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Albany WA crash 24/10/17

Old 24th Oct 2017, 05:30
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Albany WA crash 24/10/17

Looks like another one down...

Light plane crash reported in Western Australia's South West - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
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Old 24th Oct 2017, 10:35
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Old 25th Oct 2017, 02:13
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I knew thia pilot well. Any more information available? Was it purely structural failure or was it a combination of factors?
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Old 25th Oct 2017, 02:20
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Last I heard, heavy machinery was required to even get access to the crash site. That was last night, so there is probably more to it now.
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Old 25th Oct 2017, 04:21
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Was it purely structural failure or was it a combination of factors?
Why do you ask this question? Is there some indication the aircraft failed structurally before impact?
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Old 28th Oct 2017, 10:33
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Originally Posted by rutan around View Post
Why do you ask this question? Is there some indication the aircraft failed structurally before impact?
I thought this was related to the one in Darwin. Heck that's several crashed days apart
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Old 29th Oct 2017, 04:08
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Originally Posted by airwolf117 View Post
I thought this was related to the one in Darwin. Heck that's several crashed days apart
Two C210's & a C310.

DF.
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Old 16th May 2019, 11:18
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Old 17th May 2019, 01:50
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And in today's The Australian's joke of an Aviation section; an article entitled "Ice blamed for fatal plunge"- rather ambiguous, lazy reporting or was Ms Ironside being clever?

The first paragraph is a gem of misleading, innacurate and sensationalist reporting:

"A pilot was who was high on ice flew his light plane in such a way that the right wing broke off, resulting in the aircraft plunging to the ground..."

Now the report, while noting the presence of methyl amphetamine in the pilot's blood, does not state, or even imply, that the pilot was "high on ice" . While they go to great length examining the possible reasons for the inflight break-up, they report this as undetermined. It does not state the break-up was a result of pilot input.

I commented on this (I subscribe to The Australian online) but my input was rejected. Possibly they didn't like my opening line asking Ms Ironside if she was a graduate of the Byron Bailey School of Accident Reporting?

Very sloppy reporting, I think.
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Old 17th May 2019, 03:44
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› . There was no apparent reason for the pilot to operate outside of the limitations.It is possible that the pilot of VH-DBU encountered a large bird in the vicinity of the accident and acted instinctively to avoid a collision with excessive control inputs.
The report contains this line. Interestingly, from a third party source, I've been advised that the first pilot on the scene - a well qualified and highly regarded individual - noted the presence of two large wedge-tail eagles circling around overhead.

Last edited by Dora-9; 17th May 2019 at 03:45. Reason: grammar
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Old 17th May 2019, 09:57
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Originally Posted by Dora-9 View Post
And in today's The Australian's joke of an Aviation section; an article entitled "Ice blamed for fatal plunge"- rather ambiguous, lazy reporting or was Ms Ironside being clever?

The first paragraph is a gem of misleading, innacurate and sensationalist reporting:

"A pilot was who was high on ice flew his light plane in such a way that the right wing broke off, resulting in the aircraft plunging to the ground..."

Now the report, while noting the presence of methyl amphetamine in the pilot's blood, does not state, or even imply, that the pilot was "high on ice" . While they go to great length examining the possible reasons for the inflight break-up, they report this as undetermined. It does not state the break-up was a result of pilot input.

I commented on this (I subscribe to The Australian online) but my input was rejected. Possibly they didn't like my opening line asking Ms Ironside if she was a graduate of the Byron Bailey School of Accident Reporting?

Very sloppy reporting, I think.
Did you actually read the report in full, especially the toxicology report?

The toxicology results indicated a significant concentration of methylamphetamine and amphetamine in a liver sample showing an advanced state of decomposition.
Agreed, it does also include the standard disclaimer for such reports.


There is no place in aviation, or society for that matter, for pilots using ice or other illegal substances, regardless of what caused the crash.


