Ridiculous radio calls
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Is there enough traffic at MBB to warrant all this communication these days? Where the hell is CASA, there's altogether too much aviation occurring at MBB!!! shut someone down!!
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Where the hell is CASA?
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YMMB.
The previous GAAP Procedures were uniquely Australian.
The current Procedures are ICAO and used at all "controlled" airports. Start Clearance, Taxi Clearance (including runway crossing and/or hold short clearances) and then over to TWR for line up and take off clearances.
As per AIP, there are certain "read back" requirements.
This is how it is gentlemen.
So please......
The previous GAAP Procedures were uniquely Australian.
The current Procedures are ICAO and used at all "controlled" airports. Start Clearance, Taxi Clearance (including runway crossing and/or hold short clearances) and then over to TWR for line up and take off clearances.
As per AIP, there are certain "read back" requirements.
This is how it is gentlemen.
So please......
At YMMB I hear lots of clearances acknowledged not with a readback, but just call-sign, eg.
ATC: EOK, cleared touch-and-go
EOK: EOK
It's got to the point now that I am mildly surprised when I hear a correct response from a pilot. How come instructors don't seem to be pulling up students on this ? I hear it multiple times from the same aircraft in the circuit so no-one is being corrected.
Used to be that the controllers would tell people off for this, but now they don't seem to bother. Guess when it becomes so damn frequent they lose the will to complain...
ATC: EOK, cleared touch-and-go
EOK: EOK
It's got to the point now that I am mildly surprised when I hear a correct response from a pilot. How come instructors don't seem to be pulling up students on this ? I hear it multiple times from the same aircraft in the circuit so no-one is being corrected.
Used to be that the controllers would tell people off for this, but now they don't seem to bother. Guess when it becomes so damn frequent they lose the will to complain...
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Just to be sure we all have it right, the Visual Pilot Guide for Moorabbin states that:
departures
You require start approval for the following:
1. All circuit operations.
2. Aircraft departing for airwork in the Melbourne Terminal Area.
3. Aircraft intending to land at Melbourne.
4. Aircraft intending to climb into class C airspace for a landing at Essendon.
5. If notified on the ATIS
Little old pilots undertaking private flights back out to the wilds of uncontrolableness from whence they arrived do not generally need a Start clearance.
I thank God that she has arranged for the Tower to spare me the torture of trying to remember a Taxi clearance that would fill enough pages to make a small book because I'm the same age as my aircraft and they call it an Antique.
Kaz
departures
You require start approval for the following:
1. All circuit operations.
2. Aircraft departing for airwork in the Melbourne Terminal Area.
3. Aircraft intending to land at Melbourne.
4. Aircraft intending to climb into class C airspace for a landing at Essendon.
5. If notified on the ATIS
Little old pilots undertaking private flights back out to the wilds of uncontrolableness from whence they arrived do not generally need a Start clearance.
I thank God that she has arranged for the Tower to spare me the torture of trying to remember a Taxi clearance that would fill enough pages to make a small book because I'm the same age as my aircraft and they call it an Antique.
Kaz
Alas, Kaz, not requiring a start clearance is not the same as not requiring a taxi clearance. You'll still need to request, copy (probably literally) and regurgitate a taxi clearance even if you're departing into G. 
Originally Posted by Back Pressure
At YMMB I hear lots of clearances acknowledged not with a readback, but just call-sign, eg.
ATC: EOK, cleared touch-and-go
EOK: EOK
It's got to the point now that I am mildly surprised when I hear a correct response from a pilot. How come instructors don't seem to be pulling up students on this ? I hear it multiple times from the same aircraft in the circuit so no-one is being corrected.
Used to be that the controllers would tell people off for this, but now they don't seem to bother. Guess when it becomes so damn frequent they lose the will to complain...
ATC: EOK, cleared touch-and-go
EOK: EOK
It's got to the point now that I am mildly surprised when I hear a correct response from a pilot. How come instructors don't seem to be pulling up students on this ? I hear it multiple times from the same aircraft in the circuit so no-one is being corrected.
Used to be that the controllers would tell people off for this, but now they don't seem to bother. Guess when it becomes so damn frequent they lose the will to complain...
not so much an incursion, more an excursion
The ATSB is investigating a collision on the ground involving Cessna 172,VH-EWZ (EWZ), and Cessna 172, VH-SYH (SYH), at Moorabbin Airport, Victoria, on13 May 2016.
During a touch and go landing, the pilot of EWZ lost control of theaircraft. EWZ veered off the runway and collided with SYH, which was stationaryon a taxiway. Both aircraft sustained substantial damage and there were noinjuries.
This one flew beneath the radar- and on Friday 13th as well! It happened a couple of years ago when a Warrior took out another Oxford aircraft- looks like this time the situation is reversed
During a touch and go landing, the pilot of EWZ lost control of theaircraft. EWZ veered off the runway and collided with SYH, which was stationaryon a taxiway. Both aircraft sustained substantial damage and there were noinjuries.
This one flew beneath the radar- and on Friday 13th as well! It happened a couple of years ago when a Warrior took out another Oxford aircraft- looks like this time the situation is reversed
Since the thread has taken a lighter turn... Am I seeing things? Is this a post from Dick that has (shock, horror) a sense of humour??!! Lampooning his own inability to spell rediculous, no less...
Originally Posted by Dick
Hempy. I can't agree with your last post. It is redik you less!
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The current Procedures are ICAO and used at all "controlled" airports. Start Clearance, Taxi Clearance (including runway crossing and/or hold short clearances) and then over to TWR for line up and take off clearances.
It's got to the point now that I am mildly surprised when I hear a correct response from a pilot. How come instructors don't seem to be pulling up students on this ? I hear it multiple times from the same aircraft in the circuit so no-one is being corrected.
(One of) my personal favourite(s) has to be "turns finals".
Really?
Do you also "turns bases"?
Ps. TurnING final (Singular)
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While the radio call cited by 7700 is a lengthy one I'm kind of baffled as to why this is an issue? I know that it used to be easier in the days of the GAAP, but as professional pilots reading back a clearance should not be hard...
Writing down 31L B@A2 X 35L/R 22 HLD B3 does not take long long to write down. Just work out your own version of shorthand (i.e. adding something to X if it means cross vs. Xray) and if the controller gets shirty tell them to standby or tell them to repeat instructions more slowly.
If you're airborne and get a lengthy clearance to transit controlled airspace do you just turn back and go home, or respond "Nah, I just want to go to XXX so I'll just track direct, I know how to get there"?
Writing down 31L B@A2 X 35L/R 22 HLD B3 does not take long long to write down. Just work out your own version of shorthand (i.e. adding something to X if it means cross vs. Xray) and if the controller gets shirty tell them to standby or tell them to repeat instructions more slowly.
If you're airborne and get a lengthy clearance to transit controlled airspace do you just turn back and go home, or respond "Nah, I just want to go to XXX so I'll just track direct, I know how to get there"?
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Originally Posted by iPahlot
but as professional pilots reading back a clearance should not be hard...