ICUS - Part 61
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ICUS - Part 61
Recently, I was alerted to changes under Part 61, that the Supervising PIC on ICUS flights is now required to hold an Instructor Rating or Examiner Approval.
Can anyone confirm my understanding of these new Regs is correct?
If my understanding of subregulation 3 is correct, does this mean a small operator who has no pilots with instructor ratings or examiner approvals, need to contract out ICUS training to another outfit? I do hope I'm misinterpreting this!
Can anyone confirm my understanding of these new Regs is correct?
(1) A person's flight time as PIC under supervision is the duration of a flight if:
a) the person holds a pilot licence; and
b) the person performs all duties of the PIC for the flight; and
c) subregulation (2) or (3) applies to the flight
(2)- Part 142 / Multi-Crew, not relevant
(3) For Paragraph (1)(c), this sub regulation applies to the flight if:
a) the person is supervised by a flight instructor or flight examiner; and
b) the person is not receiving flight training.
a) the person holds a pilot licence; and
b) the person performs all duties of the PIC for the flight; and
c) subregulation (2) or (3) applies to the flight
(2)- Part 142 / Multi-Crew, not relevant
(3) For Paragraph (1)(c), this sub regulation applies to the flight if:
a) the person is supervised by a flight instructor or flight examiner; and
b) the person is not receiving flight training.
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Some small operators do have an in house check and training system and therefor subregulation 2 would apply.
If this is not the case then you can't do any training and/or checking without an instructor rating/examiner rating or other similar approval from CASA.
Nothing stops someone sitting in the right seat as an observer/passenger though. That person just cannot log any flight time and is at the mercy of the actual PIC in the left seat.
My suggestion would be that operator apply for an in house check and training approval.
If this is not the case then you can't do any training and/or checking without an instructor rating/examiner rating or other similar approval from CASA.
Nothing stops someone sitting in the right seat as an observer/passenger though. That person just cannot log any flight time and is at the mercy of the actual PIC in the left seat.
My suggestion would be that operator apply for an in house check and training approval.
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I was informed that the right hand seat pilot can be a 'safety pilot' however the left hand seat pilot is PIC and obviously needs all the relevant qualifications. If it's for the purpose of a check ride the right hand seat pilot doesn't need to be an instructor or examiner.....
Folks,
One again, Australia confirms its position of being out of step (or the only one in step) with ICAO Annex 1 and the rest of the world --- all to the serious disadvantage to the career progress of Australian pilots looking outside Australia --- clearly a CASA objective!
All in accord with the CASA policy: "We're not happy 'till your not happy".
I trust Australia has filed a difference on this variation from Annex 1.
Tootle pip!!
PS: I assume the exemptions held by some major airlines, to allow logging time in compliance with Annex 1, will carry through under Part 61.
One again, Australia confirms its position of being out of step (or the only one in step) with ICAO Annex 1 and the rest of the world --- all to the serious disadvantage to the career progress of Australian pilots looking outside Australia --- clearly a CASA objective!
All in accord with the CASA policy: "We're not happy 'till your not happy".
I trust Australia has filed a difference on this variation from Annex 1.
Tootle pip!!
PS: I assume the exemptions held by some major airlines, to allow logging time in compliance with Annex 1, will carry through under Part 61.
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Lead sled,
From post above:
"(2)- Part 142 / Multi-Crew, not relevant"
This is more a GA "ICUS" argument.
The pilot logs Command, and must be so qualified. The "Supervisory pilot" sits in a seat and supervises, not logging anything.
If training is happening then it is dual so Instructor rating required.
ICUS is NOT training.
From post above:
"(2)- Part 142 / Multi-Crew, not relevant"
This is more a GA "ICUS" argument.
The pilot logs Command, and must be so qualified. The "Supervisory pilot" sits in a seat and supervises, not logging anything.
If training is happening then it is dual so Instructor rating required.
ICUS is NOT training.
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Thanks for the replies so far.
Just to clarify what we are aiming to do- As done previously prior to Part 61, is have new pilots who are appropriately qualified from a legal perspective, sit in the left seat, and log ICUS time until such point as they meet the company requirements.
Just to clarify what we are aiming to do- As done previously prior to Part 61, is have new pilots who are appropriately qualified from a legal perspective, sit in the left seat, and log ICUS time until such point as they meet the company requirements.
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Hey Seneca 208. Why can't they log it as PIC time with a 'safety pilot' on board til they meet the company requirements? Will be easier and cheaper to make a small change to your ops manual than get an instructor rating.
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Insurance requirement for cross-hired aircraft, additionally some pilots are chasing the 10 PIC/ICUS on type for Multi IFR Charter. Happy to explore all avenues though.
The pilot logs Command, and must be so qualified
I may be wrong what with all the recent regulatory changes that have mystified so many of us since Part 61 came into being. But ICUS in Australia is not in command and never was and must be logged in a separate or specific column to the command column.
That said, cheating is common - with ICUS often being logged in the command column and counted as command time. At the same time the real pilot in command name is often left out. Have personally observed log books like this.
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If you intention is to go overseas just have 2 sets of logbooks, one for CASA rules and the other set to log time like the rest of the world does.
Renewed my instructor rating in November and got my Part 61 licence today.
What is a A050 flight activity endorsement? It is not in the abbreviations.
Similarly, under my instructor rating it says "CLR SEA" and "CLR MEA".
What goes the CLR mean?
What is a A050 flight activity endorsement? It is not in the abbreviations.
Similarly, under my instructor rating it says "CLR SEA" and "CLR MEA".
What goes the CLR mean?
CLR = Class Rating.
23 years of old abbreviations to un-learn
