade after sep 1st?


I'm currently chartering, and have the hours for grade 1, probably gonna stay GA charter/ instruction mix for the foreseeable future and trying to decide whether to sit the test prior to changeover.

Thanks in advance

Yes you are correct. From a popular ATOs mouth on the subject all FIR upgrades will be separate tests. As for can you do more than one at a time it depends on your preferred ATO. Even now most will not do multiple ticks on the same day even though the ATOM says they can.


So if you have the hours go and get the PMI out of the road and get it done.

Figured as much...
What a pain in the ar$e!:}
Cheers

PART 61 DILEMMA RE AEROS
 

Curious to see how aerobatics will now be recognized as a licence qualification as CASA have no track of records no do most senior pilots have their first logbook.

Under the old CAR it was issued as an informal approval from one qualified pilot to another. now it seems it will require an official test to be able to conduct said sequence or spin.

How will spinning be recognized. As far as I remember, spins are type specific. Am I expected to pay for 6 different flight tests so I can exercise the same privilege that I exercise today???

HR

Considering the email that turned up yesterday from CASA, I'd say very likely..

"The start of the new licensing suite of regulations is now just over a month away. On 1 September 2014 the transition period for Parts 61, 64, 141 and 142 of the Civil Aviation Safety Regulations begins. Over the four year period from 1 September 2014 all pilots will have their licences converted from the current format under Part 5 of the Civil Aviation Regulations to the new format under Part 61 of the Civil Aviation Safety Regulations. Pilots can continue to use their current licence during the transition period until it is converted. The four year transition period has been established to enable CASA to manage the conversion of about 40,000 licences as smoothly as possible. From 1 September 2014 all new pilot licences, ratings and endorsements will be issued under the Part 61 regulations. New requirements for flight reviews and proficiency checks will also take effect.
We are encouraging pilots to apply for a new licence document only when their flight instructor or flight examiner notifies CASA of a flight review, proficiency check or a flight test for a new licence, rating or endorsement. By adopting this approach there will be an orderly flow of licence conversions, rather than a potential log jam if many pilots apply at one time. When a flight review, proficiency check or flight test is conducted pilots will complete a form to transfer their qualifications to Part 61. The flight examiner or instructor will make an entry on the current licence in the first available space and then draw a line directly under it. The examiner or instructor can also sight and certify copies of any original permissions not contained in the current licence that need to be transferred to the new Part 61 licence. This includes permissions contained in the log book or any other instrument that confers privileges under the Civil Aviation Regulations. Both the notification and transfer forms will then be sent to CASA, along with certified copies of any permissions. All the permissions will then be placed in the new Part 61 licence, which will have been updated using the details provided on both forms. The new Part 61 licence will then be printed and posted to the pilot. We are asking pilots to then carefully check all of the permissions listed in the new licence document to ensure none have been missed. If a pilot believes a current permission is missing from their new Part 61 licence, a resolution form will be available on the CASA website from 1 September 2014.
For most pilots the only noticeable change under Part 61 is they will get a new licence document with a slightly different format, although the new licence looks similar to the old and is still on paper. The first pages will still contain the Government crest and a pilot’s personal details. Next will be a list of all licences - for example private pilot licence and commercial pilot licence - and aircraft ratings. Any design features and flight activity endorsements held will then be listed, followed by any operational ratings and their associated endorsements. The biggest change pilots will notice is the addition of tables to the end of their licence because sticky labels will no longer be used in logbooks. Any new ratings and endorsements gained by a pilot will now be written directly onto the Part 61 licence tables by instructors and examiners.
Please find out more about the new licences and other changes in the licensing suite by regularly visiting the CASA website.
Best regards
John F McCormick"

Finally, 20 years & 250 million later! How good is this? This will be soooooo cool! I love this country and how efficient we are, best red tape in the world :D every aviation nation in the world will be clamouring to adopt our suite of regulations :ok:

Now now 'JR' lets not get too cynical here buddy we all know that CASA's mandate is to retain their jobs at all costs, to create confusion something they are experts at, efficiency has nothing to do with it:E:ok: It's the Aussie way ya know mate:ok:

Wmk2

After examining my father's old licence from the 70s, it's become apparent that CASA has simply gone full circle and returned to the old way of doing things.

The old licences have these tables where Instructors and Testing Officers were to input endo's, approvals and ratings. So it appears for all the money poured into this process has simply taken us back to a soon-to-be recycled method.

Speaking of 'reform'. Goodbye GFPT, hello RPL... again. We used to have the Restricted Pilot Licence as well, until someone spent a few 10's of million dollars 'improving' the system to the GFPT.

What else can we dredge up and reuse, whilst calling it innovation? Sounds like the fashion industry and Hollywood...

Everything old is new again!!!

As far as CAsA goes.

They are recycling pilots as well, upgrading 72 year olds with A380 endorse's no age discrimination there, even supply free Viagra so the geriatrics can relive their youthful exploits.

