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Incredibly fantastic UK GA document

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Incredibly fantastic UK GA document

Old 3rd Aug 2021, 02:35
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Incredibly fantastic UK GA document

Have a look at the this document.

Notice the heading “Our Vision – We want the UK to be seen as the best place in the world for aviation”.

Under Contents it says, “The Government’s vision for the GA sector.

Another half-page heading says “We want the UK to be seen as the best place in the world for GA”, and mentions “proportionate risk-based and consistent approach to regulation that delivers high quality safety outcomes.”

This is obviously being driven by the UK leaving the European Union. Also the UK CAA has nothing similar to our wording that their regulator “must regard the safety of air navigation as the most important consideration.”

This is wording from the UK CAA Act:

“… provide air transport services which satisfy… public demand at the lowest charges consistent with a high standard of safety… and an economic return to efficient operators…”
I reckon we all have to get together and make sure that Australia is the best place for general aviation – not the UK, the USA, Canada or anywhere else. Do I have any supporters?

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Old 3rd Aug 2021, 05:05
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Australia is the best place for GA and training,

UNTIL,

You open up the rule book. You then find convoluted ever changing regulations and rules that are a financial nightmare to comply with, and a regulator that does very little to stop those that don't follow the rules, but sits like a beached whale on those that try. Which results in only large flying operators like the big schools surviving, even then only just. Add to that no desire to spend on aviation infrastructure other than possible airline destinations leaving deteriorating council strips with lack of fuel and services.

All of a sudden Botswana starts to look a better option.
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Old 3rd Aug 2021, 06:15
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https://www.caa.co.uk/Our-work/About-us/Our-role/As the UK's aviation regulator we work so that:
  • the aviation industry meets the highest safety standards,
  • consumers have choice, value for money, are protected and treated fairly when they fly,
  • through efficient use of airspace, the environmental impact of aviation on local communities is effectively managed and CO2 emissions are reduced,
  • the aviation industry manages security risks effectively.
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Old 3rd Aug 2021, 06:18
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"We're not happy till you're not happy."
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Old 3rd Aug 2021, 06:20
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and this is what they have done, pre Covid
https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/modalap...detail&id=6692
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Old 3rd Aug 2021, 13:11
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i think you have overlooked all the other Government pronouncements that start . Britain will be the best..............................................insert relevant subject here.. This frequently ends in tears and never happens of course., test and trace being the most recent example , national 'yacht' soon to follow

In a situation like this it demonstrates how ludicrous these claims are , short of closing all major airports and disbanding the RAF it would impossible for any small island with frequent bad weather and extremely limited airspace to ever become the best place in the world for GA . We could never compete with Australia USA Canada France etc purely because there is no room. Had they said , (even though they still wouldnt actually do it) , that Britain will seek to be among the best places in the world for GA in terms of bureaucracy and accessibility it might be possible but thats not a good headline is it.

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Old 3rd Aug 2021, 21:15
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Dick, I’d second what pax b has said above and not take the UK document too literally or expect much of any significance to result from it’s publication.

We’ve seen a trend in umm, funnily enough the last five years or so, of fancy documents containing expressions/mission statements such as “world leading” this or “world beating” that but once the dust has settled and the pollies thoughts have turned to other things……

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Old 4th Aug 2021, 01:53
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proportionate risk-based and consistent approach to regulation that delivers high quality safety outcomes.”

Bingo!

The biggest problem there for GA is the weather!
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Old 6th Aug 2021, 03:23
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Wiggy. You are correct but my post was only half in jest!

But wouldn’t it be great if Aus was to become the world leader in flight training and recreational aviation? With lots of pilots coming from overseas to go on flying safaris here.

Thats what I will be working on. I just have to enthuse those in a place of influence!
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Old 9th Aug 2021, 12:34
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Did lots of pilots ever go anywhere for flying safaris?
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Old 10th Aug 2021, 00:15
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Did lots of pilots ever go anywhere for flying safaris?
Only the wealthy ones. I too would love to see GA made more accessible and cheaper but those days are long gone and no glossy brochure is going to bring them back. When I learnt to fly in the early 80's all I had to do was drive to the airport and after the brief go and pre-flight the aircraft and off we went. As I progressed to an UPPL the VTCs,VFG and VEC's had come in the mail free of charge and I could still just go to the airport, do the brief and pre-flight and launch into freedom's skies. Now its ASICs hi-vis vest and a lot of expense before you even step into the flying school. There is just no way that the clock is going to be turned back to make flying as accessible as it was for me in my 20's.
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Old 10th Aug 2021, 02:09
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I too would love to see GA made more accessible and cheaper but those days are long gone and no glossy brochure is going to bring them back. When I learnt to fly in the early 80's all I had to do was drive to the airport and after the brief go and pre-flight the aircraft and off we went. As I progressed to an UPPL the VTCs,VFG and VEC's had come in the mail free of charge and I could still just go to the airport, do the brief and pre-flight and launch into freedom's skies. Now its ASICs hi-vis vest and a lot of expense before you even step into the flying school. There is just no way that the clock is going to be turned back to make flying as accessible as it was for me in my 20's.
Entirely agree.

