Looking For Cross Hire Pa32 \ C210
I don't want to be the best pilot in the world - Just the oldest
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Here and there
Posts: 1,013
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
LHRT,
For a 210 it might be worth giving Flentri Aviation a call.
http://www.flentri-aviation.com
cheers
For a 210 it might be worth giving Flentri Aviation a call.
http://www.flentri-aviation.com
cheers
If you're getting one of Flentri's, make sure the person delivering it knows what he's doing and can find a phone if he has to!
TL
TL
I don't want to be the best pilot in the world - Just the oldest
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Here and there
Posts: 1,013
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Aw c'mon Wiz, whad'ya tryin to say mate? See ya when I get back to Perth.
Hey TL, how's the 'Crack'? Still have fond memories of my little sojourn up there late last year zigazgging across the the Kimberley, Pilbara and Gascoyne. Yup no shortage of desperados looking for 210 time who will ferry one of Flentri's 210s anywhere in Australia for free. No outback experience or commonsense required!
Hey TL, how's the 'Crack'? Still have fond memories of my little sojourn up there late last year zigazgging across the the Kimberley, Pilbara and Gascoyne. Yup no shortage of desperados looking for 210 time who will ferry one of Flentri's 210s anywhere in Australia for free. No outback experience or commonsense required!
From memory SMC went your way (CNS) about this time last year. Is that one still about over there? It was reasonably neat when I used to fly it, leather interior, window vents and all.
LHRT, I thought EDE was still in the Kimberley?
I might also add that if you are going to get one of Jaap's a/c, then get the kid (or whoever ferries it), to stick to the agreed date to deliver the a/c to you, and only with the equipment that they say is part of the a/c. Once bitten, twice shy.
Hey Wiz, you guys referring "S" from Nap's home port? Man, did he so easily talk himself out of a job.
LHRT, I thought EDE was still in the Kimberley?
I might also add that if you are going to get one of Jaap's a/c, then get the kid (or whoever ferries it), to stick to the agreed date to deliver the a/c to you, and only with the equipment that they say is part of the a/c. Once bitten, twice shy.
Hey Wiz, you guys referring "S" from Nap's home port? Man, did he so easily talk himself out of a job.
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Opsnormal
"S" is actually a first class driver and would recommend to anybody.
You pay the `kid' ferrying it and it may show up on time.
You control the weather and there may not be a delay.
You get the companies that start out with the equipment that come with the aircraft to sort it out rather than the driver.
A.S.
"S" is actually a first class driver and would recommend to anybody.
You pay the `kid' ferrying it and it may show up on time.
You control the weather and there may not be a delay.
You get the companies that start out with the equipment that come with the aircraft to sort it out rather than the driver.
A.S.
Bugsmasherdriverandjediknite
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Bai, mi go long hap na kisim sampla samting.
Posts: 2,849
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
They got the wings back on DOB yet? good old bus that one, I did my first commercial 210 flight in that old bucket.... she was a bit slow though. I wasnt "s" that I was refering too, dunno how he flys but I think he is a tryer, seems like a nice fulla, just a bit young...... He'll do alright I think.
Hey AS, I thought pilots could do anything, godlike as we are, shoulda just ordered good weather like I do.
Hey AS, I thought pilots could do anything, godlike as we are, shoulda just ordered good weather like I do.
AS, I made no inference or commentas to his ability at all, just that when my old company was told a date, and then to get a phone call that the previous x-hirer/user needed the aircraft for just one last charter.... it caused my boss at the time quite a problem as there was a heap of work for it.
When the aircraft left Alice last year it had everything that was requested to be in it, in it (some of it actually belonged to my employer at the time). We were actually able to polish all of the brown grime off too. Nevertheless, that's ancient history now, have a good one.
OpsN.
When the aircraft left Alice last year it had everything that was requested to be in it, in it (some of it actually belonged to my employer at the time). We were actually able to polish all of the brown grime off too. Nevertheless, that's ancient history now, have a good one.
OpsN.
Join Date: May 2003
Location: PH 298/7.4DME
Posts: 554
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OpsNormal,
Yes, it is ancient history now indeed.
However, let it be known that most companies cross hiring Jaap's aircraft do not keep them clean or maintain them to the same standard as if they owned them themselves. I've only come across two companies who do, of which none are based where your old company is.
AS makes some good points also. It was obviously easier to get going in GA in your time than what it is now. Do you think these "desperados" WANT to fly for free? No, but if no one is willing to employ them cause they're "too young", which way do they go to get started? Advise...
