Knx Operators Hire Over The Top?
 

I heard through the vine that a certain KNX operator has begun hiring new pilots over the heads of older time experienced pilots.

I bet the old boys are not all to happy.

Also I have noticed when I fly into KNX from time to time the standard of airmanship has dropped from the good old days.

Has anyone else heard this?:uhoh: :confused:

Was this certain person employed to fly the night freighter???

Only an observation from my visits to KNX over the past year or so. Was having a beer with an old mate and we both agreed that it would not have gone on in our day.

Maybe they are hiring more experienced pilots to ensure next season isn't has bad for them as this one was. You can't have multiple accidents every year. Another thing they could do is raise the level of check and training (or create a check and training program), because from what I've heard the general standard has droped this year.

Theres a new CP there isnt there? maybe that might help.

Hi Boysngirls

Confucius say...

"People in Glass Houses"



With Love


Mav

Slingair has been in turmoil ever since those nasty circuit heros, AKA the Jandikot Generals showed up. The check and training went way downhill as soon as the big boys from Jandy & Meridin rolled into town. March on the clowns

From what I have heard Slingair have obtained long term contracts that require pilots to have a certain amount of multi time and experience, which mean't they had to look outside the company or turn the contracts down.


The rumours that I have heard sound like alot of s@$t spoken over a few beers to me and unless you know how the operation is truly run then dont critisize a proud Australian company that has given alot of pilots a start in aviation.

No doubt they have given alot of pilots a start in the industry. Broke evey rule in CAO 48 to the extreme but we'll let em go on that one.
I wouldn't think they'd be to proud of the past 7 or so months. Enough trouble for them to start their own "Air Disaster" series. (avail at all good newsagencies early 2004!!)

The Jandakot General...
 

...is an interesting person.... And I had the pleasure to meet him... I also met the two former chief pilots of Sling Air and they are both reasonable and cool people, nothing like the General...plus Sling Air is supposingly one of the best GA companies to work for... But here is my story....

I (200 hrs/CPL-IR) went to Knx in March 2003 to find my first job, why??? Because I heard KNX is the place to be and everybody gets his/her first job there... Luckily the General granted me an interview which lasted 30 seconds. He offered my a job on the ground as a refuller and as a human answering machine for the first seasons amd flying the year after; He promised me to call me for a check ride... he never did... I left 3 messages a week for about 4 weeks, but nobody had the honesty and the pride to call me to say "sorry, come back next year..." This reflects the (lack of) professionalism of sling air... And the General. At the end Sling Air is just a normal average GA company... very disappointing...but that's just the way they treat you there.... But more to come about professionalism....

In regards to "hiring over the top" I know that there are very capable line pilots with a couple hundred multi bashing around in a C210 carrying bundles of tourists through the bungles every day... Why??? Because to get on the twins the general's philosophy is to be one of the general's henchmen... The requirements are to be from Perth and preferably without any charter experience.... I do realize that the C310 crash doesn't really help progression of pilots, but experience doesnt save anybody... A Duchess went down in Sydney about a year ago; the pilot was over 60 years and had 20000+ hours...and it was a pilot error.

There is also that interesting "3-chick policy". For some reason (I am not sure if this is again a General's thing) Sling HAS to maintain a stock of 3 pilot-girls every year... preferably blond and with big tits... The general seems to have a thing for girls and suddenly drops the minimum requirements to 200hrs... Most likely at the end of this year the general might have to amend this policy because excess wear and tear on undercarriages and nose wheels do cost money... (Pls dont get me wrong, I feel sorry for the girls who did the nosewheelers and the wheels-up last season though...because I think it is more a check and training issue on the General's behalf) and by the way as previous people posted here on this forum... CAO 48 - it simply does not exist in KNX...

The locals in KNX are very special as well... Mostly working class people by choice - predominately from Perth who couldn't make a living in a big city - decided that the only way out is the "Grand Escape" to go to KNX to find work at Tuckerbox or Coles filling up shelves for the rest of their lives... Maybe they make it to the check out supervisor or so, but who knows.... When you get a job there and if you are from the big city and possibly know more then they do... make sure you do not expose your excess knowledge and experience, as you are only a threat to them and you only make enemies...just do your job and shut up. KNX neither likes change nor people with Uni degrees...

I lived in a hostel dorm for a 100 bucks a week, sharing my room with 7-9 other unemployed pilots...everybody watches his mobile very closely and when it rings...everyone holds their breath because it might be the General...and ...ahhh...no .... Oh ****, it's just the folks ringing...

