AOPA in the UK - Still very important
Thread Starter
AOPA in the UK - Still very important
I saw this thread in relation to the UK AOPA on PPRuNe, I thought it makes interesting reading for Australian AOPA members. As you can see the vast majority of members in the UK think it is well worth being a member, and they also refer to the big problems with EASA. Once again, the costs just keep increasing. I must find out how the AOPA in the UK kept their simple instrument rating against EASA objections.
for more information see link here
for more information see link here
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: sydney
Posts: 1,469
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dick,
very interesting reading.
Isn’t it incredible the parallels between the UK and Australia.
Rampant, unaccountable and completely ineffective overregulation in both countries decimating once productive industries.
The tragedy is the apparent arrogant pig headed blind ignorance of the regulators, on both sides of the world of the effect their efforts have on the very industry they rely on for their existence.
Churning out inane regulations in pursuit of that Mystical undefinable thing called safety, yet choosing to completely ignore what should be so blindingly obvious.
The end result of their efforts diminishes the viability of those they regulate by needlessly driving up costs which in turn patently discourages participation.
Blind Freddie could see that over the past decade or so the rise of the regulators has correspondingly resulted in the decline of the regulated. Overregulation is ultimately self-defeating.
As you have said so many times over the years regulation must be affordable, there must be a balance between safety and affordability. Other jurisdiction’s in the world manage this with risk based, simple, plain English rules and still achieve better safety outcomes.
The unfortunate tragedy for our industry in Australia is those that regulate arrogantly ignore world best practice and the advice of the industry; blindly pursuing what they imagine “safety” means without any consideration of the lessons available from the rest of the world that safety can be achieved without destroying the industry in the process.
To an extent the industry itself must bear some responsibility for the parlous state it finds itself in. Apathy fragmentation and self-interest allows the regulator unchallenged freedom to run rampant over any objection or industry opinion and advice.
It has always been incredibly difficult to draw all the industry stakeholders together to present a united front to counter the regulator juggernaut, even more difficult to gain public recognition and support and thus the political will to enforce change.
The British AOPA provides a salutary lesson for us in Australia, United we rise, divided we fall.
I applaud your efforts in this regard.
very interesting reading.
Isn’t it incredible the parallels between the UK and Australia.
Rampant, unaccountable and completely ineffective overregulation in both countries decimating once productive industries.
The tragedy is the apparent arrogant pig headed blind ignorance of the regulators, on both sides of the world of the effect their efforts have on the very industry they rely on for their existence.
Churning out inane regulations in pursuit of that Mystical undefinable thing called safety, yet choosing to completely ignore what should be so blindingly obvious.
The end result of their efforts diminishes the viability of those they regulate by needlessly driving up costs which in turn patently discourages participation.
Blind Freddie could see that over the past decade or so the rise of the regulators has correspondingly resulted in the decline of the regulated. Overregulation is ultimately self-defeating.
As you have said so many times over the years regulation must be affordable, there must be a balance between safety and affordability. Other jurisdiction’s in the world manage this with risk based, simple, plain English rules and still achieve better safety outcomes.
The unfortunate tragedy for our industry in Australia is those that regulate arrogantly ignore world best practice and the advice of the industry; blindly pursuing what they imagine “safety” means without any consideration of the lessons available from the rest of the world that safety can be achieved without destroying the industry in the process.
To an extent the industry itself must bear some responsibility for the parlous state it finds itself in. Apathy fragmentation and self-interest allows the regulator unchallenged freedom to run rampant over any objection or industry opinion and advice.
It has always been incredibly difficult to draw all the industry stakeholders together to present a united front to counter the regulator juggernaut, even more difficult to gain public recognition and support and thus the political will to enforce change.
The British AOPA provides a salutary lesson for us in Australia, United we rise, divided we fall.
I applaud your efforts in this regard.
Last edited by thorn bird; 14th Jun 2016 at 23:29.
AROA, that is my read of it also. Until there is support and promote instead of regulate until you are dead not much else will happen here...no matter how many ginger groups there are.
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: sydney
Posts: 1,469
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Aint it grand, who would have thunk it?
Its dawned on the old dart that maybe, just maybe there is some value in having a general aviation industry after all, hells bells even EASA itself has come to the conclusion they screwed up and are actively rewriting their rules.
The FAA of course have been continually addressing their rules, pro-actively streamlining what they consider too prescriptive using risk based analysis and "Real" industry consultation. Their foster and promote ethos has built and continues to maintain the biggest and arguably the safest aviation industry in the world.
It’s certainly refreshing that it’s finally started to dawn on other jurisdictions that the rise of their regulators has led to a corresponding decline in their industries; the two occurrences certainly seem to run in parallel.
Is there a reason why comparable countries to Australia manage to develop thriving aviation Industries?
Countries like Canada, Brazil even tiny New Zealand make lots of aviation stuff.
Why not Australia?
There are a lot of clever, innovative and passionate people in Australia, yet every time a project gets off the ground it is ground down, largely by ignorant inept bureaucrats the passion stamped on until its extinguished and the venture fades into oblivion.