You have a good one too.
520.
Yes, it is ancient history now indeed.
However, let it be known that most companies cross hiring Jaap's aircraft do not keep them clean or maintain them to the same standard as if they owned them themselves. I've only come across two companies who do, of which none are based where your old company is.
AS makes some good points also. It was obviously easier to get going in GA in your time than what it is now. Do you think these "desperados" WANT to fly for free? No, but if no one is willing to employ them cause they're "too young", which way do they go to get started? Advise...
You have a good one too.
520.
520, I appreciate your point, and respect your position. When you wrote:
Quite the contrary, nothing has changed, for believe me when I say that it hasn't really been all that long. The word I used "kid", was obviously inappropriate, perhaps when I look back at myself at that age, when I had a trade already behind me as a vehicle mechanic. What if I also told you that on this date last year I had less than 400 hours TT?
Is my story anything special? No, it is not. There are hundreds of guys and girls who have done it much tougher than I, and yet we have all heard about the fairy story about the odd person who just seems to keep excelling past all of his/her peers during that dream run to an airline.
(my bold)
Well who used to wash, polish and vaccuum the aircraft that I used to fly? That'd be me, and my other ex-workmates. I've flown three of Jaap's a/c and have polished all three at differeing times. Still want to hold with that allegation?, coz now you see that looks almost like you'd be calling someone a liar....
Oh, and the maintainence....... anything that had to fixed, WAS FIXED,and the decision whether or not to get the sqwarks fixed went back to the owner. Get you facts straight pal, and do not try spreading bollocks like that....
Ed to remove sensitive info. - OpsN
...It was obviously easier to get going in GA in your time than what it is now....
Is my story anything special? No, it is not. There are hundreds of guys and girls who have done it much tougher than I, and yet we have all heard about the fairy story about the odd person who just seems to keep excelling past all of his/her peers during that dream run to an airline.
However, let it be known that most companies cross hiring Jaap's aircraft do not keep them clean or maintain them to the same standard as if they owned them themselves. I've only come across two companies who do, of which none are based where your old company is.
Well who used to wash, polish and vaccuum the aircraft that I used to fly? That'd be me, and my other ex-workmates. I've flown three of Jaap's a/c and have polished all three at differeing times. Still want to hold with that allegation?, coz now you see that looks almost like you'd be calling someone a liar....
Oh, and the maintainence....... anything that had to fixed, WAS FIXED,and the decision whether or not to get the sqwarks fixed went back to the owner. Get you facts straight pal, and do not try spreading bollocks like that....
Ed to remove sensitive info. - OpsN
Last edited by OpsNormal; 2nd May 2003 at 21:01.
Join Date: May 2003
Location: PH 298/7.4DME
Posts: 554
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OpsNormal,
Yes, you're right. It becomes clear by what you say that there are many out there doing it tougher than you had to. Me too, in fact, and all I wanted to say is that one should never display disrespect to those who are trying to get somewhere with what is an apparent disadvantage. In this case, being "too young" would be it. Funny, one would think it was an advantage.
I appreciate what you say regarding having one's facts straight. And indeed I think I do. Yes, I would like to hold with that allegation. My old company received an aircraft of Jaap's which had been used by your old company immediately prior, and it was *FAR* from clean. Now, do not misinterprete me. I never suggested you personally were neglecting the aircraft. Just the company on the whole.
Just chill, yeah?
520.
Yes, you're right. It becomes clear by what you say that there are many out there doing it tougher than you had to. Me too, in fact, and all I wanted to say is that one should never display disrespect to those who are trying to get somewhere with what is an apparent disadvantage. In this case, being "too young" would be it. Funny, one would think it was an advantage.
I appreciate what you say regarding having one's facts straight. And indeed I think I do. Yes, I would like to hold with that allegation. My old company received an aircraft of Jaap's which had been used by your old company immediately prior, and it was *FAR* from clean. Now, do not misinterprete me. I never suggested you personally were neglecting the aircraft. Just the company on the whole.
Just chill, yeah?
520.
Yeah 520, I can hear where you are coming from wrt the a/c and the company, in that much consider myself chilled. But as far as me not having to do it as tough as anyone else in the past, well guess again.
This isn't a shot at you 520, or indeed anyone else when you say "Geez mate, you've got it easy", but just spare a thought.....
Have you ever had a 5 hour round trip each day to go to your "weekends only" flying job paying about $10.00/hr flying time on average (making for at times an 18hr day for $50.00)?
