NZ - thinking of quitting.
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Join Date: Jul 2011
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NZ - thinking of quitting.
I have been studying a PPL for some yrs now and 2yrs ago I had a pacemaker installed. Granted if I can get a medical class 2 pass - I have no intention of flying commercially. Combined with other factors I am having second thoughts if I should continue even if they allow me. I did have a class 2 medical before but I was asked to return it.
In 2006 I did my discovery flight then I purchased three lessons in advanced which I was allocated a different instructor, on the last flight the guy scared me putting the aircraft into a aerobatic move.
2008, I then went overseas and came back and took a while to get new job. I bought a fifteen hour package in advance. First I was allocated another clown, between each time he got me to do stalling exercises he would steeply decend or climb the aeroplane and bank it at 75 causing discomfort. I ditched him. I then requested the chief CFI. Had a few goes and I tried another C-cat instructor, I tried a few till I settled on one. I used up the fifteen hours and paid out of my pocket for another five or so sessions. Then I had my cardiac arrest.
One of the other time I was going to go and join their social activites as they had a fly away BBQ. I believe they needed a student to pay, so they persuaded me to go with somone I only flew once before and do a dual cross country which he wasn't helpful and he was abusive. On the return flight he just dragged both his foot back and folded his arms and looked outside the window and I managed to balloon the plane. I think they wanted me to fly with him because that person had to get back earlier for something which we left earlier than the rest of the group. Initially I was only going to be a rear passenger and have lunch at the destination.
At the time I did put a lot of work into it. I flew both Saturday and Sunday and I went after work on a mid week.
Fast forward 2yrs. I have not touched a aeroplane. I have ~32 hours dual, haven't gone solo. I am not sure if I would go thru the process of medical and get flying again. It feels like a lengthy issue that's been dragged on.
In 2006 I did my discovery flight then I purchased three lessons in advanced which I was allocated a different instructor, on the last flight the guy scared me putting the aircraft into a aerobatic move.
2008, I then went overseas and came back and took a while to get new job. I bought a fifteen hour package in advance. First I was allocated another clown, between each time he got me to do stalling exercises he would steeply decend or climb the aeroplane and bank it at 75 causing discomfort. I ditched him. I then requested the chief CFI. Had a few goes and I tried another C-cat instructor, I tried a few till I settled on one. I used up the fifteen hours and paid out of my pocket for another five or so sessions. Then I had my cardiac arrest.
One of the other time I was going to go and join their social activites as they had a fly away BBQ. I believe they needed a student to pay, so they persuaded me to go with somone I only flew once before and do a dual cross country which he wasn't helpful and he was abusive. On the return flight he just dragged both his foot back and folded his arms and looked outside the window and I managed to balloon the plane. I think they wanted me to fly with him because that person had to get back earlier for something which we left earlier than the rest of the group. Initially I was only going to be a rear passenger and have lunch at the destination.
At the time I did put a lot of work into it. I flew both Saturday and Sunday and I went after work on a mid week.
Fast forward 2yrs. I have not touched a aeroplane. I have ~32 hours dual, haven't gone solo. I am not sure if I would go thru the process of medical and get flying again. It feels like a lengthy issue that's been dragged on.
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It seems that you still have some interest in flying; have you thought about flying microlights? Many PPL pilots who have had medical issues turn to this form of aviation which is just as much (or even more!) fun than GA. Give the guys at Masterton aeroclub a call, or PM me and I could put you in touch with someone.
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It sounds to me as if you have just had a string of poor instructors with bad attitudes.
The only real question is, do you want to fly? If you do, there are ways (microlights, ultralights, gliders) and means (a decent, dedicated, friendly instructor who gets where you are coming from).
Believe it or not, such people do exist. I know a few, if you want any contacts. Where in the country are you?
It would be a shame to give up because poor instructors have let you down. Persevere, it's worth it.
The only real question is, do you want to fly? If you do, there are ways (microlights, ultralights, gliders) and means (a decent, dedicated, friendly instructor who gets where you are coming from).