The only excitements are the open air movies every Saturday nite and the weekly piss-up at the local pub...with the general the main attraction of course...enjoying himself in company of his henchmen...who make sure he gets enough drinks. If I remember right, he prefers Carlton Cold...although he likes being surrounded by unemployed pilots because it must give him some form of satisfaction and give him a feel of being very powerful, please dont waste your money on him, you wont get a job by buying him a beer in the pub.

Guys with 200 hours pretty much dont have a chance in KNX... I am glad I didnt get a job there and I would never go to KNX ever again to look for work... I got out of there 3 months after my 30 second interview and got a job in the outback somewhere else and I am very happy where I am and what I am doing.... I did meet great people though who shared the same believes and thoughts as I did and still do about this special place...

I have to agree the General is a Tosser and so are his yes men

Europilot does it ever occur to you that just maybeeee there are alot of pilots out there trying to get work and Slingair cannot employ everyone I bet they get hundreds of emails weekly. At least the General spoke to you. Even if you did not get a start consider yourself lucky and just maybeeeee he has you on file for next season.

You know its people like Reachtrap and Raingauge that are small minded W#$#$rs and bag aviation, is it because you are out of work or maybe your present employer treats you bad and you have nothing better to do but critisize other companys.

So maybe you three Whinges should get out of the industry and get mummy and daddy to pay for another career.

It doesent matter if the boss is a tosser or you think he is or isnt.

If you have the required qualifications and interview well and can fly well enough on the checkride you will get the job.

Otherwise quit whinging all of you....it is doing yourselves no service, particularly if prospective employers are viewing this post and may (possibly) know who you are. It wont help you any in the next job, and you are in danger of becoming the w@nker you despise yourself.

Bribery (beers) at the pub will not get you a job, maybe a check ride only, YOU ALONE and your ABILITY determine if you get the job.

End of rant.

It all boils down to wether or not you can fly a plane.

Unfortunatley over the years I have learnt that just because you have a liscense doesn't mean you can fly a plane...

Which takes us straight back to the training issues.......

to airstream and sancho

I did pay for my own training... mummy and daddy didnt pay a cent... what I am trying to say is that KNX is NOT the place to be for a 200hr pilot... at peak times we counted over 50 unemployed pilots, towards june it went down to about 15-20. as far as I know Sling did not hire a 200hr MALE pilot this year and alligator only hired 2.

I am NOT pissed off at sling air because I didnt get a job; I do understand that they cant hire anyone and that SARS and the Iraq war didnt help this year, it's the way the whole recruitment was handled this year.. I expected more professionalism from one of the leading GA companies in OZ, and that is I believe the General's fault/achievement.

I got out in June and landed a charter job in a single only a couple of weeks after my departure... and so did most of the people who left KNX before or after me. Young pilots who are doing their training DO NOT have any idea what will happen to them to get their first job... If anybody wants my advice, I will be the first person trying to talk them out of going to KNX, there are better places around such as Alice, Katherine, Oenpelli, Gove, Groote Eyland and the west coast of WA,... with less competition.

Europilot

Is this a wind up?

No one owes you anything because you have a licence and a uni degree.

You're not the first pilot to not get a call. Companies like this get dozens of calls, resumes and walk ins every day. Just because you met the bloke doesn't mean that your a special person, no matter what you might dream lying in bed.


The paragraph that really brands you an over indulged, pathetic, egotistical and short minded brat, who though barely out of flying school looks down on all;

Well you have just exposed your LACK of knowledge, experience and intelligence. You're a threat to no one.

Good luck. You’ll need it.

Europilot again you are wrong I am a 220 hour pilot and never made it to KNX this year but a friend of mine did and got a start with Slingair and he only had 205 hours and yesssss he tells me that the general employed 8 pilots this year hours ranging fron 205 - 350.
He also tells me that the training and checking within the company is to very high standard he tells me if you are preparing for a line check you had better do your homework.

So maybe you should check your facts before you critisize a highly respected company.

From my three years in Kunnas, I came to learn that the operators pick personality, learnability and preparation. I saw soooo many pilots come up with absolutely zip preparation and demanded a job... needless to say they still didnt have one by the end of their stay.

As the saying goes, shake a tree.... the operators pick the best for business at the time. If it works out for the operator and the pilot great, if not, it occasionally gets expensive for both the pocket and the reputation. Hours ranged that year for a start at 400-500 hours average, sometimes a little less. In the scheme of things 200 hours is a mere drop in the pond with so much more to learn and places like this are great for doing so with varied conditions, remote but not too remote, and a great support network from everyone involved up there. It is acknowleged however that a lack of experience can and does bring people undone.