Tad harsh thorny, can't see where the introduction of my Viagra interferes with your flying progress .... :E maybe I won't ask you to hard stick it onto the runway?

Where is that Solvol?

Na avgas, no problem they only give them Viagra light, gets it hard enough so they don't fill their boots when they have a pee.
.

A golden opportunity for an act of civil disobedience, if all 40,000 of us all apply for new licences on 1 / 9 / 2014.........:p. A quick question - as members of the GA community, we have funded the research which has brought us back to where we started and are reverting to a system which I am not sure that we ever asked to change from or revert back to (did I miss the overwhelming dissatisfaction with either licence which prompted the change/s? ). So when we apply for anew licence in a format we didn't ask for after a review which we have funded, do we still need to pay for the new copy......

Hi all, just hoping someone could help me on a Part 61 related question:

I have a CPL with NVFR on my current (CAR 5) licence. I am endorsed on VOR and ADF only, not GNSS. I'm aware that navaids are not individually endorsed on Part 61 NVFR ratings.

I want to know how can I fly using GNSS under NVFR? I'm told pre-Sept 1 all I had to do was an En Route GNSS ground course. Has this changed? Have tried asking various instructors (weren't entirely sure), ringing CASA (not even remotely sure), emailing CASA (no response yet) and of course, looking through the legislation but I can't find any reference to what I would need to do. I suppose the only other option is an instrument rating but that's not practical right now. Can someone please help?

You need to attend a ground school for the type of gps to be used eg garmin 400 series , then you can complete a GPSN endorsement , this can be done in flight or an approved sim.

The whole thing should be less than a $1000 .

Ground course $350 - $500
Then about 1 hour aircraft or sim

Then of course you could read the manufacturers pilot manual (it aint rocket science) and go ahead and use the stuff. Just because its in the aircraft dosnt mean you switched it on.http://www.pprune.org/images/icons/mpangel.gif

Thorn Bird,

Yes your correct , nothing stopping you playing with the GPS, Just the small problem of a Sticker in your logbook , saying your trained by an approved school and instructor :ok:

Like I said, if its in the aircraft dosnt mean you switched it on, or if you did admit, you did. Sticker or no sticker.

There is no sticker in a book. It all goes on the licence now.
CASA have been asked to review this as there are a number of shortcomings between the AIP and the new rules. Especially related to the enroute nav aids and the ref in the AIP of what qualified means (to use a nav aid).

I believe that any pilot, even day VFR only, can have their licence marked with appropriate nav aids once they have received training. That then allows them to legally use the nav aid as primary nav for day VFR. People use GPS now for nav, there is an avenue to formalise it, so why not make it happen and improve safety?

That AIP 19.1.something note 3 or whatever it is must be the most underused rules in Aus aviation.

It totally baffles me how many people, even in flying training etc simply don't know of its existence.

I've just received my new Part 61 license and have noticed under the Flight Crew License and Category Ratings section, Flight Radiotelephone Operator License is no longer listed. Anyone know whether this is an error in printing by CLARC or whether it's intentional with the new license format?

I'll call them on Monday to find out, but if FROL has been intentionally omitted on the new format license, then how else are we meant to show that we have such a license? As I fly overseas on a validation of my CASA license, to have Flight Radiotelephone Operator License is an actual requirement for the licensing authority in the country that I operate in.

Looks like it's gone.:(

61.435 When holders of pilot licences authorised to operate aircraft radio
(1) A person is authorised to transmit on a radio frequency of a kind
used for the purpose of ensuring the safety of air navigation if the person:
(a) holds a private pilot licence, commercial pilot licence, multi-crew pilot licence or air transport pilot licence; or
(b) holds a recreational pilot licence with a flight radio endorsement.

So you're authorised to transmit, but you're NOT actually licenced now.:eek:
I wonder how ICAO feels about that? And of course, CASA regs only apply in Australia.
And it looks like Students are not authorised, though that could come under some other reg.
See also CAR83. My brain hurts.

For your overseas flights, take the Part 61 page with this reg on it on all flights? Though THAT is still not a licence.

Part 61.......:mad:

Wasn't it a CAsA mantra that the reason they were inflicting this ClusterF.ck on the industry was to align us with the rest of the world?

Wasn't it only going to cost a small operator about $6000 a year extra?

So far identified around $100K a year for a small operator.


Unfortunately we cant put an extra levee on fuel to employ another 90 managers, so where they expect the money to come from I have no idea.

On my new Part 61 licence, under "flight crew licences and category ratings", it lists CPL then PPL and then RPL with a flight radio endorsement under that.

See the
(b) holds a recreational pilot licence with a flight radio endorsement.

PPL and above don't get the flight radio endo (it seems) and they don't need it (it seems) due to the first bit - authorised to transmit.