I'm a firm believer that flying a light aircraft is no harder than being a good driver. You could go solo in the old days in 5 hours or such, now it seems much more is required. Why bother with all the rigmarole of getting ASIC, background checks, locking planes up with multiple security devices, wearing a hi-vis, can't go airside unless you have a purpose etc etc etc. Add to that the additional costs tacked onto hiring the aircraft and instructor that were never much in the past, landing fees, parking fees, test fees, more test fees, licence fees, medical fees. GAAPs turned into class D with extra procedure and cost. Then you have the stupid rules where if someone comes and crashes on your airfield it's your fault and other liability issues, which shut down access to 2/3rds of all small little strips.

Many are spending the amount that a PPL would cost on a computer to play flight sim, why can't they be brought into the fold and actually learn to fly. Most responses is it's all too hard and too much work, when you show the list of things you have to do before even sitting in the aircraft it's easy to know why. Also what can you do with the licence after it's arrived, GA touring is dieing, with less operators catering to fly ins, why, because there's very little of it.

To PPL level it should be straight forward and easy. And GA and RAA should all be grouped into a recreational/private/training under say 2 or 3 tons MTOW with reduced rules and compliance. I mean seriously why is a Piper Warrior deemed to need more rules than a Jabiru. Just make it similar to cars where you can drive anything up to 3 ton or so. A 3 ton truck is far more dangerous in every aspect of what harm it can do and what bad it can be used for over say a Piper Seneca or Baron. Not saying you don't train for those with ME and IR approvals, but relax medical and say maintenance requirements. Allow private strip owners to just need appropriate warning of use at own risk, and so on.
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Old 27th Aug 2021, 10:08
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There are over 600,000 pilots in the USA and if just one in one hundred came to Australia to partake in a flying safari that’s a lot of extra income for our county towns.

Millions of dollars I would reckon.

In the past when there were Aussie operators like Goanna lots of income came in.

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Old 27th Aug 2021, 23:57
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Dick, one reason why that aint going to happen.
I had an American client tell me "Bud, I don't want to buy the aircraft, just rent it for the day"
There are reasons why you can gain a pilot licence in the US for almost half what it costs in Australia, charter an aircraft 30 to 40 % less than here.
Before the dreaded lurgy descended on us, I believe some flying outfits in NZ were successful offering package flying holidays.
I have a feeling that people hate the sense that they are being ripped off, explaining to them why it is so expensive just doesn't make sense to them.
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Old 28th Aug 2021, 00:21
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I put the first letter of the surname of each in the passing parade of 'Directors' of Aviation 'Safety' into a word 'unscrambler'. With randomly added vowels it came up with:

"Basketcase".

Meanwhile, I see that Ms Spence has now supped a sufficiently deep draught of the CASA Kool Aide to be able to rationalise rather than confront the damage done by the Frankenstein's monster of which she's now supposedly the brain.
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Old 28th Aug 2021, 14:30
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What I’d be interested to learn is whether all those bat shit crazy rules and policies have had any effect in reducing the deaths per million hours or not.

That some people will crash and kill themselves is inevitable. No rule or policy is ever going to cure stupidity or bad luck. More rules won’t ever change that.

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Old 29th Aug 2021, 12:19
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Folks,
In may respects, what we are seeing with Covid "safety" , regardless of cost or common sense, is what Australian aviation has suffered since WW11 --- "safety", and to hell with the the cost or consequences.

Speaking from experience, prior to the coming of CAA in the UK, tiny little UK (it fits on two 1:500,000 charts) was a fun and free place to fly, with all major airports except London Heathrow, readily accepting GA aircraft.

For private flying, Royal Aero Club examiners did all the flight tests, GAPAN organized instructor training and authorization, and an Assistant Instructor could fly on a PPL, as I did. The first time most pilots came up against the "Man from the Ministry" was usually a CPL or IR flight test at Stanstead. My first PPL was issued by the Board or Trade.

Then came the CAA.

Then came JAA, finally EASA.

In recent times, much progress has been in winding back "the rules" --- in reality the meaningless bureaucracy. Brexit has accelerated the effort. If CASA was a "learning" organization, much could be learned, but it ain't. Any more than it wants to learn from the FAA.

There are a few more restrictions than years ago, but even today, there is less bulldust about airspace restrictions than here, and although may major airports are really out of the question, I am always amazed at how many small grass strip airfields still exist --- until Covid kept me in AU, White Waltham was a place where I could be found at least one per year --- it is one of several delightful spots that happily exist within the London CTZ. And you can sit on the grass and have a pint of beer --- after flying!

Sure, when the weather is bad, it's real bad, but VFR operates in condition that would horrify the average CASA bureaucrat. But you would be surprised how many flyable days there are -- and I speak from experience of close to 60 years.

I only found out how difficult "committing aviation" was when I returned to Oz the first time. By that time I had flown around most of Western/Southern Europe/UK and western US. It is mindbogglingly stupid, what has been done to ALL (not just GA) aviation in Australia --- but we have always been Gold Medal worldbeating at mindless bureaucracy.

Tootle pip!!

PS: Lucille, Our "true" safety outcomes, as opposed to "massaged" CASA/ATSB figures ain't too flash, it is all easily accessible, if you want to look.

Last edited by LeadSled; 30th Aug 2021 at 15:06.
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Old 30th Aug 2021, 03:57
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As my old Dad used to say, the British are responsible for two ills in the world.

"Bureaucrats and ties"

Australia took the best of British bureaucracy and refined it into an art form.
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