I had a ball there, learned heaps, made friends, and found my aviation feet so to speak, but the following was observed; agro. arrogance and bloodyminded mudslinging gets little attention. Tourists and Kununurra are not for everyone. Maybe the CP's can see something that you cannot, or refuse to see. Accept that its time to either reassess, try another avenue or do an attitude check.

For anyone heading anywhere in life you have to plan prepare preview review.... this applies to aviation careers also. I suggest research on the company(ies), have maps, charts, relevant documentation, appropriate wear and leave your opinion in the car with the mobile. There is nothing worse than doing an interview and the chaps(esses) phone rings....

airstream.

You poor misguided fool. I'm not out of work, and get treated rather well. I think the award for GA pilots is a bit of a joke, but thats not my employeers problem.....and I am treated withing the guidlines that the award provides, which is more than what I can say for Slingair pilots.

I have never worked for a KU based company (thank goodness), but know enough guys that have to know what goes on up there.

I was mearly pointing out that a ground loop, wheels up, total plane wreck and who knows what else that has happened this year would mean that the standard had droped this year. If your suggesting that this dosen't indicate a drop in standard then I'd have to say the standard isn't very good then, is it?

Slingair simply have to lift their game. That is not a winge...just a fact.

As for my mummy and daddy paying for another career for me.....what was the first one they paid for??? And by the way, I've got a few to many hours to give the flying thing away...but thanks for your concern:ok:

Raingauge Raingauge !!!!!!!!!

Lets look at the facts do you really know how and why the accidents happened or do you automatically blame the T&C system within an organization.

Again its little S$#TS like you who always assume and know best !!!!!!!

Also are you telling me that you have never had a incident during your very short flying career and if you have did you straight away blame your company C&T or just maybe your company doesn't have a C&T system in place.

As for the pay pilots get within Slingair I do believe they get the award so there you go again shooting your little low life mouth again just like I see you do to other companies when there is an incident you seem to know the facts before the actual company concerned does.

I will give you some good advise talk sense on PPrune and stop bagging various companies about what you assume.

I think you like throwing large rocks in glass houses.

Europilot,
Whilst I agree with most of your observations regarding KNX, ease up on the locals.
If you pigeon hole them as a pack of un-educated, Perth failures, it just shows how few of them you got to know. Next time you sneer at the "working class", try fixing your own septic system. There are people in town who earn far more and own more city real estate than you ever will, just because they spotted a market that happened to be in KNX.
If you consider that you have an excess of knowledge and experience as a 200 hr, mid 20's CPL then you are dreaming.
Do you understand why locals avoid the pubs in season? Because they're full of large mobs of shiny CPL's fresh from the city, full of beer and bad manners. Take a look at it from their perspective, a pilot licence doesn't make you a better human being than them. How many locals did you ever have a beer with?
As for having few excitements, an hour of two wheel driving will take you to many beautiful spots locally. Open you eyes, open you mind.
As for the General, he battles on, learning like the rest of us.
You wont be missed, dozens like you pass through every year.

exmexican,

I didnt make myself clear... I am happy for the handful who came 20-30 years ago and now own half of KNX... they did well and certainly know what they are/were doing... I was refering to the people who got their over the last couple of years...and think that they will make the great living... I met plenty of them...and I was warned before I got there...

Now I am in a REAL country town with REAL country people, not "country people wannabees"... and I am enjoying it and having beers with them...

In regards to "excess knowledge" I was talking about non-aviation stuff, as a 200hrs cpl guy I know nothing about flying and I am aware of that... but in other fields such as building, pizza-making, IT, marketing... a couple of mid/late 20 year old pilots might have some knowledge which could benefit and improve a local's bussiness... but unfortunately the locals in KNX dont like that...

Kunners Class of 2003
 

I was another bloke that got there pants pulled down this year at kunners and can totally understand how a few pilots on this thread feel.

I was also surprised to observe the lack of professionalism that this well respected company showed...(with regards to interviews)

If you are booked in for an interview and travel 3000km for the sole purpose. Cop a call The night before on your phone that says "thanks for coming up but no thanks" << not even from the man himself but that cute little secretary :)
It’s quite easy to get fired up. But yeah I know Its GA!!! Comes with the job.

As europilot said, there were some good times and good people waiting for work living in an illegal modified cold room. A list of contacts from my time there is already proving handy.

F*&k Matrix 3 is out and im 1000k away from a cinema, :)

g'day

:8 You are a big bunch of complaining idiots.