I see now, CASR 61.120 authorises students to transmit on the radio, without having a pilot's licence or a Flight Radio Operators Licence.
I wonder if GFA, ASRA, etc and RA-Aus operators are authorised now under some new bunkem, or have they slipped through the net. Seems the only possibilities are via Part 61, 64 or 65. I'll go for a look.
Looks like the receiving of incoming radio broadcasts is free. (Free from prosecution/persecution under strict liability.) Yippee.

I want to go fly a piston single as PIC. My last AFR earlier this year was in a twin. My last single engine related thing that would cover it was over 2 years ago. Does anyone know if I can go fly a single or do I need to do a SEA review first?

I'm planning to ring CASA if I can't be pointed to the appropriate reg.

Thanks.

You sure can. 61.375 Limitations on exercise of privileges of pilot licences—ratings, states this.

So if you keep your Flight Review current for multi-engine aeroplane class it allow you to exercise privilege for single-engine aeroplane as per paragraph (4).

Also bear in mind there are complex multi-engine aeroplanes covered by a Type Rating which under 61.061 meet the flight review requirements for the multi-engine aeroplane class rating. Eg. King Air 350, Beech 1900, Dornier 228, G-73 Mallard, Merlin/Metro variants.

So a Flight Review in any of the above type rated aircraft would keep your multi-engine aeroplane flight review current which automatically in turn would cover your single-engine aeroplane flight review requirement.

Can someone please advise if there is grandfathering of previous log book endorsements, such as aerobatics (>3000ft) and formation etc?? I can't seem to find any reference??? Ta

Yes triadic, tick the boxes for those endorsements on form 61-9TX (instructions on the form) and include certified copies of your logbook endorsements.

Aerobatics below 3,000 ft - current approvals transition to a flash new endorsement although I have yet to hear what happened with my friend and his 300 ft approval - did he get 500 ft or unlimited?

Thanks manymak, however I read that differently to you.

I read 61.375 as 'if you did your PPL test in a twin you would get MEA and you would also be allowed to fly SEA as an extension.'

But I can't find anything that absolves you from having to complete a SEA review if you have a current MEA review as per 61.475.

I'm usually pretty good at this air law business but Part 61 has me stuffed.

JJTS,

CAsA has finally reached the pinnacle of regulatory embuggerance.

FOI/AWI Nivana.

Regulations that not even the lawyers can understand!!

FWIW I rang CASA and the response I was given (after some deliberation) was that I can continue to fly twins and singles under my CAR 5 licence but once I get a part 61 licence I won't be allowed to fly singles any more until I do a SEA flight review.

So gaining/renewing a qualification will allow me to do less.:D

BTW something to watch out for those who have been keeping everything current with an annual MECIR renewal: Next time you renew your IR in a twin you can't fly singles anymore until you do a review.

JustJoinedToSearch, have a look at the Part 61 Licence Instruction Guide.

http://www.casa.gov.au/wcmswr/_asset...on%20guide.pdf

Go to appendix 1 Summary of flight review and proficiency checks. Look at note 1.

It says simply "MEA covers SEA".

Suggest you go back to CASA and point this out.

Cheers

Yeah but that isn't backed up by anything in the actual regs I can find.

JJTS,
That's the way I read it, and also one of the creators of this mess in Canberra agrees. But in the words of Demtel: "Wait, there's more".

Not only do you need separate IR renewals for a single and a twin (and one FOI says you can't do an SE or ME CIR in the same flight as a flight review), but it seems you need separate tests for CIR "glass" and "round dials".

The potential cost is horrendous, compared with pre. Part 61.

Tootle pip!!

PS: Beware of MOS provisions that do not fit regulations, there seem to be lots of conflicts.

Part 61.745 clearly (as far as CASA can be clear) says you are taken to have completed an aircraft flight review if you have done an instrument proficiency check.

Where in CASR 61 does it make any reference to glass and conventional cockpits? I can't find anything in the CASA Flight Examiner handbook either. What a horses a*se.

As for whether a MEA Flight Review covers a SEA can any of the part 61 experts out there find a reference better to the one I provided. All of the flight crew licensing guides out there all agree on the fact that a MEA FR will cover you for SEA.

Maybe there is confusion over MEA/SEA with MC/SP.
CASR 61.675 appears to say if you do you're IPC in a Multi-Crew aircraft. you then have to do it all over again in a Single Pilot aircraft.
But I could be wrong as 61.675 refers to "a flight test for an Instrument Rating in a single-pilot aircraft" not an Instrument Proficiency Check.
Have read the reg many times without really understanding it.

Folks,
A core of the problem seems to be that various guides, and other explanatory publications, including CASA internal training (and public statements by McCormick) plus parts of the MOS are based on the "policy" that was the intended outcome for Part 61.

However, to a significant degree, what has gone into place in the regulations no longer conforms to the "policy".

Sadly, the regulations rule.

Part 135 will be a partial fix, it will eliminate so much of the light end of GA that there will not be much left to have a problem.

Tootle pip!!