Believe it or not, such people do exist. I know a few, if you want any contacts. Where in the country are you?
It would be a shame to give up because poor instructors have let you down. Persevere, it's worth it.
Looks like you have the flying bug bad Ray, don't give up on yourself, if you quit now you'll always see a light plane flying above and wonder what might have been. Find a club and instructor whom you trust and get that license, and if you think getting a Class 2 Medical might be one challenge too many, then take pointyendforwards advice and go LSA. While there may be some debate as to whether it is more fun than GA, it certainly is cheaper and easier to maintain from a medical standpoint.
Have a good look at the NZCAA website there is a little bit in there, in the medical section about Cardiac problems.
It is possible to hold a medical under certain conditions?
So don't look at it as a big brick wall!
Medical Information Sheets
It is possible to hold a medical under certain conditions?
So don't look at it as a big brick wall!
Medical Information Sheets
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Join Date: Jul 2011
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Thanks guys
A bit fed up. i had a look at my logbook and I have been doing circuits almost back to back for like 15hrs. Prob a total of 20hr just in circuits. I feel that some of them do want to waste your money. Apart from the chief FI, they only have 1 or 2yrs before they jumpship.
Part of the issue is about bothering. It's just a hobby and we have a few of those right? Not just one. Yeah I do like airports and et al .. I've had a total of 7 or 8 diff instructors. I went to Kapiti for a look lately. One of the guys works for CAA as well so that feels assuring at least. Masterton might just be a bit too far. Monorail might seem a bit too wild for me
I've asked the hospital to release my forms to myself and then see what CAA says.
A bit fed up. i had a look at my logbook and I have been doing circuits almost back to back for like 15hrs. Prob a total of 20hr just in circuits. I feel that some of them do want to waste your money. Apart from the chief FI, they only have 1 or 2yrs before they jumpship.
Part of the issue is about bothering. It's just a hobby and we have a few of those right? Not just one. Yeah I do like airports and et al .. I've had a total of 7 or 8 diff instructors. I went to Kapiti for a look lately. One of the guys works for CAA as well so that feels assuring at least. Masterton might just be a bit too far. Monorail might seem a bit too wild for me
I've asked the hospital to release my forms to myself and then see what CAA says.
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Dont
ray, before I got my A into G, my Dad once said to me when I was farting around, did I want to get to his age and look back at my life and regret not giving flying a good, honest try? The answer was of course no, and now as I fly professionally, I think I would have never had the satisfaction I have and I can't imagine the regret I would've had. My advice, get down to the local aero club, tell them what you want and get a good, solid, instructor. Its YOUR money, you tell them who you want.
Good luck mate, and enjoy it.
Good luck mate, and enjoy it.
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To those espousing the "I used to have a student like you" comments:
Has it occurred to you that many, many more of us have had instructors like you??? Arrogant little ****s that can fly a perfect circuit, but naff-all else. Regrettably, I can personally all-too-easily relate to rayonline_nz's experiences. Not that long ago, a brand-new CPL/Instructor that had some money purchased an aircraft type that I had not flown before. The day after his flight-test, the aircraft was delivered and as I was hanging around that day, I was asked to be SLF for the MAUW test. After the flight, I commented to the CFI that I may be interested in doing a rating in the aircraft in the future, to which the freshly-minted "sky-god" snapped "you won't be going near it until you've done a CPL!" It was with some little pleasure I was able to point out to him that I had held a CPL since before he was born. I still won't fly with him or in any aircraft in which he has an interest.
All too often I've seen instructors behave in the manner rayonline_nz relates. It's not good enough. When I have had similar experiences, I speak to their CFI about it and never fly with those people again. It's my money. If I'm not getting value for that money, I won't be back. No 2nd chances. I've learnt the hard way. Now it's only people I know & trust that I'll fly with, or someone recommended by one of them.