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Old 17th May 2019, 13:18
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Originally Posted by Squawk7700 View Post
There is no place in aviation, or society for that matter, for pilots using ice or other illegal substances, regardless of what caused the crash.
Preaching to the wrong audience here!
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Old 17th May 2019, 19:30
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Yes I did, thank you SQ7700.

The ATSB found that the presence of methylamphetamine in the pilot’s system increased the risk of operational misjudgements and aircraft mishandling, and pilot incapacitation. This did not necessarily contribute to the accident.
So how do you get, and presumably concur with Ms Ironside's writings, that the pilot was so high on ice that he ripped the wings off?? I'm not for one second condoning his (or anyone else's) drug taking, but if you were a member of his family wouldn't you find that article just a little offensive, as well as being unsupported by what the report states?

Let's be clear here, I have little doubt that the presence of Ice in the pilot's blood could well have been a factor in this accident; my objection is in the way it was reported. All she had to do was insert the adverb "possibly" , or at a stretch even "probably", into her report and there could have been no objection. As it stands, it was crass journalism.

Last edited by Dora-9; 18th May 2019 at 00:45. Reason: further addition
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Old 18th May 2019, 07:48
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I’m with Squawk. If we apply the Reason model of accident causation, then the presence of Ice is one of the
‘holes” in the cheese that lined up that day.

.....And since it is an illegal drug with known ill effects, that the pilot chose to consume of his own free will, then it is the cause.

We see meth users on freeways occasionally, they are the ones travelling 30-40kmh faster than everyone else..until they crash.
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Old 18th May 2019, 10:16
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Victorian data reveals approximately 18% of drivers and motorcyclists killed on the state’s roads tested positive to THC, the active component of cannabis. In the past 5 years, 11% of drivers killed, ...had ecstasy, speed, or crystal methamphetamine (‘ice’) in their system: ADF 2017.

https://adf.org.au/insights/drugs-and-driving
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Old 18th May 2019, 10:37
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Devil

And since it is an illegal drug with known ill effects, that the pilot chose to consume of his own free will, then it is the cause.
We see meth users on freeways occasionally, they are the ones travelling 30-40kmh faster than everyone else..until they crash
In the past 5 years, 11% of drivers killed, ...had ecstasy, speed, or crystal methamphetamine (‘ice’) in their system: ADF 2017.
There are times when I, somewhat cynically I admit, tend to agree with a view held by a former Mayor of Port Lincoln South Australia who many times stated that all those illegal drugs should be made freely available to those who wish to consume them......'at ten times the lethal dose!'

Problem would be rapidly 'solvered!'

Only problem with that 'solution' is just how many innocent lives would be lost along with the Darwin candidates.

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Old 18th May 2019, 12:31
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Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot View Post
There are times when I, somewhat cynically I admit, tend to agree with a view held by a former Mayor of Port Lincoln South Australia who many times stated that all those illegal drugs should be made freely available to those who wish to consume them......'at ten times the lethal dose!'

Problem would be rapidly 'solvered!'

Only problem with that 'solution' is just how many innocent lives would be lost along with the Darwin candidates.
You'd be surprised at who uses currently illegal drugs. It isn't always ice crazed homeless junkies injecting stuff on street corners. Doctors, Lawyers, Business people, even conservative middle class suburbanites (especially in Sydney) partake in the frequent use of cocaine. It'd probably surprise you who does use it.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/...07-p50kyt.html

Ice is a different matter, a more dangerous matter, but each substance should be considered individually. Obviously it should be illegal to be under the influence of a substance prior to operating, but to say every illegal drug user deserves to overdose at ten times the lethal limit is nonsense. It's illegal to be under the influence of alcohol before operating but there's no calls for fatal alcohol poisoning for alcoholics is there?

If there are substance addiction issues treat them as a health matter not a criminal one. That just drives it underground and makes it harder to treat.
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Old 18th May 2019, 22:28
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Originally Posted by airwolf117 View Post
I knew thia pilot well. Any more information available? Was it purely structural failure or was it a combination of factors?
I’m now wondering what “the combination of factors” allude to. A surprisingly prescient post.
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