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Unresponsive 208 above BNE, RFDS intercept

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Unresponsive 208 above BNE, RFDS intercept

Old 4th Jul 2020, 10:51
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Originally Posted by TriJetFlying View Post
oh please...
Oh Please what? What did your HF training teach you about hypoxia for a smoker? I remember mine telling me they'd start getting affected above 5,000 compared to a non-smoker and that's just an example.
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Old 4th Jul 2020, 11:02
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by mcoates View Post
It just proves again how great our emergency services are and how quickly they are deployed in any event like this. A lot of pilots get comfort from knowing that if something goes wrong Australia will throw out every available resource to assist you. Well done guys !
Not sure which emergency services you are referring to. ATC, whilst not an emergency service, did their job well, and flydoc was already airborne for other reasons.
Anybody else involved?
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Old 4th Jul 2020, 12:01
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by jack-daw View Post
Not sure which emergency services you are referring to. ATC, whilst not an emergency service, did their job well, and flydoc was already airborne for other reasons.
Anybody else involved?
have to agree. Whilst the Flydoc driver was shadowing the guy that made no real difference, ATC could only transmit in the hope he heard which Fortunetly he did in the end and then give the guy directions as well as encourage him to land. Emerg services only came into play once he landed. Good outcome -)
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Old 4th Jul 2020, 12:08
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ixixly View Post
Oh Please what? What did your HF training teach you about hypoxia for a smoker? I remember mine telling me they'd start getting affected above 5,000 compared to a non-smoker and that's just an example.
Lots actually, amongst many other training courses. If being at F110 actually caused this issue, Iíd have to think the pilot in question is incredibly unfit... I wish the person well..

oh and Ixixly, forgot to mention.. My initial post was a reply to BlueSkyís dramatic post. Not so much to the incident.

Last edited by TriJetFlying; 4th Jul 2020 at 12:24.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 06:46
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ian Arrighi View Post
Sio am I right in concluding this guy went through BNE primary control zone unplanned and without communication without issue (as he intended to end his journey just to the north of BNE) and somehow that didn't raise any red flags but after he had flown another 120km and exceeded his SAR time ATC started to get concerned?
No, you are not right to conclude that.
The aircraft was originally under the control of ATC and on radar before losing comms well north of Brisbane. That is when the red flags were raised (and presumably a SAR phase initiated).
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 06:57
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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If my memory serves me ok, I recall the RAAF at PCK back in the Winjeel days used O2 at night above 3000ft.
I believe the training these days in this subject is somewhat lacking.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 07:29
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Youwanna View Post
No, you are not right to conclude that.
The aircraft was originally under the control of ATC and on radar before losing comms well north of Brisbane. That is when the red flags were raised (and presumably a SAR phase initiated).
Agree. The first call I heard from BNE Approach or Centre was about 0630UTC on approach to BNE, I started reviewing from 0600. FDS was airborne about 0700 by coincidence as he was overflying BNE and intercept somewhere around 0730, landed 0800.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 08:37
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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You might be amazed at what youíll learn by purchasing one of these...

https://www.mydeal.com.au/fingertip-...SABEgLU0_D_BwE
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 09:15
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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I dunno whether that's going to tell you what you need Squawk. There wasn't much difference between what I was reading at F140 to 10,000ft to 5000ft in the thing I used to fly. And anyway, that thing isn't going to wake you up when you're that fatigued or when you may have suffered a medical event.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 10:26
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cogwheel View Post
If my memory serves me ok, I recall the RAAF at PCK back in the Winjeel days used O2 at night above 3000ft.
I believe the training these days in this subject is somewhat lacking.
The 3,000’ oxy was probably in preparation for those pilots transitioning to trained killer status with what would be now be impressive ‘Darth Vader’ breathing.

In the real world, a squillion pilots and passengers used to/will soon again fly around for many hours at a cabin altitude of about 8,000’.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 13:21
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by VariablePitchP View Post
Iíve spent half my life at 8,000 it feels like, canít imagine the extra 2,000 taking me from totally fine to unconscious.
Did I say that?

I said 90 mins at 10,000 feet in the middle of the day used to make me very tired. Sometimes Iíd be doing everything I could to stay awake. I was in my early 20s and very fit. Sweating, chucking bags, earlies, lates etc. it all adds up.

So 4 hours at night at FL110 would be a right pain. Especially as you age.

Yes there is a big difference between 8000ft and 10,000 feet. Which is why you need oxygen over 10,000 feet.

Itís also why so many airline Pilots fall asleep on the flight deck at high cabin alts during the circadian lows - and suffer immense fatigue doing long haul
flying. Itís also why the 787 is so good to fly.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 13:37
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Lead Balloon View Post
The 3,000’ oxy was probably in preparation for those pilots transitioning to trained killer status with what would be now be impressive ‘Darth Vader’ breathing.
Perhaps it was a carry over from prior to 1947 at PCK, when the RAAF still had their Air Traffic Controller School there? The practice of Winjeel 3000' oxy being to give the student controllers experience at understanding 'Fighter Pilot Talk'.
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Old 10th Jul 2020, 14:13
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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VASAviation has done a video on it- I can't link to it due to post count.
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Old 10th Jul 2020, 23:22
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by GAnoob View Post
VASAviation has done a video on it- I can't link to it due to post count.
They have done a good job of it.

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Old 14th Jul 2020, 03:28
  #55 (permalink)  
 
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VH-DQP
  • Entered on Australian register 7th July 2020
  • Cancelled from Australian register 13th July 2020
  • Sold to USA

Last edited by Mumbai Merlin; 14th Jul 2020 at 03:34. Reason: spelling
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Old 26th May 2021, 10:09
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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Report out. It took the ATSB almost a year to come out with this.

What the ATSB found

The ATSB found that the pilot was likely experiencing a level of fatigue due to inadequate sleep the night before and leading up to the incident. Further, operating at 11,000 ft with intermittent use of supplemental oxygen likely resulted in the pilot experiencing mild hypoxia. This likely exacerbated the pilot’s existing fatigue and contributed to the pilot falling asleep.

Full report here https://www.atsb.gov.au/media/577971...-032-final.pdf

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Old 29th May 2021, 04:14
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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I've done many runs in the chambers, and experienced Hypoxia in various scenarios.

Two things I learned. One is that I personally feel really good when hypoxic. Like, really really good. Yet the video showed I was pretty much stoned.
The second being that the effects of hypoxia during night flying weren't really noticed - until I put on the oxygen mask and noticed that the lights got brighter and stopped moving around (they were glued into the wall).

So for everyone without training to say that they never had any issues flying at altitude, then they aren't the best judge of their own performance.
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Old 5th Jun 2021, 10:55
  #58 (permalink)  
 
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Some of the findings generated from this report should give CASA a lot of factual information with regards to reality, opposed to scientific theories they have enforced on industry with regards to the new 48.1 regulations.

Last edited by Duck Pilot; 5th Jun 2021 at 23:31.
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Old 6th Jun 2021, 18:24
  #59 (permalink)  
 
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Interesting to note that oxygen on private flights in the USA is not required below 12500 AMSL.

I wonder why Australian air is much thinner / Australian pilots so inferior that oxygen is required at 10000.
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Old 6th Jun 2021, 21:31
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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Because there are no solid lines in the sky, where one side of the line you are OK and the other you aren't - and the highest mountain in Australia is only 7,000 ft AMSL, so it's not onerous to require O2 at 10,000'
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