Have you ever had someone else write off the only aircraft that the operator has, when you've only just got your first real job with 300hrs after paying $$$$ for the design feature endo?
Have you ever had to leave a woman you are very much in love with and intending to marry (engaged to), behind at home, sell everything you own, including the car, pack everything remaining into a few bags and go north to a town almost 4000km away that also was the target of almost the entire new CPL brigade at the same time?
Have you passed your checkride, accidentaly mentioned that you also have other maintainence quals, and then been used for that with no mention when your turn to get to go flying, when watching the CP put on up to a dozen others to do the job you've been working towards for the past 6 years, while all the time being told "you're too valuable to us in the hangar"? All while the owner of the company was being told something else again to what the CP was telling me.
Have you ever gotten so depressed because of that sort of "user" and "liar" mentality that seems to abound in the industry, you're earning nothing, you've got no more money to your name, loan repayments overdue, rent to pay, rego and insurance due all at the one time, and also so isolated across the country away from everyone and everything you know and love that a "another" way out is considered as the logical next step to aleviate the problem?
How many times have you almost cried yourself to sleep at night because you felt so alone persuing your dream?
How many sleepless nights have you endured because some knob of a CP thinks that it is funny to keep you hanging while he strings you along?
Have you experienced the highs of a bloke who doesn't know you from a bar of soap saying to you on the phone "how quick can you get there?" to go and set-up a viable small aviation business for him in a relatively remote area in the middle of the country?
Did it ever cost you your $1000.00 bond (never to be seen again), just to move and take-up that position, when you really couldn't afford to do that?
Do you know what it feels like to feel endebted to that bloke for setting you up to work with some of the best other guys the industry has to offer? Have you also felt so elated that your immediate boss has got a start with a dream airline, while at the same time you're gonna miss him b*ggery because he also grew into being a mate.
How much pain do you go through every time you watch your one true love of your life walk back down an airbridge to board an a/c to take her away from you after a fleeting quick two week visit? Or even experienced the heaviest of heavy feet taking you down that walk?
How many times have you said "f**k it all, I've had enough"?, but got up the very next morning and went back to work to keep trying to "crack it".
How many times have you become so humbled you could hardly speak to the person handing you something like a few $$, or paying for something for you to try and help you out?
Have you ever applied to normal (non aviation) employers for some of the most menial of positions when you NEED to have food on the table and rent to pay with that second job, only to be told you are "way to overqualified for this position". Hmmm?
Have you ever had to say "Thanks, but no thanks" to guaranteed twin job with your current employer because you were in dire financial straights, and had been offered the chance of full-time $$ with another operator, but still flying singles? How hard do you think that one was to turn away at the bloke who believed in me enough to give me a start?
Have you ever gone and spent $1000 on a certain model twin endorsement, at the request of your employer, only to see that aircraft leave the airport never to return a couple of weeks after you arrived back from the east coast, without ever flying it?
How many times have you.......... sunshine, I could go on and on.
Do I know what it is like to fail? No, the word isn't in my vocabulary. Nor should it be in any future pilot's vocab. I've seen guys give-up, I've seen guys get some sanity for a while and come back harder than ever, I'm even watching one guy who I am yet to meet do that very thing. He had given it a go up north for about three years, and is now getting on with his life for a while and re-grouping for his next attempt, which will bear fruit if I can certainly help it.
Have you gotten off your butt, registered a nick here like "The Goss" or similar and tried your best to gather the info so many guys and girls need to to help them crack that first job? I did, what about you? I didn't/don't ask anything for it, nor seek recognition. Why did I do it? To try and help other people. I dare you to do the same, and if you have the intestinal fortitude, you will.
What does get up my nose is the preciousness and attitude some of you have that you have that white-anting, sniggering and backstabbing is quite acceptable as long as it doesn't affect you. Your words 520, are perilously close to that from what I can gather. Fortunately, as yet I've not had to work in this industry with any of them just yet, but I've met plenty of them.
My story isn't remarkable, or indeed anything more outstanding than most, not by a long shot - and I am certainly not making big of my life experience in this industry, but it is my best effort to try and put into words the battle everyone faces at one time or another. Obviously 520, you believe you must have had it harder than most, go believe what you want, I'm not entirely sure of just what your motives are, apart from sh!tstirring, but I don't feel I need to justify my words, or indeed existance to you. I also think I've done my stint in hell thanks, and I ain't yet outta the hole yet .... but I'm digging.