It has always been thus in Australia.
The old DCA, spawned from the loins of the military, infected with vastly inflated ego's, perpetuating the myth that they knew best and the industry should jolly well do what it was told if it knew what was good for them.
Unfortunately this cadre were completely devoid of any commercial expertise.
Post WW11 DCA began the process, then along came CAsA who have taken the best of British bureaucracy and refined it into an art form.
Our fearless military DAS promotes the notion that all is well, the industry in Australia is in good shape that our regulations are world leading and people are beating a path to his door to copy them.
Oh really AVM, WHO perchance? Are you completely blind, ignorant, or inept or all three?
The following is an article unashamedly copied from a magazine article. It illustrates what could be achieved in Australia if the industry could get the monkey off its back.
A famous politician once said “ Ask not what your country can do for you, ask instead what you can do for your country”.
What we need to do perhaps is point out to our politicians, we want to use our innovative skills, our entrepreneurial spirit and build a vibrant industry just like Ireland that employs lots of people and contributes to the well being of the country, but we can’t unless the government opens the door for us first.
Read what happens when your government supports you. Another New Zealand success story perhaps?
Quote:
The Irish government and the Irish civil aviation authority (IAA) have adopted a more forward-thinking orientation on aviation than most of their, often much larger, counterparts in Europe.
The policy is paying off — big time. Ireland is one of the smallest countries in Europe, with just 4.6 million inhabitants, yet about half of the world’s leased aircraft are registered in the country and the world’s first duty-free shop was established here. It is also home to Europe’s largest airline by passenger count and the world’s largest airline in terms of international enplanements: Ryanair.
Aviation executives in Ireland commonly joke that it took an Irishman to get International Airlines Group (IAG) off the ground and grow it into an agile, profitable and diversified airline group: IAG CEO Willie Walsh, born in Dublin and a former Aer Lingus CEO.
Aviation is central and strategic to the Irish economy, IAA CEO Eamonn Brennan noted. “We live on an island; we don’t even have bridges. This is a key thing.” Aviation contributes just over €4 billion ($4.3 billion) directly to the Irish GDP, comprising €1.9 billion from aviation, €1.3 billion through the supply chain and €0.9 billion from associated spending by people employed in aviation.
It supports 26,000 jobs directly and a further 16,000 in the supply chain. Ireland’s tourism industry, which is dependent on aviation, accounts for another €5.3-billion GDP contribution and 180,000 jobs.
The Irish government has earmarked aviation—along with information technology and the pharmaceutical industry—as high-value sectors to the Irish economy. It launched a new aviation policy in 2015, after two years of consultation. “This government policy says that we have to make the industry more competitive and innovative.
The global aviation industry continues to expand and is estimated to double over the next 20 years. This presents opportunities for Ireland in virtually every area of aviation such as airlines, pilot training services, satellite-based air traffic control services and aircraft leasing services,” Brennan said.
Aer Lingus CEO Stephen Kavanagh told the Executive Report that Ireland’s embracing of deregulation and liberalizing access had paid off.
“It’s a very small economy in the global context, but it’s a very open economy, one of the most open economies and on a par with Singapore,” he said.
“Ireland has recognized the requirement for connectivity and, as an island, sees that air transportation is how that’s delivered. We have very strong indigenous competition with Ryanair, but there’s the ability for us to compete not only in the Irish market but also across the Atlantic and in Europe. Deregulation has allowed us to grow scale. Deregulation, competition and liberalization have brought out the very best in terms of behaviors and competitive response. We’re efficient, we’re focused on returns, and the Irish economy has benefited and the consumer has benefited.”
Kavanagh also believes competition reaps its own rewards. “Competitiveness has fostered demand,” he said. “We see a higher propensity to travel than in most other nations and that’s because we’ve created an opportunity for competitive airfares.
“We are one of the two largest Irish airlines, but there are others and the aviation eco-system, including airlines, lessors, MROs and travel technologists, has prospered because it’s been open to competition. To remain relevant, we have to remain competitive and everyone has reaped the benefits.”
IATA DG & CEO Tony Tyler told the Executive Report, “the Irish government has taken a very pro-aviation strategy for some years now,” pointing out that the country reduced its departure tax to zero in 2014. With the growth and planned second runway at Dublin Airport, there are “clearly signs that the tax policy is bearing fruit and near neighbours should take note,” Tyler said.
Irish Transport Minister Shane Ross is scheduled to speak during the AGM’s opening sessions on Thursday morning.
Its dawned on the old dart that maybe, just maybe there is some value in having a general aviation industry after all, hells bells even EASA itself has come to the conclusion they screwed up and are actively rewriting their rules.
The FAA of course have been continually addressing their rules, pro-actively streamlining what they consider too prescriptive using risk based analysis and "Real" industry consultation. Their foster and promote ethos has built and continues to maintain the biggest and arguably the safest aviation industry in the world.