Has it occurred to you that many, many more of us have had instructors like you??? Arrogant little ****s that can fly a perfect circuit, but naff-all else. Regrettably, I can personally all-too-easily relate to rayonline_nz's experiences. Not that long ago, a brand-new CPL/Instructor that had some money purchased an aircraft type that I had not flown before. The day after his flight-test, the aircraft was delivered and as I was hanging around that day, I was asked to be SLF for the MAUW test. After the flight, I commented to the CFI that I may be interested in doing a rating in the aircraft in the future, to which the freshly-minted "sky-god" snapped "you won't be going near it until you've done a CPL!" It was with some little pleasure I was able to point out to him that I had held a CPL since before he was born. I still won't fly with him or in any aircraft in which he has an interest.
All too often I've seen instructors behave in the manner rayonline_nz relates. It's not good enough. When I have had similar experiences, I speak to their CFI about it and never fly with those people again. It's my money. If I'm not getting value for that money, I won't be back. No 2nd chances. I've learnt the hard way. Now it's only people I know & trust that I'll fly with, or someone recommended by one of them.
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The frustrating thing about that is that there are a few older guys around, like me, who would just like to instruct for the sheer joy of teaching someone how to fly. No agendas, no desire to build hours at the student's expense, nothing to prove.
However, if you try to do that, you find two problems: the aero clubs, who don't want to know you because you might take some hours away from their young instructors, hours which they were probably promised when doing their C cats; and the CAA, who make it way too difficult to get re-qualified.
And all the while, they bleat on about the lack of experience in the instructor ranks... ridiculous.
However, if you try to do that, you find two problems: the aero clubs, who don't want to know you because you might take some hours away from their young instructors, hours which they were probably promised when doing their C cats; and the CAA, who make it way too difficult to get re-qualified.
And all the while, they bleat on about the lack of experience in the instructor ranks... ridiculous.
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You're dead right Remoak.
After 40+ years in the game I too feel I would like to do a bit towards helping and encouraging others if I could.
I personally knew a student who was investing plenty for a particular type endorsement (turbine, helicopter) and I offered to help for free and incorporate some useful mountain flying (I've done a bit) in that time.
I found the local training school did not want me anywhere near their operation because they wanted to keep the hours for their instructors. I also suspect that the instructors like to have their students look up to them as experienced aviators. Having old farts like me around doesn't help their image.
I've lost all interest now NZCAA made it all too hard anyway. Unfortunately I think the "blind leading the blind" will continue in the instructing game as long as personal gains and agendas outweighs any concerns CAA have about the standards of instructing.
After 40+ years in the game I too feel I would like to do a bit towards helping and encouraging others if I could.
I personally knew a student who was investing plenty for a particular type endorsement (turbine, helicopter) and I offered to help for free and incorporate some useful mountain flying (I've done a bit) in that time.
I found the local training school did not want me anywhere near their operation because they wanted to keep the hours for their instructors. I also suspect that the instructors like to have their students look up to them as experienced aviators. Having old farts like me around doesn't help their image.
I've lost all interest now NZCAA made it all too hard anyway. Unfortunately I think the "blind leading the blind" will continue in the instructing game as long as personal gains and agendas outweighs any concerns CAA have about the standards of instructing.
Fortunately not all flying schools and aero clubs are not as Remoak & EBCAU describe. I know a few that do utilise the knowledge and skills of some "retreads".
All I can say is if you want to do it get stuck in and find an instructor you are happy with. 15 hours is a long time in the circuit though if you're doing it at NZWN I can see how the time can mount up without a lot of progress. I'm not sure about your situation but I've seen some students take longer than normal at this phase because they fly in fits and starts and don't really get any consistency.
Good luck.
All I can say is if you want to do it get stuck in and find an instructor you are happy with. 15 hours is a long time in the circuit though if you're doing it at NZWN I can see how the time can mount up without a lot of progress. I'm not sure about your situation but I've seen some students take longer than normal at this phase because they fly in fits and starts and don't really get any consistency.
Good luck.
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Yes I agree, there are some good places around where the instructors actually understand how to help their students, while avoiding the temptation to show off. You just have to search around. Not all schools are as I described.
The CAA is, though...
The CAA is, though...
