C210 crash reported Inverell NSW
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Looking forward to returning to Japan soon but in the meantime continuing the never ending search for a bad bottle of Red!
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The bastard doesn't need any educating on that front
Any excuse to open a bottle of a good Aussie red is acceptable.
gerry111 knows me too well on the subject of bottles of red!
Last edited by Pinky the pilot; 13th Jul 2014 at 10:54. Reason: I should really know better.
So.....what happened?
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Looking forward to returning to Japan soon but in the meantime continuing the never ending search for a bad bottle of Red!
Age: 69
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Suffice to say there is a well loved and respected father and husband who will live the rest of his days revisiting the event over and over again as he learns to deal with the loss of his beloved wife and what else could have happened. He blames himself. For his and his family's sake just please let it sit until the report is published.
Band a Lot,
I'm guessing that you are a LAME?
Let's imagine a situation whereby the oil filler cap was left off. Then the engine was started, warmed up and the run up checks completed. After rolling with revs for take off and fuel flow normal, wouldn't the oil pressure gauge identify the cap being off?
I'm guessing that you are a LAME?
Let's imagine a situation whereby the oil filler cap was left off. Then the engine was started, warmed up and the run up checks completed. After rolling with revs for take off and fuel flow normal, wouldn't the oil pressure gauge identify the cap being off?
it might be tempting to do a downwind departure, but if something goes wrong you sure wish you had those runway metres back.
DF.
One for the APS guys..
"Precise Flight speedbrakes were installed on the aircraft to reduce shock engine cooling and allow for accelerated descents without decreasing engine power."
"Precise Flight speedbrakes were installed on the aircraft to reduce shock engine cooling and allow for accelerated descents without decreasing engine power."
Precise Flight speedbrakes were installed on the aircraft to reduce shock engine cooling and allow for accelerated descents without decreasing engine power.
Along with the Turbo Encabulator to scavenge lead while I'm idling the engine for 5 minutes to cool the turbo, I've purchased just about every useless piece of expensive crap to deal with just about every non-existent problem imaginable!
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Let's imagine a situation whereby the oil filler cap was left off. Then the engine was started, warmed up and the run up checks completed. After rolling with revs for take off and fuel flow normal, wouldn't the oil pressure gauge identify the cap being off?
My experience occurred in a C210 and given that the engine compartment in pretty much all of them is the same I reckon their reaction to an oil cap left off would be similar to my experience.
Usual story - rush ,tear bust to get going. Luggage to deal with, oil to be topped , oily funnel to be wrapped and stowed before replacing the oil cap because it was a dirt strip and windy so the funnel couldn't be put on the ground. Distracted by sendoff people while walking to finish the job and then quickly shut the top cowl door AND totally forgot the cap.
All was normal through start up and 1,000 m backtrack and mag and prop checks ( done on the backtrack to protect the prop on the stony dirt strip. All was normal on the take off roll and then I rotated. Almost immediately the wind screen began to be covered in oil. After the initial shock I guessed what the problem was and lowered the nose as much as I could. I climbed to a dizzy height of 300 feet and reduced power and speed as much as I dared. I found a small piece of the screen not completely covered in oil and completed the circuit.
After stopping I found that indeed the cap was off and was hanging from its' chain. Although there was a #*&%!% awful mess I had only lost about 1 litre of oil. In an hour or so enough oil had been cleaned up to be able to fly. The rest made its' way out over the next 2 years but on the positive side I never had cowl corrosion problems over that time.
I can't say what caused the oil to cover the screen on rotation. Possibilities that come to mind are:- change of sump angle or change of air flow over the open filler pipe causing suction there or there was an oil build up the whole time and the climb airflow redirected it to the windscreen. Whatever, the shortest, lowest, slowest flight possible still seems like the second best choice.
The best one would have been to not leave the cap off in the first place.
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I am about to read this report. I did not know the victims but friends of the victims. So it is with some interest I have to say that the early comments suggest what we knew.
As for shock cooling and speed brakes……..OMFG where do these ATSB folk get this drivel? Surely the days of OWT's like those from the Whyalla report are behind us? Ohhh no….silly Jaba, of course not.
As for shock cooling and speed brakes……..OMFG where do these ATSB folk get this drivel? Surely the days of OWT's like those from the Whyalla report are behind us? Ohhh no….silly Jaba, of course not.
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Seems a straight forward report on things that the pilot and witnesses provided.
I do have a cynical view of this though
I do have a cynical view of this though
The Cessna T210N pilot’s operating handbook advised pilots to check the engine oil level during a pre-flight inspection but not the security of the separate oil filler cap.
Further to Jaba's point and quote, although I have been known to refer to a paper checklist in the aircraft, I've yet to see anyone use one for the external portion of the preflight checks. How adding more verbiage to the POH would assist in preventing this sort of error I don't know.
I'm not sure that I'm quite ready to hang the ATSB from the nearest tree over the speedbrake issue though, I very much suspect they are quoting either the maker's bumf or the pilot. It is a side issue and probably didn't get a great deal of attention once it was determined that they didn't cause the unhappy event.
I'm not sure that I'm quite ready to hang the ATSB from the nearest tree over the speedbrake issue though, I very much suspect they are quoting either the maker's bumf or the pilot. It is a side issue and probably didn't get a great deal of attention once it was determined that they didn't cause the unhappy event.
I've yet to see anyone use one for the external portion of the preflight checks
The manual i have says "check oil filler cap secure" and "check oil dipstick, do not operate with less than nine quarts".
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No oil pressure would not show a thing, Yes I am LAME.
IT is oil mist drawn up from the filler port, yes at angle of attack that makes the mess - blow over a open bottle of red and it will whistle a very full bottle on a angle will spill blood.
At first sign close cowl flaps and slow as much as possible, lower nose, that is not in the book - but neither is opps with oil cap off.
It will be bad for engine but not fatal, maybe a top down the track.
IT is oil mist drawn up from the filler port, yes at angle of attack that makes the mess - blow over a open bottle of red and it will whistle a very full bottle on a angle will spill blood.
At first sign close cowl flaps and slow as much as possible, lower nose, that is not in the book - but neither is opps with oil cap off.
It will be bad for engine but not fatal, maybe a top down the track.
Lots of lessons to be learnt from this tragic accident. Pressures of private flying, especially with kids, wives and mates... I didn't realise how challenging it was until I got out of commercial flying recently. Flew quite a bit years ago before I got my commercial licence with family and mates, however now having experience I must admit that I was very naieve back then given some of the flying that I done, especially over Bass Strait back in the late 80s.
Most flying schools don't address the potential human factors issues that private pilots may be faced once they get their PPL.
Most flying schools don't address the potential human factors issues that private pilots may be faced once they get their PPL.
Part 61 and its MOS will fix that, Duck. Chillax.