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AirMed PA-31 VH-HJE down south of Archerfield

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AirMed PA-31 VH-HJE down south of Archerfield

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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:06
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 43Inches
In this case I think it would of had to have some other contributing factor. At such weight after long fuel burn and a single POB it would have to have some serious other drag to prevent it from flying. Considering the issue seems to have started some 10-15 minutes prior to the landing there should have been some radio communication. Apart from the few well known cases where PA31 have failed to perform on one engine there are also many others that have successfully flown on and landed without incident. I've personally had to land one with a feathered prop and it flew fine at medium load, I wouldn't want to test one at max weight on a hot day though...
For initial certification all that was needed for most light twins was to demonstrate a one degree climb gradient at 5,000' PA at ISA with critical engine feathered and at AUW.. Always achieved by test pilot in brand new aircraft after many practice sessions. Having said that some light twins did it easily, others not so much.

If this is a case of fuel exhaustion its unforgivable.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:07
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Originally Posted by Icarus2001
Flight radar or whatever you used simply is not accurate enough to draw conclusions about which side of blue line the aircraft was operating.
There are rather a lot of data points around that portion of the flight, not surprising given its proximity to civilisation by then. I very much suspect that recorded speed will prove to be within a poofteeth of reality.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:24
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Checking the fuel issue can be a easy deal.

if she’s shut down an engine why are pilots reluctant to declare an emergency?
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:32
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Originally Posted by 43Inches
You can see into the back of the aircraft in a few of the scene pictures. It looks pretty empty in the back, unless of course somebody quickly removed evidence, but I doubt that would have been possible in the time available. Although the blue boxes in some of the pictures near the rear of the aircraft may have been the load, so maybe removed for some reason.

* They must have removed the load to get the pilot out looking at the scene, looks like no crew door or too damaged to open. Still eightish eskies would still only get you to mid weight of that size unless they are carrying lead weights or something, otherwise loading them would be a trial in itself if they were much more than 50kg each.
Those blue eskies are what they use for pathology sample transport and are fairly light, maybe 15Kg each.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:33
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Solid effort getting her on the ground and walking away. Nice job indeed!
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:43
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Had bladders suck up occasional giving false indications.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:46
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Originally Posted by KAPAC
Had bladders suck up occasional giving false indications.
Hence the 3% check.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 05:57
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Collapsed bladder - Back in the day VH CAR (I think?) turbo charged Aztec just north of Cairns, at night! Dead stick into the water everyone swam away. V nice work on that occasion.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 06:06
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For initial certification all that was needed for most light twins was to demonstrate a one degree climb gradient at 5,000' PA at ISA with critical engine feathered and at AUW.. Always achieved by test pilot in brand new aircraft after many practice sessions. Having said that some light twins did it easily, others not so much.
The PA-31 series outstrip this requirement easily if loaded at light to mid weights. Again notwithstanding poorly maintained aircraft or pilots with poor technique, even the 40 year old machines will still perform if kept within limits. The only issue is close to max weight (or above) in low density/hot conditions.

No aircraft type will perform under the right circumstance of poor maintenance/poor technique or multiple failures involving damage. Atlantic Southeast Airlines Flight 529 is a good example of a transport category aircraft engine failure that led to a situation that the aircraft could not maintain altitude.

As for fuel bladder issues, this should be pretty easily covered by proper maintenance and disciplined fuel checks and records.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 06:23
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Originally Posted by Alice Kiwican
Well that’ll save an investigation
your welcome
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 06:33
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Originally Posted by triathlon
It ran out of fuel

Or maybe a tank or two ran out of fuel.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 07:17
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If this is a case of fuel exhaustion its unforgivable.
​​​​​​​Will be recruited to Qantas within months, ticks all the boxes.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 07:29
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Originally Posted by 43Inches
You can see into the back of the aircraft in a few of the scene pictures. It looks pretty empty in the back, unless of course somebody quickly removed evidence, but I doubt that would have been possible in the time available. Although the blue boxes in some of the pictures near the rear of the aircraft may have been the load, so maybe removed for some reason.

* They must have removed the load to get the pilot out looking at the scene, looks like no crew door or too damaged to open. Still eightish eskies would still only get you to mid weight of that size unless they are carrying lead weights or something, otherwise loading them would be a trial in itself if they were much more than 50kg each.
The AirMed Chieftains are all gutted inside. Looking forward from the air stair, there is usually a crane in the aft luggage space, a stretcher on the right, two seats on the left in club config, two seats forward behind the cockpit. If they’re running samples interstate, they may have removed the stretcher. HJE has a crew door so a possible egress route in this case.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 07:55
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Why is this thread in an airline forum?
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 08:01
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Originally Posted by Mach E Avelli
GT & BB move over. Channel 7 have their own aviation expert reporter now.
Moo-ney?
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 08:04
  #36 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Iron Bar
Collapsed bladder - Back in the day VH CAR (I think?) turbo charged Aztec just north of Cairns, at night! Dead stick into the water everyone swam away. V nice work on that occasion.
That was a nice TC Aztec. Apparently not waterproof
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 08:06
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Originally Posted by triathlon
your welcome
A betting person would say you’re on the money. Hard to think of anything else which would cause a double engine failure (as reported by Chanel 7 ) at the end of a flight.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 08:33
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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I very much suspect that recorded speed will prove to be within a poofteeth of reality.
​​​​​​​What speed would that be then? GS, IAS, CAS, ?
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 08:34
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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Was CAR ever found and pulled from the water to prove a bladder collapse ?. My memory says not.
Had passed Cooktown where fuel was available.
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Old 7th Apr 2023, 09:32
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Originally Posted by Icarus2001
What speed would that be then? GS, IAS, CAS, ?
Are you going to persist in picking the fly **** out of the pepper? The various tracking websites disclose how data is derived and displayed, it's not difficult to find.
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