This isn't a shot at you 520, or indeed anyone else when you say "Geez mate, you've got it easy", but just spare a thought.....
Have you ever had a 5 hour round trip each day to go to your "weekends only" flying job paying about $10.00/hr flying time on average (making for at times an 18hr day for $50.00)?
Have you ever had someone else write off the only aircraft that the operator has, when you've only just got your first real job with 300hrs after paying $$$$ for the design feature endo?
Have you ever had to leave a woman you are very much in love with and intending to marry (engaged to), behind at home, sell everything you own, including the car, pack everything remaining into a few bags and go north to a town almost 4000km away that also was the target of almost the entire new CPL brigade at the same time?
Have you passed your checkride, accidentaly mentioned that you also have other maintainence quals, and then been used for that with no mention when your turn to get to go flying, when watching the CP put on up to a dozen others to do the job you've been working towards for the past 6 years, while all the time being told "you're too valuable to us in the hangar"? All while the owner of the company was being told something else again to what the CP was telling me.
Have you ever gotten so depressed because of that sort of "user" and "liar" mentality that seems to abound in the industry, you're earning nothing, you've got no more money to your name, loan repayments overdue, rent to pay, rego and insurance due all at the one time, and also so isolated across the country away from everyone and everything you know and love that a "another" way out is considered as the logical next step to aleviate the problem?
How many times have you almost cried yourself to sleep at night because you felt so alone persuing your dream?
How many sleepless nights have you endured because some knob of a CP thinks that it is funny to keep you hanging while he strings you along?
Have you experienced the highs of a bloke who doesn't know you from a bar of soap saying to you on the phone "how quick can you get there?" to go and set-up a viable small aviation business for him in a relatively remote area in the middle of the country?
Did it ever cost you your $1000.00 bond (never to be seen again), just to move and take-up that position, when you really couldn't afford to do that?
Do you know what it feels like to feel endebted to that bloke for setting you up to work with some of the best other guys the industry has to offer? Have you also felt so elated that your immediate boss has got a start with a dream airline, while at the same time you're gonna miss him b*ggery because he also grew into being a mate.
How much pain do you go through every time you watch your one true love of your life walk back down an airbridge to board an a/c to take her away from you after a fleeting quick two week visit? Or even experienced the heaviest of heavy feet taking you down that walk?
How many times have you said "f**k it all, I've had enough"?, but got up the very next morning and went back to work to keep trying to "crack it".
How many times have you become so humbled you could hardly speak to the person handing you something like a few $$, or paying for something for you to try and help you out?
Have you ever applied to normal (non aviation) employers for some of the most menial of positions when you NEED to have food on the table and rent to pay with that second job, only to be told you are "way to overqualified for this position". Hmmm?
Have you ever had to say "Thanks, but no thanks" to guaranteed twin job with your current employer because you were in dire financial straights, and had been offered the chance of full-time $$ with another operator, but still flying singles? How hard do you think that one was to turn away at the bloke who believed in me enough to give me a start?
Have you ever gone and spent $1000 on a certain model twin endorsement, at the request of your employer, only to see that aircraft leave the airport never to return a couple of weeks after you arrived back from the east coast, without ever flying it?
How many times have you.......... sunshine, I could go on and on.
Do I know what it is like to fail? No, the word isn't in my vocabulary. Nor should it be in any future pilot's vocab. I've seen guys give-up, I've seen guys get some sanity for a while and come back harder than ever, I'm even watching one guy who I am yet to meet do that very thing. He had given it a go up north for about three years, and is now getting on with his life for a while and re-grouping for his next attempt, which will bear fruit if I can certainly help it.
Have you gotten off your butt, registered a nick here like "The Goss" or similar and tried your best to gather the info so many guys and girls need to to help them crack that first job? I did, what about you? I didn't/don't ask anything for it, nor seek recognition. Why did I do it? To try and help other people. I dare you to do the same, and if you have the intestinal fortitude, you will.
What does get up my nose is the preciousness and attitude some of you have that you have that white-anting, sniggering and backstabbing is quite acceptable as long as it doesn't affect you. Your words 520, are perilously close to that from what I can gather. Fortunately, as yet I've not had to work in this industry with any of them just yet, but I've met plenty of them.
My story isn't remarkable, or indeed anything more outstanding than most, not by a long shot - and I am certainly not making big of my life experience in this industry, but it is my best effort to try and put into words the battle everyone faces at one time or another. Obviously 520, you believe you must have had it harder than most, go believe what you want, I'm not entirely sure of just what your motives are, apart from sh!tstirring, but I don't feel I need to justify my words, or indeed existance to you. I also think I've done my stint in hell thanks, and I ain't yet outta the hole yet .... but I'm digging.