It’s certainly refreshing that it’s finally started to dawn on other jurisdictions that the rise of their regulators has led to a corresponding decline in their industries; the two occurrences certainly seem to run in parallel.
Is there a reason why comparable countries to Australia manage to develop thriving aviation Industries?
Countries like Canada, Brazil even tiny New Zealand make lots of aviation stuff.
Why not Australia?
There are a lot of clever, innovative and passionate people in Australia, yet every time a project gets off the ground it is ground down, largely by ignorant inept bureaucrats the passion stamped on until its extinguished and the venture fades into oblivion.
It has always been thus in Australia.
The old DCA, spawned from the loins of the military, infected with vastly inflated ego's, perpetuating the myth that they knew best and the industry should jolly well do what it was told if it knew what was good for them.
Unfortunately this cadre were completely devoid of any commercial expertise.
Post WW11 DCA began the process, then along came CAsA who have taken the best of British bureaucracy and refined it into an art form.
Our fearless military DAS promotes the notion that all is well, the industry in Australia is in good shape that our regulations are world leading and people are beating a path to his door to copy them.
Oh really AVM, WHO perchance? Are you completely blind, ignorant, or inept or all three?
The following is an article unashamedly copied from a magazine article. It illustrates what could be achieved in Australia if the industry could get the monkey off its back.
A famous politician once said “ Ask not what your country can do for you, ask instead what you can do for your country”.
What we need to do perhaps is point out to our politicians, we want to use our innovative skills, our entrepreneurial spirit and build a vibrant industry just like Ireland that employs lots of people and contributes to the well being of the country, but we can’t unless the government opens the door for us first.
Read what happens when your government supports you. Another New Zealand success story perhaps?
Quote:
The Irish government and the Irish civil aviation authority (IAA) have adopted a more forward-thinking orientation on aviation than most of their, often much larger, counterparts in Europe.
The policy is paying off — big time. Ireland is one of the smallest countries in Europe, with just 4.6 million inhabitants, yet about half of the world’s leased aircraft are registered in the country and the world’s first duty-free shop was established here. It is also home to Europe’s largest airline by passenger count and the world’s largest airline in terms of international enplanements: Ryanair.
Aviation executives in Ireland commonly joke that it took an Irishman to get International Airlines Group (IAG) off the ground and grow it into an agile, profitable and diversified airline group: IAG CEO Willie Walsh, born in Dublin and a former Aer Lingus CEO.
Aviation is central and strategic to the Irish economy, IAA CEO Eamonn Brennan noted. “We live on an island; we don’t even have bridges. This is a key thing.” Aviation contributes just over €4 billion ($4.3 billion) directly to the Irish GDP, comprising €1.9 billion from aviation, €1.3 billion through the supply chain and €0.9 billion from associated spending by people employed in aviation.
It supports 26,000 jobs directly and a further 16,000 in the supply chain. Ireland’s tourism industry, which is dependent on aviation, accounts for another €5.3-billion GDP contribution and 180,000 jobs.
The Irish government has earmarked aviation—along with information technology and the pharmaceutical industry—as high-value sectors to the Irish economy. It launched a new aviation policy in 2015, after two years of consultation. “This government policy says that we have to make the industry more competitive and innovative.
The global aviation industry continues to expand and is estimated to double over the next 20 years. This presents opportunities for Ireland in virtually every area of aviation such as airlines, pilot training services, satellite-based air traffic control services and aircraft leasing services,” Brennan said.
Aer Lingus CEO Stephen Kavanagh told the Executive Report that Ireland’s embracing of deregulation and liberalizing access had paid off.
“It’s a very small economy in the global context, but it’s a very open economy, one of the most open economies and on a par with Singapore,” he said.
“Ireland has recognized the requirement for connectivity and, as an island, sees that air transportation is how that’s delivered. We have very strong indigenous competition with Ryanair, but there’s the ability for us to compete not only in the Irish market but also across the Atlantic and in Europe. Deregulation has allowed us to grow scale. Deregulation, competition and liberalization have brought out the very best in terms of behaviors and competitive response. We’re efficient, we’re focused on returns, and the Irish economy has benefited and the consumer has benefited.”
Kavanagh also believes competition reaps its own rewards. “Competitiveness has fostered demand,” he said. “We see a higher propensity to travel than in most other nations and that’s because we’ve created an opportunity for competitive airfares.
“We are one of the two largest Irish airlines, but there are others and the aviation eco-system, including airlines, lessors, MROs and travel technologists, has prospered because it’s been open to competition. To remain relevant, we have to remain competitive and everyone has reaped the benefits.”
IATA DG & CEO Tony Tyler told the Executive Report, “the Irish government has taken a very pro-aviation strategy for some years now,” pointing out that the country reduced its departure tax to zero in 2014. With the growth and planned second runway at Dublin Airport, there are “clearly signs that the tax policy is bearing fruit and near neighbours should take note,” Tyler said.
Irish Transport Minister Shane Ross is scheduled to speak during the AGM’s opening sessions on Thursday morning.