Who cares if 4000 pilots come through knx every year and 3998 get the ****s and leave. At least we get to pick the best out of whats left and also know who has the heart to stay on and battle it out over the season. They are the pilots that really want the job, not the ones that turn up and stay for 3 months, demand a job and then piss off because they have the s$#@. I think you all need to grow up a little bit and stop thinking that the aviation industry owes you...................

wcm

airstream,
What is your 205 hour mate comparing it to? His flying school?? :confused:
All the pilots I know that have gone through sling have left with good hours in the log book, but no commercial sense whatsoever. Their C&T might look good on paper, but pose a practical operational scenario to them and they have no idea.

bunch of sissys complaining
pretty easy to slag off a big group of people that have passed through those doors over the last twenty years grrowler.
:ouch:

i haven't met em all, but i've met enough to know that your way off grrowler

anyways its snowing.

Airstream.

Do I know the facts....yes.

Am I a little $H!T......no.

Has my carrer been "very short"....I've seen alot shorter.

Wasn't talking about Slingair pay....don't know and don't care what they pay their pilots.....what I do know is they do a damn lot more than what CAO 48 or any dispo allows them to.

Thanks for all your great advice, but I don't live in a glass house, and will throw what ever I like!

Maybe when you get out of your little bubble up there, or someone pops it for you you'll see that what I am saying is true, and that is that Slingair haven't had the best year....thats all. They are the facts....hope you don't mind them too much:ok:

airstream,
I'd have to side with raingauge on this. I think if you ask any of the pilots in the Kimberley I think all would tell you that Broome Av, Golden Eagle, Geikie, Alligator, whatever's in Wynumn these days, KLP, Polar, are all much more desirable destinations than slingair. I've had too many friends screwed by the place to put a recommendation in for it.

Airstream(or should i say yes man)

I payed for my own training and are working so your little insults are a joke. Ever thought that some of these comments are coming from people still in KNX that know a Tosser when they see one

Cheers you sad little man

Roach Man a little testyyyyyy arn't we

Have you had a chance to meet the tosser in Knx, just maybe he might be a nice guy or are you comparing yourself as a tosser and automatically think everyone is a tosser like yourself.

Your name says it all roach so watch out no one steps on you.

I think enough is enough lets stop having our little gripes and end this subject about KNX. Im sure everyone has had there little gripe.

How about leaving Slingair alone does anybody think that maybe the company used to treat its pilots bad, and maybe things have now changed for the better this includes CAO 48 and pay ect ect everybody seems to be judging Slingair on how it used to operate and not on how it operates today.

Why don't current pilots with Slingair comment.

Ski Guru,

Just going off the pilots I know mate, I think I said that in my post.

I'm sure there are stacks of great pilots to have come through there, I'm just saying I don't think they would have picked up their commercial sense from sling.
Again, going off what I have experienced they seem to operate their aircraft without knowing, or even questioning why they are doing things.

Airstream

I don't know which part of my post was testy. Yes i agree lets get comments from those working or have worked for the general and his little lap dog Airstream. Ever thought that some of them may have already made comments i think it is time to pull your head from your a$$ and have a look around

Mate, you can bet ya bottom dollar that at least one is. ;)
Aint that right General???? and while I'm addressing you, General,
Have ya had a yarn with ya mates in perth lately? Made up any good yarns coz you just havn't got a clue lately????

waynoscheckman == Wayno ?????????


:=

jees,

I left KU about 3 years ago and if this is the current attitude to all the companies ,things have really fallen.

What a shame it used to be a really good spot for new pilots,there were a good bunch of pilots when I was there,and some of the CP'S weren't too bad either.

Hey MAXX! wondered when you would show up! I tend to agree with you. Did a trip back this year with the folks just to show it off and AA was very much the enjoyable place it was. Pizza, nibbles and drinks on a Friday still happily going on. Was great place and good folks there.

northern chique,
from what i am hearing along the grape vine from reliable sources(one thats sitting next to me as i type this)is that things are nowhere near as good as they were going back a few years ago.

a real shame to see a good training ground go to rack and ruin.

lips shut for a little now boys.......might be a good idea!

Such a shame if thats the case. Took a trip over to Kunnas in June. Seemed like the tourists had better places to be so the numbers were down a bit perhaps but caught up with some old faces who seemed to saying the same things.... such a shame...

Mmm?
 

To all of you out there who seem to have a problem with GA in Knx.........build a bridge and get over it you bunch of low time, shoulders shine to bright, two bar slags. I have been in the game now approx 6 years and whilst I have had to battle my way up in the game, I have realised that's all it is. WA is a large place my friends but when it comes to you guy's it's very very small, so why don't you P:) ss of back to where you came from and leave the JT generals alone. I am a proud JTG and find it funny that anyone would ridicule a place rather than a particular company. You guys have real issues and half of you don't know what your on about anyway. Get a life or get out or in my case Fu:mad: off because I wouldn't give you a job............and we all know who your names are really, don't we????

Kissy kissy

vapour x