Last edited by OpsNormal; 3rd May 2003 at 16:35.
Join Date: May 2003
Location: PH 298/7.4DME
Posts: 554
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OpsNormal,
For someone who has supposedly been through all of that, the last thing I would expect from them is some of what is contained in your previous posts.
Yes, I can in fact relate to a fair bit of what you've put down. I've been strung along by a Chief Pilot here and there too. Promised work, travelled 2300km from my home to a place with no friends, family or even contacts only to find that those who made promises couldn't keep them.
Spent $10K getting "minimum time on type" for a range of companies who weren't going to employ me anyway, despite saying that they most likely would if I were based where they were, or in the case of another, that they definitely would. What these companies/Chief Pilots achieve by doing this is beyond me, and probably will be forever. Although, perhaps it was stupid of me not to realise that no one is ever going to give someone else a job over the phone.
Aside from that, the falling in love and being detached bit I can't relate to, but I can imagine it has the potential to really hurt ya.
I never thought I'd see the day where I was told I couldn't be employed to fly a C210 because I couldn't drive a mini bus. That's right. I had to have an F Class drivers licence to work for a particular company. The F Class entitles one to legally drive pax around in a mini bus on a paid basis. The Chief Pilot said I could be employed on the basis of my flying qualifications, but couldn't because I didn't hold an F Class drivers licence, which I had to be 21 to get, and I was 18 at the time. This, along with many other things as you know, are VERY demoralising, discouraging and offputting. I guess our persistence is symbolic of pursuing our love of aviation and our dreams.
Similarly, I've had to go to the place I worked (which was a restaurant, luckily) and beg my employer to be fed that day cause my aviation job did not generate sufficient income even for that, let alone rent, etc.
Personally, I condone such acts of backstabbing, white anting, etc, but I found some of your comments above of the same effect, and they weren't even directed at me.
From what you say, you've covered a bit more ground than I have. By the same token, I would also suggest that you're closer to the end of the tunnel than I am, so far as pursuing the big dream goes.
520.
For someone who has supposedly been through all of that, the last thing I would expect from them is some of what is contained in your previous posts.
Yes, I can in fact relate to a fair bit of what you've put down. I've been strung along by a Chief Pilot here and there too. Promised work, travelled 2300km from my home to a place with no friends, family or even contacts only to find that those who made promises couldn't keep them.
Spent $10K getting "minimum time on type" for a range of companies who weren't going to employ me anyway, despite saying that they most likely would if I were based where they were, or in the case of another, that they definitely would. What these companies/Chief Pilots achieve by doing this is beyond me, and probably will be forever. Although, perhaps it was stupid of me not to realise that no one is ever going to give someone else a job over the phone.
Aside from that, the falling in love and being detached bit I can't relate to, but I can imagine it has the potential to really hurt ya.
I never thought I'd see the day where I was told I couldn't be employed to fly a C210 because I couldn't drive a mini bus. That's right. I had to have an F Class drivers licence to work for a particular company. The F Class entitles one to legally drive pax around in a mini bus on a paid basis. The Chief Pilot said I could be employed on the basis of my flying qualifications, but couldn't because I didn't hold an F Class drivers licence, which I had to be 21 to get, and I was 18 at the time. This, along with many other things as you know, are VERY demoralising, discouraging and offputting. I guess our persistence is symbolic of pursuing our love of aviation and our dreams.
Similarly, I've had to go to the place I worked (which was a restaurant, luckily) and beg my employer to be fed that day cause my aviation job did not generate sufficient income even for that, let alone rent, etc.
Personally, I condone such acts of backstabbing, white anting, etc, but I found some of your comments above of the same effect, and they weren't even directed at me.
From what you say, you've covered a bit more ground than I have. By the same token, I would also suggest that you're closer to the end of the tunnel than I am, so far as pursuing the big dream goes.
520.
Bugsmasherdriverandjediknite
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Bai, mi go long hap na kisim sampla samting.
Posts: 2,849
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I bin bloody busy. The pommy pranger.....oops, I forgot the st in prangster, dropped in here yesterday and picked me up so I could take the old darling home with me. Cause he's a bit stingy with the fuel, she was really light and we got there pronto...... not fast enough according to him though, he couldnt wait to get on the ground. 